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Thread: Who's not paying any taxes?

  1. #13

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viva La Migra View Post
    Twenty-three percent seems kinda high for a national sales tax, don't you think? Ten percent should be plenty!
    Not really it is on just what you spend and you get a standard prebate every month to offset basic necessities. Also, no social security tax off the top.

    I will add more after lunch and class.
    Socrates: "Democracy, which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder, and dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequaled alike."

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  3. #14

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    If it is true what they say that the consumer accounts for 70% of GDP. Then it seems to me that in today’s society we have it up side down. After all, when all is said and done, the wealthy eventually derive their money from the working people and the products they produce and consume. If then that is the case, doesn’t it make since to reduce taxes on those not so affluent. Would that not increase GDP thus providing a benefit to all citizens. The wealthy would realize greater cash flow from increased spending that would offset their increased tax burden and the rest of us would realize an increased living standard.
    As an after thought to that, let us not forget that one of the excuses for the Bush tax cuts was that it would reduce the tendency of the rich to hide their income from the IRS. (Remember?) But as was reported by the IRS several weeks ago, some 100 billion dollars in taxes is hidden in overseas accounts. That’s money you and I have to come up with! (Thanks UBS)
    Never let your friends determine who your friends are going to be!.

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  5. #15

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Note to self: Appoint Camper65 to staff position in Department of Commerce.

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  7. #16

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by luv2read View Post
    Note to self: Appoint Camper65 to staff position in Department of Commerce.
    Not Commerce, no clout, we don't control any money. All we can do is write you a nice analysis that can easily be ignored or never published (we've been grumbling about taxing R&D and wages, and overseas tax breaks for a while now). Treasury is better, they have control over taxes.
    "All the prophets of Doom, Can always find room, In a world full of worry and fear..." - Protest Song, Monty Python

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  9. #17

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by camper65 View Post
    If it is true what they say that the consumer accounts for 70% of GDP. Then it seems to me that in today’s society we have it up side down. After all, when all is said and done, the wealthy eventually derive their money from the working people and the products they produce and consume. If then that is the case, doesn’t it make since to reduce taxes on those not so affluent. Would that not increase GDP thus providing a benefit to all citizens. The wealthy would realize greater cash flow from increased spending that would offset their increased tax burden and the rest of us would realize an increased living standard.
    As an after thought to that, let us not forget that one of the excuses for the Bush tax cuts was that it would reduce the tendency of the rich to hide their income from the IRS. (Remember?) But as was reported by the IRS several weeks ago, some 100 billion dollars in taxes is hidden in overseas accounts. That’s money you and I have to come up with! (Thanks UBS)
    That would be great, but you have to entice companies to keep their factories in the U.S. in order for citizens to have disposable income and hopefully some savings. The U.S. companies have to pay payroll tax for labor, cooperate tax on profits, and then individual income tax from their salaries. Why do that when you can move everything south and get cheaper labor? Or as a investor, invest in a company overseas to increase the return on my investment.

    AND, THIS IS THE BIG POINT!!! EMBEDDED TAX. Embedded tax is the hidden tax consumers pay for a finished product. If you reduce taxes for lower wage earners and raise the tax for corporations and higher wage earners, they will add that figure to the end cost of the finished product. You are paying the tax for them only it is called overhead now. You are not screwing them you're screwing yourself by forcing them to raise the price of the product.

    Just eliminate any kind of income, payroll, or cooperate tax and tax the finished "new" product only. If you want the nick knack so bad pay the FairTax.
    Socrates: "Democracy, which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder, and dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequaled alike."

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  11. #18

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by camper65 View Post
    .......But as was reported by the IRS several weeks ago, some 100 billion dollars in taxes is hidden in overseas accounts......
    Stop telling everyone where my money is!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by luv2read View Post
    Note to self: Appoint Camper65 to staff position in Department of Commerce.
    If he can keep his comments succinct and informative, he should also write your presidential speeches.
    THIS IS WHERE I WOULD PUT SOMETHING TO REPRESENT MY THINKING, BUT THEN THEY SHOW UP!
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  13. #19

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viva La Migra View Post
    Twenty-three percent seems kinda high for a national sales tax, don't you think? Ten percent should be plenty!
    Quote Originally Posted by Silverbird View Post
    Especially since you also get hit by local taxes. Maybe make it 15 percent Fed + whatever sales tax local state.
    On the surface the 23% number looks big, but you have to compare income and payroll tax versus FairTax on new goods purchased. You are being taxed big time before you even get your paycheck.

    Difference basically is a tax on total income verses tax on what you spend on "new" products. You get your entire gross income. Take home pay would be a thing of the past as it would ALL be take home pay.

    From FairTax.org http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServ...sics_thumbnail

    The FairTax strategy is revenue neutral: Neither raise nor lower taxes so consumer costs remain stable.
    The FairTax pays for all current government operations, including Social Security and Medicare. Government revenues are more stable and predictable than with the federal income tax because consumption is a more constant revenue base than is income.

    If you were in a 23-percent income tax bracket, the federal government would take $23 out of your paycheck for every $100 you made. With the FairTax, if the federal government gets $23 out of every $100 spent in America, the same total revenue is delivered to the federal government. This is revenue neutrality. So, instead of paycheck-earning Americans paying 7.65 percent of their paychecks in Social Security/Medicare payroll taxes, plus an average of 18 percent of their paychecks in federal income tax, for a total of about 25.65 percent, consumers in America pay only $23 out of every $100. Or about 30 percent at the cash register when they elect to spend on new goods or services for their own personal consumption. And this tax is collected only on spending above the federal poverty level, providing important progressivity.
    Socrates: "Democracy, which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder, and dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequaled alike."

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  15. #20

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Employee/Consumer: "I can't afford your prices, I've got to buy Nobrand Cheepo."

    U.S. Company: "I can't afford to keep you employed with these employee expenses. Especially health care benefits." Chop chop chop...

    Employee/Consumer: "I can't afford to work for you without health care benefits."

    U.S. Company: "I can't afford your payroll taxes and health care benefits if I want to lower prices. I'll just subcontract Nobrand Cheepo to make Mybrand. ByeBye."

    Employee/Consumer: "If I had a job I could afford your brand now.":toung:
    "All the prophets of Doom, Can always find room, In a world full of worry and fear..." - Protest Song, Monty Python

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  17. #21

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Silverbird,
    Don't for get pensions! Can't afford pensions, because of taxes. Fund your own retirement.
    Socrates: "Democracy, which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder, and dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequaled alike."

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  19. #22

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    Arrow Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Just remember smart wealthy people will alway find a place to make the maximum return on their investment even if they have to go overseas. It is a global market place. We need to make it more profitable for them invest here than abroad.


    Look a Buffet and Gates. They continue to look overseas when there is no good values in the at home.
    Socrates: "Democracy, which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder, and dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequaled alike."

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  21. #23

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Show-me View Post
    Silverbird,
    Don't for get pensions! Can't afford pensions, because of taxes. Fund your own retirement.
    And to keep the circle going:

    Employee/employer: "I would put money into your investment program, but you won't let me protect it!"
    THIS IS WHERE I WOULD PUT SOMETHING TO REPRESENT MY THINKING, BUT THEN THEY SHOW UP!
    Tracker =
    Check my position

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  23. #24

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    Default Re: Who's not paying any taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Frixxxx View Post
    And to keep the circle going:

    Employee/employer: "I would put money into your investment program, but you won't let me protect it!"
    Protected from what?
    Socrates: "Democracy, which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder, and dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequaled alike."

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