View Full Version : Oil and natural gas drilling in U.S. waters
tsptalk
03-31-2010, 12:19 AM
Sounds good to me. What's the catch? :suspicious: :cheesy:
Government set to unveil offshore drilling plan (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62T06520100330)
"(Reuters) - The Obama administration is expected to announce by Wednesday its updated plan for oil and natural gas drilling in U.S. waters, including whether to allow exploration for the first time along the U.S. East Coast."
More (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62T06520100330)
Sounds good to me. What's the catch? :suspicious: :cheesy:
Government set to unveil offshore drilling plan (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62T06520100330)
"(Reuters) - The Obama administration is expected to announce by Wednesday its updated plan for oil and natural gas drilling in U.S. waters, including whether to allow exploration for the first time along the U.S. East Coast."
More (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62T06520100330)
I seem to recall Teddy Kenedy didn't want wind turbines on the east coast becuase it would be an eye sore for him and his boating buddies living on the coast. This makes me chuckle a little :cheesy:
CountryBoy
03-31-2010, 06:07 AM
Sounds good to me. What's the catch? :suspicious: :cheesy:
Government set to unveil offshore drilling plan (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62T06520100330)
"(Reuters) - The Obama administration is expected to announce by Wednesday its updated plan for oil and natural gas drilling in U.S. waters, including whether to allow exploration for the first time along the U.S. East Coast."
More (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62T06520100330)
Yeah I thought the same thing. It sounds real good on the surface, but the devil may be in the details. He'll have to get the EPA to fall in line or will he default to the EPA's ruling. I'll wait and see. It would be a boom to our economy and decrease our dependance on foreign oil from our enemies.
tsptalk
03-31-2010, 08:54 AM
Flashback...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrA9zj94NuU
Buster
03-31-2010, 08:26 PM
The project will probABLY BE HELD UP IN COURTS FOR YEARS..ALL THE WHILE THE GREENIES ARE FIGHTING THIS PLAN...WE'LL STILL BE BUYING opec OIL..
IMO..This is the SINGLE most intelligent thing President Obama has done to-date for our Country.
..AP - Shaking up years of energy policy and his own environmental backers, President Barack Obama threw open a huge swath of East Coast waters and other protected areas in Alaska and the Gulf of Mexico to drilling Wednesday, widening the politically explosive hunt for more homegrown oil and gas (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100401/ap_on_bi_ge/us_obama_drilling)
Buster
03-31-2010, 09:13 PM
This is the kind of blown out of proportion BS like Global Warming hoax was, that will tug at the heart strings of the malinformed..
His support for exploratory drilling in the Chukchi and Beaufort seas north of Alaska, for example, drew outrage from the Center for Biological Diversity as a threat to polar bears. "Short of sending Sarah Palin back to Alaska to personally club polar bears to death, the Obama administration could not have come up with a more efficient extinction plan for the polar bear," said Brendan Cummings, the center's senior counsel.
..What a crock of bear scat.
Frixxxx
04-01-2010, 08:26 AM
I can't believe the flip-flop on his campaign promises....
There should be a list on this one....Nother thread, sorry!:mad:
Drilling? He campaigned for the environmentalists and no drilling....
Wow, here in California, they're interviewing all the tree huggers and they're like, "No way, Not Here, Even if it is the president!":laugh:
Hahaha, They're really trying hard here in California not to try to call for his head yet!:cool:
Nordic
04-13-2010, 06:57 AM
"The agency said in its monthly Oil Market Report that world oil demand would reach an average of 86.60 million bpd this year, up from 84.93 million in 2009."
http://news.moneycentral.msn.com/provider/providerarticle.aspx?feed=OBR&date=20100413&id=11403510
Will be interesting to see how this affects the markets...similar to 2008? :suspicious:
Silverbird
04-13-2010, 10:05 AM
Shrug. Virginia has been rallying for this (at least for natural gas drilling) for a long time, through both Republican and Democratic administrations. There is evidence of large natural gas deposits off of the Virginia/Delmarva coast. And if you don't want to *see* it, it can be put offshore far enough that you have to go out in a boat to see it.
Alaska has the problem that much of its untapped coastline is in national wilderness or national parkland. Giving away national owned land at little cost turned into a fun punching bag issue for the last Administration. Why get involved? It's not like there aren't places in Alaska already available to tap oil/gas out there, it's just hard to get to. Alaska is NOT running out of available places to tap.
California, yesterday's leader in enviromental issues, site of the biggest (or at least long term consequences) oil spill mess is not going to be interested in oil drilling so why offer it?
Sounds like a pragmatic solution to me...
James48843
04-28-2010, 09:24 PM
Since we haven't yet started a unique thread for the major oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico- I think this is probably a good time and place to hijack the thread from Oil and Gas in US Waters in General- to a specific thread to capture some of the Gulf Oil Spill that is growing.
A really good source of hard data and photos/maps is over at the NOAA website.
Here's a map that outlines what we're dealing with so far:
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And this summary from NOAA yesterday:
Deepwater Horizon Incident, Gulf of Mexico http://response.restoration.noaa.gov/art_gallery/1465_overflightApr27-icon.jpg Mississippi Canyon 252 Overflight
taken 4/26/2010 at 11:26 am Updated each evening
Situation: Tuesday 27 April
Responders were again unsuccessful in using Remotely Operated Vehicles (ROVs) to trigger the blowout preventer (BOP), a series of valves that sits at the well head. Additional options are still being developed to trigger the BOP. The Unified Command is also considering using controlled burning to control oil floating on the surface.
Construction has begun on a collection dome that will be deployed to the sea floor to collect and funnel oil as it escapes from the well, a method that has never been tried this deep before. The first rig to be used for drilling a relief or cut-off well arrived last night, several more are planned – a relief well would take several months to complete.
Current NOAA efforts are focused on: gathering more information about the spill, planning for containment, and readying for environmental assessment and response. Natural resource damage assessment (NRDA) activities are now underway.
Edge of area with visible oil is now 21 miles from the nearest point of land- SW Pass at the tip of the Mississippi River Delta.
Weather forecast to be favorable (5-10 kts from the north) on Wednesday for in situ burning, dispersant application, and skimming operations. This wind will take the floating oil offshore.
Winds are forecast to become strong (20+ kts) and blow from the southeast on Thursday, which will tend to push surface oil towards shore.
The latest NOAA oil-spill trajectory analyses do not indicate oil coming to shore over the next 72 hours. However protective booms (or floating barriers) are being deployed in sensitive areas. The effects of oil on sensitive habitats and shorelines in four states (LA, MS, AL, and FL) are being evaluated should oil from the incident make landfall in appreciable quantities
NOAA’s Assessment and Restoration Division (ARD) brought together more than 20 Federal and State natural resource trustees today to discuss natural resource damage assessment efforts
ARD is evaluating concerns about potential injuries of oil and dispersants to fishes, human use of fisheries, marine mammals, turtles, and sensitive resources
Media Inquiries NOAA media inquiries, please contact: Keeley Belva at keeley.belva@noaa.gov or 301.713.3066.
For response inquiries, please contact: Joint Information Center (JIC) at 985.902.5231 or 985.902.5240.
Background
The incident involves a deepwater drilling platform approximately 50 miles southeast of Venice, Louisiana. An explosion and subsequent fire damaged the rig, which capsized and sank on April 22, after burning for hours. It is unclear how much of the estimated 700,000 gallons (approximately 16,700 barrels) of #2 fuel onboard burned before it sank. The rig is owned by Transocean and under contract to BP. More Information about this Incident
IncidentNews: Deepwater Horizon (http://www.incidentnews.gov/incident/8220) View the most up-to-date information on OR&R's IncidentNews site. [leaves OR&R site]
The Louisiana Regional Restoration Planning Program (http://losco.state.la.us/LOSCOuploads/Newsflash/FRRP_Region2.pdf) Federal and Louisiana natural resource trustees have developed a statewide Louisiana Regional Restoration Planning Program to assist the natural resource trustees in carrying out their Natural Resource Damage Assessment (NRDA) responsibilities. [leaves OR&R site]
Visual Resources
Links to photo and video galleries related to this incident on other Web sites.
USCG Deepwater Horizon Response Visual Information Gallery (http://cgvi.uscg.mil/media/main.php?g2_itemId=841811) Photos and video of the Deepwater Horizon response, provided by the U.S. Coast Guard. [leaves OR&R site]
NOAA Deepwater Horizon Footage (http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/media/NOAA_DeepwaterHZ_Broll.mov) A direct link to a large Quicktime format video file hosted on the National Ocean Service website. [leaves OR&R site]
Timecode Slates for NOAA Deepwater Horizon Footage (http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/media/NOAA_Deepwater_Horizon_Slate.doc) Required accessibility companion document describing images in the NOAA Deepwater Horizon Footage. Microsoft Word format. [leaves OR&R site]
Imagery from NASA Earth Observatory (http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/NaturalHazards/event.php?id=43733) Images of the affected area, captured on April 25, by the Moderate Resolution Imaging Spectroradiometer (MODIS) on NASA's Aqua satellite, and the Advanced Land Imager on NASA’s Earth Observing-1 (EO-1) satellite. [leaves OR&R site]
Downloads
Deepwater Horizon Trajectory Map (http://response.restoration.noaa.gov/book_shelf/1882_cumulative2.pdf) Cumulative for 22 April through 26 April 2010, including forecast for 27 April. Based on trajectories and overflight information.
(Image format: PDF, size: 260.1 K)
James48843
04-28-2010, 09:33 PM
Today's update:
Situation – Wednesday 28 April – Workers finished fabricating the containment chamber portion of the collection dome that will be deployed to the sea floor to collect oil as it escapes from the well. Work will now begin on the piping system that brings the oil to the surface for collection; this method has never been tried at this depth before. The first rig to be used for drilling a relief or cut-off well is on site and should begin drilling approximately ½ a mile from the well head on Friday. The relief well will not be complete for several months.
Responders are still figuring out new ways to use Remotely Operated Vehicles (ROVs) to try to trigger the blowout preventer (BOP), a series of valves that sits at the well head. These efforts will continue concurrent with the collection dome and relief well(s). Good weather today allowed for both skimming operations and aggressive aerial application of dispersants - over 50,000 gallons of dispersant have been applied to the surface oil in the last two days. Patches of surface oil were captured with fire-retardant boom and ignited (in situ burn).
Current NOAA efforts are focused on: gathering more information about the spill, planning for open water and shoreline remediation, and readying for environmental assessment and response. Natural resource damage assessment (NRDA) activities are now underway.
§ Winds are forecast to become strong (20+ kts) and blow from the southeast starting tomorrow and continuing through the weekend, which will continue to push surface oil towards shore
§ NOAA oil-spill trajectory analyses indicate that oil continues to move towards shore.
§ 100,000’ of oil-containment booms (or floating barriers) have been deployed as a precaution to protect sensitive areas in the Louisiana area.
§ The effects of oil on sensitive habitats and shorelines in four states (LA, MS, AL, and FL) are being evaluated should oil from the incident make landfall in appreciable quantities
§ NOAA’s Assessment and Restoration Division is evaluating concerns about potential injuries of oil and dispersants to fishes, human use of fisheries, marine mammals, turtles, and sensitive resources
§ Baseline aerial surveys to assess marine life were conducted today with personnel from NOAA’s National Marine Fisheries Service (NMFS), these will continue as needed
James48843
04-28-2010, 09:35 PM
If they don't get those valves closed- we're talking about 42,000 gallons a day continuing to flow into the Gulf of Mexico FOR SEVERAL MONTHS AT LEAST, while they try and drill a relief well to reduce the pressure of the oil flowing out. Understand that even AFTER they get a relief well in place, it could take MONTHS MORE before the pressure is reduced, and the flow of oil out of the existing well slows.
Folks- we are talking really, really, really big spill into the Gulf of Mexico here.
Bad, bad stuff.
IF they can't get those valves shut off in the next couple of days, I seriously think we are going to be looking at the real potential of becoming worst oil spill in the history of drilling- Making the Exxon Valdez pale in comparison.
James48843
04-29-2010, 05:54 AM
Latest articles say it isn't leaking 42,000 gallons a day. It's leaking five times that amount- 210,000 gallons a day.
And guess what? It doesn't have the acoustic shutoff switch that some oil rigs have. Turns out that after the EPA proposed mandating acoustic shutoff switches in 2000 (Bill Clinton's EPA), the EPA withdrew the proposed requirement. (Bush's EPA.)
Surprise, surprise, surprise.
Here's the article:
Leaking Oil Well Lacked Safeguard Device
The oil well spewing crude into the Gulf of Mexico didn't have a remote-control shut-off switch used in two other major oil-producing nations as last-resort protection against underwater spills.
The lack of the device, called an acoustic switch, could amplify concerns over the environmental impact of offshore drilling after the explosion and sinking of the Deepwater Horizon rig last week.
The accident has led to one of the largest ever oil spills in U.S. water and the loss of 11 lives. On Wednesday federal investigators said the disaster is now releasing 5,000 barrels of oil a day into the Gulf, up from original estimates of 1,000 barrels a day.
U.S. regulators don't mandate use of the remote-control device on offshore rigs, and the Deepwater Horizon, hired by oil giant BP PLC, didn't have one. With the remote control, a crew can attempt to trigger an underwater valve that shuts down the well even if the oil rig itself is damaged or evacuated.
The efficacy of the devices is unclear. Major offshore oil-well blowouts are rare, and it remained unclear Wednesday evening whether acoustic switches have ever been put to the test in a real-world accident. When wells do surge out of control, the primary shut-off systems almost always work. Remote control systems such as the acoustic switch, which have been tested in simulations, are intended as a last resort.
More: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704423504575212031417936798.html?m od=WSJ_World_LEFTSecondNews
Silverbird
04-29-2010, 12:23 PM
Arrgh! It's BP again, I tell you. Those guys are sloppy.:mad:
Viva_La_Migra
04-29-2010, 12:26 PM
Latest articles say it isn't leaking 42,000 gallons a day. It's leaking five times that amount- 210,000 gallons a day.
And guess what? It doesn't have the acoustic shutoff switch that some oil rigs have. Turns out that after the EPA proposed mandating acoustic shutoff switches in 2000 (Bill Clinton's EPA), the EPA withdrew the proposed requirement. (Bush's EPA.)
Surprise, surprise, surprise.
Here's the article:
Leaking Oil Well Lacked Safeguard Device
The oil well spewing crude into the Gulf of Mexico didn't have a remote-control shut-off switch used in two other major oil-producing nations as last-resort protection against underwater spills.
The lack of the device, called an acoustic switch, could amplify concerns over the environmental impact of offshore drilling after the explosion and sinking of the Deepwater Horizon rig last week.
The accident has led to one of the largest ever oil spills in U.S. water and the loss of 11 lives. On Wednesday federal investigators said the disaster is now releasing 5,000 barrels of oil a day into the Gulf, up from original estimates of 1,000 barrels a day.
U.S. regulators don't mandate use of the remote-control device on offshore rigs, and the Deepwater Horizon, hired by oil giant BP PLC, didn't have one. With the remote control, a crew can attempt to trigger an underwater valve that shuts down the well even if the oil rig itself is damaged or evacuated.
The efficacy of the devices is unclear. Major offshore oil-well blowouts are rare, and it remained unclear Wednesday evening whether acoustic switches have ever been put to the test in a real-world accident. When wells do surge out of control, the primary shut-off systems almost always work. Remote control systems such as the acoustic switch, which have been tested in simulations, are intended as a last resort.
More: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704423504575212031417936798.html?m od=WSJ_World_LEFTSecondNews
Guess we should go back to horse and buggy.
Steadygain
04-29-2010, 12:43 PM
Latest articles say it isn't leaking 42,000 gallons a day. It's leaking five times that amount- 210,000 gallons a day.
As soon as I heard about the leak -- I thought 42,000 ???
It's bound to be a down played ~ unrealistic number ~ wholly meant to curve the inevitable panic and anguish...
I guess all we can do is pray for the people on the Gulf Coast. Whoever was respondsible (if any person or group of people were) doesn't really make any difference. The damage is too extensive and involves too much -- and I deeply dread the outcome of when it fills the marshlands and shores.
alevin
04-29-2010, 01:02 PM
they've been talking about burning it off, but have put that idea on hold apparently.
Silverbird
04-29-2010, 02:20 PM
Do we get this much mess if we drill just for natural gas?
Steadygain
04-29-2010, 02:43 PM
Do we get this much mess if we drill just for natural gas?
It depends on where we're drilling.
A natural gas leak on Saturn would be a hundred times worse than oil in the Gulf.
Hmmm drilling for natural gas ... could potientially spark the worse earthquate in history.
If we went to certain neighborhoods in LA, NY, Baltimore ... yes it would be way worse.....
Buster
04-29-2010, 03:01 PM
Until ALL the Nay Sayers to oil and gas production are ALL driving Flintstone cars built out of cardboard and Elmer’s glue and doing all your cooking on wood and do all your computing on either a Chinese abacus and or a piece of black slate with calcium carbonate chalk and communicate long distances with a couple of soup cans and a length of cotton string...don't complain about OIL production and how we get it.
Because without oil..this is what you'll be doing.;)
XL-entLady
04-29-2010, 04:19 PM
Until ALL the Nay Sayers to oil and gas production are ALL driving Flintstone cars built out of cardboard and Elmer’s glue and doing all your cooking on wood and do all your computing on either a Chinese abacus and or a piece of black slate with calcium carbonate chalk and communicate long distances with a couple of soup cans and a length of cotton string...don't complain about OIL production and how we get it.
Because without oil..this is what you'll be doing.;)
You know we aren't going to do that, my short-timer buddy. But I think we can all agree that there are more environmentally safe methods and less environmentally safe methods of production. Or maybe we can't.
Silverbird
04-29-2010, 04:28 PM
They just need to punt BP really hard, BP did NOT follow the safety laws. This isn't the first time with BP either.
And I don't think we will be drilling for natural gas in the middle of a city, Steady. ;P I was attempting to ask a serious question?
alevin
04-29-2010, 04:35 PM
Hmm. BP rented the rig, didn't belong to them. Bush EPA said the rig outfits didn't need to equip rigs with the remote shutoffs. Was that BP's fault, or was it the lease cost of the rig was just too good to pass up? How many other companies are leasing rigs that lack the remote shutoff, I wonder?
Silverbird
04-29-2010, 09:32 PM
Oil slick just a few miles from Louisiana coast:(
[BP gets the cleanup bill]
"....The well is now leaking from three points, BP said. Under the 1990 oil pollution act, passed in the wake of the Exxon Valdez oil spill in Alaska, the company [BP] is required to foot the bill for the cleanup...."
[But Alevin, you're right about the rig's ownership/operations - looks like there is going to be some finger pointing]
"...BP Group's CEO, Tony Hayward, has cast blame on rig operator Transocean Ltd. for the disaster.
Hayward told CNN that the well's blowout preventer -- which he called the "ultimate fail-safe mechanism" -- has failed to shut down the well as designed...."
http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/04/29/louisiana.oil.rig/index.html?hpt=T1
James48843
04-29-2010, 09:54 PM
Blame game. I don't like that.
At this point it really doesn't matter on the blame game.
What matters is finding a way to stop the oil pumping out of the sea floor.
This one is going to be the worst ecological disaster in my lifetime.
It is as bad as it gets- and it will be all over the news for the next six months- that bad.
James48843
04-29-2010, 10:02 PM
Here is the map they are putting out tonight- showing the forecast for where the oil slick will be tomorrow:
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Now- picture this-
This is where the oil slick will be tomorrow. That's from one weeks' worth of oil spilling out.
Now picture what it's going to be....when they are not able to stop the flow from this --- until next January.
Think about how the entire Gulf of Mexico- from one side to the other, is going to be covered in oil.
From Mexico- up to Houston, to New Orleans, all the way over to the Florida Keys. Covered in a layer of oil slick on the beach. The Island of Cuba- beaches destroyed. The Keys- destroyed.
That folks- is what is in store, unless they can find a way to stop it.
James48843
04-30-2010, 05:51 AM
Gag-inducing' fuel smell wafting over New Orleans area
Thu Apr 29, 6:43 pm ET
And so it begins.
Forecasters had predicted that the massive oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico — five times worse than originally thought (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/news/ynews/ts_ynews/storytext/ynews_ts1872/35988793/*http://news.yahoo.com/s/ynews/20100429/ts_ynews/ynews_ts1851) — wouldn't reach the Louisiana coast until Friday. But 20 mph winds have pushed the petroleum slick inland much faster than anticipated and, though CNN reports that as of Thursday afternoon the oil mass is still "three of four miles" from the mouth of the Mississippi River, residents of New Orleans are already under an olfactory assault (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/ynews/ts_ynews/storytext/ynews_ts1872/35988793/SIG=12k6a7l2f/*http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2010/04/fuel_smell_wafts_over_new_orle.html) that may be caused by the spill.
The Times-Picayune (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/ynews/ts_ynews/storytext/ynews_ts1872/35988793/SIG=12k6a7l2f/*http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2010/04/fuel_smell_wafts_over_new_orle.html) reports that the city has been overwhelmed by a "pungent smell" and that, though they can't confirm the odor's source, officials believe the spill is the most likely culprit.
"We're still trying to confirm that," Deano Bonano, the Orleans Parish emergency-preparedness director, told the paper. "Whatever it is, it's coming from south of us, and we have to assume it's the oil spill." Bonano added that he's received calls reporting the odor from all parts of the area.
The White House announced today (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/ynews/ts_ynews/storytext/ynews_ts1872/35988793/SIG=11vmu6422/*http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/30/us/30gulf.html?nl=&emc=aua1) that it was taking a more active role in trying to contain the burgeoning ecological disaster. At a briefing, Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano labeled the accident "a spill of national significance." Governor Bobby Jindal also declared a state of emergency (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/ynews/ts_ynews/storytext/ynews_ts1872/35988793/SIG=12tq3f96j/*http://www.wwltv.com/news/local/Jindal-declares-State-of-Emergency-over-spill-92430299.html) in Louisiana.
Meanwhile, New Orleans residents are understandably annoyed over their city being enveloped by the smell of fuel. Mandie Landry, an attorney who works in the city's Central Business District, told Yahoo! News that "it smells like it'd smell if a bus was in front of you blowing out exhaust fumes right in your face." Another local resident, Tulane University employee Laura Mogg, told us that she caught wind of the "terrible" and "gag-inducing" smell from her office building on the school's sprawling uptown campus. "I smelled it the second I opened the door," she said. "Really, it's that strong."
jimijr
04-30-2010, 06:54 AM
James, I'm pretty sure you are over-reacting. At 5000 bbl/d it will take months before the Exxon Valdez is reached. The gulf is very much larger than Pr William sound.
There are thousands of natural oil seeps in the gulf putting out untold quantities. We sound RPV's down and find colonies of tube worms, crabs, shrimp, etc., living off the stuff. It will evaporate or age, no problem. You'll see.
alevin
04-30-2010, 08:17 AM
Umm, no, Jimi. That's only true up to a point. Bio-breakdown requires oxygenation, but there comes a point where the process stalls out.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/01/100117150822.htm
Silverbird
04-30-2010, 08:25 AM
Good luck getting insurance for your offshore rig now, even if the offshore drilling legislation passes. :sick:
James48843
04-30-2010, 11:03 PM
From: http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/28/too-busy-for-oil-awards/
http://www.treehugger.com/burning-oil-rig-explosion-fire-photo11.jpg
Scratch the awards luncheon for offshore drilling safety.
The Interior Department’s Minerals Management Service, responsible for overseeing oil drilling on public land and offshore, was scheduled to present its annual award for exemplary safety and environmental management by offshore oil industry operators next week.
BP, the oil company that contracted with the rig operator of the well that blew in the Gulf of Mexico last week, leaving three men injured and 11 missing and presumed dead, was one of the finalists in the big company category.
The award was to have been presented at the Offshore Technology Conference in Houston on May 3.
“The ongoing situation with the Transocean Deepwater Horizon drilling accident has caused the M.M.S. to dedicate considerable resources to the successful resolution of this event, which will conflict with holding this ceremony next week,” the agency said in a statement on Wednesday.
“The M.M.S. will announce how the agency will proceed with the 2010 SAFE Award program during the next several weeks. The M.M.S. apologizes for any inconvenience and thanks the organizers of the O.T.C.. for their understanding of our current situation.”
James48843
04-30-2010, 11:09 PM
James, I'm pretty sure you are over-reacting. At 5000 bbl/d it will take months before the Exxon Valdez is reached. The gulf is very much larger than Pr William sound.
There are thousands of natural oil seeps in the gulf putting out untold quantities. We sound RPV's down and find colonies of tube worms, crabs, shrimp, etc., living off the stuff. It will evaporate or age, no problem. You'll see.
Estimates to stop the oil flow are ranging now from 3 to 12 months to get a pressure relief well fully in place, and take the pressure off the well head that is leaking. It might take twice that long to fully stop the flow of oil from that well.
Even if they can stop it in three months (which is very unlikely), the size of the slick is going to be HUGE, and will taint the shores all the way from Mexico, around Texas, up through Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, and down the Florida coast as well. Your Key West is likely to get wiped out, although it will probably be at least a month before your Islands are hit.
We'll see.
And no, I don't think I am over-reacting on this one. This one is the mother-of-all screw-ups, and is going to be devastating for a thousand miles of coastline or more.
Buster
04-30-2010, 11:21 PM
Good luck getting insurance for your offshore rig now, even if the offshore drilling legislation passes. :sick:
No problem..Obama and company will have universal National Oil rig insurance plan...And the oil company's rigs that can afford quality Rig insurance, will get theirs free of charge..No pre-existing conditions will be turned down...Rig owners will be able to insure the workers up to age 26.
James48843
04-30-2010, 11:22 PM
Map of where the oil slick is this evening, from NOAA.
9211
Map of forecast Wind Direction for Saturday afternoon, evening.
Notice the wind will be out of the southeast, at 15 to 20 knots.
Oil booms won't stop anything in wind like that.
9212
It could not be a worse direction for New Orleans, and Mobile.
Both are likely to feel the full effect of oil coming ashore by Sunday.
Buster
04-30-2010, 11:25 PM
Estimates to stop the oil flow are ranging now from 3 to 12 months to get a pressure relief well fully in place, and take the pressure off the well head that is leaking. It make take twice that long to fully stop the flow of oil from that well.
Even if they can stop it in three months (which is very unlikely), the size of the slick is going to be HUGE, and will taint the shores all the way from Mexico, around Texas, up through Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, and down the Florida coast as well. Your Key West is likely to get wiped out, although it will probably be at least a month before your Islands are hit.
We'll see.
And no, I don't think I am over-reacting on this one.
I think you are....I agree it's doozie of a mess....But,
I think you think you know more than you really do..Key West?...com-mon...can you say Exaggerated?:rolleyes:
James48843
04-30-2010, 11:41 PM
Document: BP didn't plan for major oil spill
By CAIN BURDEAU and HOLBROOK MOHR, Associated Press Writers Cain Burdeau And Holbrook Mohr, Associated Press Writers 1 hr 36 mins ago
MOUTH OF THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER – British Petroleum once downplayed the possibility of a catastrophic accident at an offshore rig that exploded, causing the worst U.S. oil spill in decades along the Gulf Coast and endangering shoreline habitat.
In its 2009 exploration plan and environmental impact analysis for the well, BP suggested it was unlikely, or virtually impossible, for an accident to occur that would lead to a giant crude oil spill and serious damage to beaches, fish and mammals.
At least 1.6 million gallons of oil have spilled so far since the April 20 explosion that killed 11 workers, according to Coast Guard estimates. One expert said Friday that the volume of oil leaking from the well nearly 5,000 feet below the surface could actually be much higher, and that even more may escape if the drilling equipment continues to erode.
"The sort of occurrence that we've seen on the Deepwater Horizon is clearly unprecedented," BP spokesman David Nicholas told The Associated Press on Friday. "It's something that we have not experienced before ... a blowout at this depth."
Amid increased fingerpointing Friday, efforts sputtered to hold back the giant oil spill seeping into Louisiana's rich fishing grounds and nesting areas, while the government desperately cast about for new ideas for dealing with the growing environmental crisis. President Barack Obama halted any new offshore drilling projects unless rigs have new safeguards to prevent another disaster.
The seas were too rough and the winds too strong to burn off the oil, suck it up effectively with skimmer vessels, or hold it in check with the miles of orange and yellow inflatable booms strung along the coast.
The floating barriers broke loose in the choppy water, and waves sent oily water lapping over them.
"It just can't take the wave action," said Billy Nungesser, president of Louisiana's Plaquemines Parish.
The spill — a slick more than 130 miles long and 70 miles wide — threatens hundreds of species of wildlife, including birds, dolphins and the fish, shrimp, oysters and crabs that make the Gulf Coast one of the nation's most abundant sources of seafood. Louisiana closed some fishing grounds and oyster beds because of the risk of oil contamination.
BP's 52-page exploration plan for the Deepwater Horizon well, filed with the federal Minerals Management Service, says repeatedly that it was "unlikely that an accidental surface or subsurface oil spill would occur from the proposed activities."
And while the company conceded that a spill would impact beaches, wildlife refuges and wilderness areas, it argued that "due to the distance to shore (48 miles) and the response capabilities that would be implemented, no significant adverse impacts are expected."
Robert Wiygul, an Ocean Springs, Miss.-based environmental lawyer and board member for the Gulf Restoration Network, said he doesn't see anything in the document that suggests BP addressed the kind of technology needed to control a spill at that depth of water.
"The point is, if you're going to be drilling in 5,000 feet of water for oil, you should have the ability to control what you're doing," he said.
Although the cause of the explosion was under investigation, many of the more than two dozen lawsuits filed in the wake of the explosion claim it was caused when workers for oil services contractor Halliburton Inc. improperly capped the well — a process known as cementing. Halliburton denied it.
According to a 2007 study by the federal Minerals Management Service, which examined the 39 rig blowouts in the Gulf of Mexico between 1992 and 2006, cementing was a contributing factor in 18 of the incidents. In all the cases, gas seepage occurred during or after cementing of the well casing, the MMS said.
While the amount of oil in the gulf already threatened to make it the worst U.S. oil disaster since the Exxon Valdez spill in Alaska in 1989, one expert emphasized that it was impossible to know just how much oil had already escaped and that it could be much more than what BP and the Coast Guard have said.
Even at current estimates, the spill could surpass that of the Valdez — which leaked 11 million gallons — in just two months.
Ian R. MacDonald, an oceanography professor at Florida State University, said estimates from both Coast Guard charts and satellite images indicate that 8 million to 9 million gallons had spilled by April 28.
"I hope I'm wrong. I hope there's less oil out there than that. But that's what I get when I apply the numbers," he said.
Coast Guard Admiral Mary Landry brushed off such estimates that suggested the rate of the leak was five times larger than official estimates.
"I would caution you not to get fixated on an estimate of how much is out there," Landry said. "The most important thing is from Day One we stood corralling resources from a worst-case scenario working back."
More: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100501/ap_on_bi_ge/us_louisiana_oil_rig_explosion
James48843
04-30-2010, 11:54 PM
I think you are....I agree it's doozie of a mess....But,
I think you think you know more than you really do..Key West?...com-mon...can you say Exaggerated?:rolleyes:
Buster- here are the facts.
We don't know exactly how much is leaking, but in just seven days we have a major slick that is 130 MILES by 70 MILES large. I've marked it's approximate location in red.
9213
They are saying now it will be a minimum of three months, and most likely much longer, before they are able to stop the flow. I HOPE they can do it sooner. But I don't think so. We'll see.
If it continues to gush out, then the oil in the current will go where the currents flow. That's to the east in the northern Gulf of Mexico, and then down the Florida coast. It is very likely that there will be lots of oil still floating on the water as the currents and wind take them. Eventually, that will be right down to Key West.
No question in my mind that IF the oil flow continues at the present rate, Key West wlll be hit too. Everything from Mexico, up and around back to Key West, is likely to be touched over the rest of the year. Think slick, but then also think blobs of oil as pieces break off. It doesn't have to be the main slick itself- it could be a chunk of slick, balls of oil, ribbons of crude floating down to Key West. Yep- it's going to be ugly. Very, very ugly. For years.
You can quote me on that.
I don't know WHEN, I just know that it will. It will all depend on winds, and currents.
Show-me
05-01-2010, 06:43 AM
I'm for drilling, but this is bad, very, very, very bad. :mad: They have to pay hard for this, they should have had preventive devises in place that actually worked. Worst problem is the cost will be passed on to the consumer for the clean up, but that IS the free market and they will over come. I just hope they pull out all the stops to save the ecosystem.
James48843
05-01-2010, 08:03 AM
Priorities right now:
1. Do everything they can think of to stop the flow.
2. Evaluate what OTHER oil rigs might be equipped like, and work to put safeguards on THOSE rigs, so that this cannot happen elsewhere.
3. Clean up beaches for years.
The EPA doesn't know how to fix this one. They are asking the public for help with ideas on what to do. If you have an invention that can help, they are looking for ideas:
http://www.epa.gov/bpspill/techsolution.html
James48843
05-01-2010, 08:55 AM
Whistleblower comes forward about BP issues:
"...The whistleblower, whose name has been withheld at the person's request because the whistleblower still works in the oil industry and fears retaliation, first raised concerns about safety issues related to BP Atlantis, the world's largest and deepest semi-submersible oil and natural gas platform, located about 200 miles south of New Orleans, in November 2008. Atlantis, which began production in October 2007, has the capacity to produce about 8.4 million gallons of oil and 180 million cubic feet of natural gas per day.
It was then that the whistleblower, who was hired to oversee the company's databases that housed documents related to its Atlantis project, discovered that the drilling platform had been operating without a majority of the engineer-approved documents it needed to run safely, leaving the platform vulnerable to a catastrophic disaster that would far surpass the massive oil spill that began last week following a deadly explosion on a BP-operated drilling rig.
BP's own internal communications show that company officials were made aware of the issue and feared that the document shortfalls related to Atlantis "could lead to catastrophic operator error" and must be addressed.
More:
http://www.truthout.org/whistlelower-bps-other-offshore-drilling-project-gulf-vulnerable-catastrophe59027
looks really, really bad for BP today.
Buster
05-01-2010, 12:19 PM
Buster- here are the facts.
9213
What did you use to put those pretty colors and arrows on that map?..Paint? I can do the same thing showing the oil slick will end up in the Ohio Valley:rolleyes:...again Jim..I'm not bashing your interpretation..but you are over reacting to the issue and trying to support more the cause for Ethanoil...
nnuut
05-01-2010, 12:46 PM
Enormous Oil Seepage in the Gulf of Mexico (http://www.theadvertiser.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070618/BUSINESS01/706180310/1046/BUSINESS)
June 20, 2007 |
Oil enters the marine environment from human activity and natural seeps. A National Academy of Science study recently estimated that about 47 percent of the oil entering the marine environment is a result of natural seepage from subsurface reservoirs. The Gulf of Mexico is an area where such natural seepage occurs at a very high rate. Of the 200,000 metric tons of oil seepage that is thought to occur each year, about 150,000 metric tons escapes from the floor of the Gulf of Mexico.
http://geology.com/news/2007/enormous-oil-seepage-in-the-gulf-of-mexico.shtml
nnuut
05-01-2010, 12:48 PM
Is this adding insult to injury?:sick:
Natural Oil Seeps in the Gulf of Mexico
A NASA Earth Observatory news release from February 3, 2009
Although accidents and hurricane damage to infrastructure are often to blame for oil spills and the resulting pollution in coastal Gulf of Mexico waters, natural seepage from the ocean floor introduces a significant amount of oil to ocean environments as well. Oil spills are notoriously difficult to identify in natural-color (photo-like) satellite images, especially in the open ocean. Because the ocean surface is already so dark blue in these images, the additional darkening or slight color change that results from a spill is usually imperceptible.
http://geology.com/nasa/oil-seeps/gulf-of-mexico-oil-seeps.jpg Satellite image of natural oil seeps in the Gulf of Mexico by Jesse Allen, NASA. See zoomed-in below.
http://geology.com/nasa/oil-seeps/oil-slicks.jpg Satellite image of natural oil seeps in the Gulf of Mexico. Jesse Allen, NASA. See above for reference.
Remote-sensing scientists recently demonstrated that these “invisible” oil slicks do show up in photo-like images if you look in the right place: the sunglint region. This pair of images includes a wide-area view of the Gulf of Mexico from the Moderate Resolution Imaging Spectroradiometer (MODIS) on NASA’s Terra satellite on May 13, 2006 (top), and a close up (bottom) of dozens of natural crude oil seeps over deep water in the central Gulf.
The washed-out swath running through the scene is where the Sun is glinting off the ocean’s surface. If the ocean were as smooth as a mirror, a sequence of nearly perfect reflections of the Sun, each with a width between 6-9 kilometers, would appear in that line, along the track of the satellite’s orbit. Because the ocean is never perfectly smooth or calm, however, the Sun’s reflection gets blurred as the light is scattered in all directions by waves. The slicks become visible not because they change the color of the ocean, but because they dampen the surface waves. The smoothing of the waves can make the oil-covered parts of the sunglint area more or less reflective than surrounding waters, depending on the direction from which you view them.
The usual technique for mapping oil slicks from space uses radar, which bounces pulses of radio waves off the wave-roughened surface of the water and detects the amount of backscattered energy. The downside of using space-based radars to map oil slicks is that they don’t provide routine coverage of large areas, and oil slicks may evaporate or disperse significantly within a day. The researchers suggest that tracking oil slicks in the wide sunglint region of daily Terra and Aqua MODIS images may be a better avenue for comprehensive, near-real-time monitoring of large oil spills and natural seeps in marine ecosystems.
Satellite images prepared by Jesse Allen of NASA using data obtained from the Goddard Level 1 and Atmospheric Archive and Distribution System. Captions by Rebecca Lindsey of NASA. http://geology.com/nasa/oil-seeps/
James48843
05-01-2010, 01:04 PM
What did you use to put those pretty colors and arrows on that map?..Paint? I can do the same thing showing the oil slick will end up in the Ohio Valley:rolleyes:...again Jim..I'm not bashing your interpretation..but you are over reacting to the issue and trying to support more the cause for Ethanol...
Ok Buster- here is my source for wind and current data in real time:
http://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/station_retrieve.shtml?type=Current+Data
Go take a look at the real time data off the wind sensing bouys in Mobile Bay, Fort Morgan, and Gulfport, Mississippi.
That's where I get those cute little arrows showing which way the wind is blowing...
And if you want to see seasonal average for ocean currents in the Gulf of Mexico, please, by all means, browse around here:
http://oceancurrents.rsmas.miami.edu/atlantic/florida.html
Where you will find real, historical ocean current maps like this one:
Notice how warm waters flow NORTH between Cuba and the Yacatan Peninsula of Mexico. Then the water moves down the coast of Florida, and out towards the Gulfstream current on the other side of Florida. Yes, it's a west to east flow, NEAR KEY WEST, as the water makes it's way out of the Gulf of Mexico.
9218
Now, do you have any REAL data showing potential for the oil slick to end up in the Ohio Valley?
No?
I thought not.
Wake up Buster. This one is going to be incredibly, incredibly bad disaster. The oil isn't going to stop gushing out of that well for months and months and months. It's bad. Real bad. No, I'm not exagerating. Yes, it will eventually hit Key West. If not an entire slick, then at least ribbons of oil, and balls of tar, and all kind of yukky things. It's going to foul hundreds, if not thousands, of miles of beaches and coastlines before it's done.
And it has nothing to do with ethanol.
It has everything to do with OIL, large corporations, saving a few bucks, cutting corners, and the resulting disaster that follows from insufficient government regulation.
Over-reacting? I think not. We'll see. Time will tell.
Warrenlm
05-01-2010, 01:21 PM
I'm glad we've been saving up for the huge cost coming. At least we have been avoiding adding costs to the nation's bills.
I'm wondering if BP has protected mother companies by corporate structure so that basically the insurers and the EPA Superfund are the only payers.
James48843
05-01-2010, 01:24 PM
Enormous Oil Seepage in the Gulf of Mexico (http://www.theadvertiser.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070618/BUSINESS01/706180310/1046/BUSINESS)
June 20, 2007 |
Oil enters the marine environment from human activity and natural seeps. A National Academy of Science study recently estimated that about 47 percent of the oil entering the marine environment is a result of natural seepage from subsurface reservoirs. The Gulf of Mexico is an area where such natural seepage occurs at a very high rate. Of the 200,000 metric tons of oil seepage that is thought to occur each year, about 150,000 metric tons escapes from the floor of the Gulf of Mexico.
http://geology.com/news/2007/enormous-oil-seepage-in-the-gulf-of-mexico.shtml
Relationship of size: They call this "enormous".
150,000 metric tons is about 1 million barrels of oil for the whole year, for the whole Gulf of Mexico.
This one well is spewing somewhere around 800 to 1,000 metric tons every day.
If it's 1,000 metric tons a day, this spill would be at a rate of 365,000 metric tons a year- more than DOUBLE what the entire rest of the Gulf of Mexico seeps through natural processes.
burrocrat
05-01-2010, 01:33 PM
yeah what Warrenlm said.
what's the investing ploy to profit from this? have you ever tried to mop emulsified oil off of rock or beachs? try doing it in a stinky wetland full of snakes and bayou critters.
huge costs will be expended to try to mitigate this disaster, it won't be stopped soon so may as well profit from the newly created demand. this is sad, and going to get worse.
beyond the immediate priority of minimizing this incident, what do we do?
drill baby drill, or walk baby walk? or we coud just continue to pay through the nose at the pump and the irs window and get it from far away where someone else's habitat is at risk and we don't have to think about it so much.
it don't make sense to point fingers here, we all use petroleum to one extent or the other. so it's all our responsibility. once we make that leap then everyone should help pay for it, get ready for a raft of federal expenditures while a compartmentalized subsidiary of BP goes bankrupt.
coolhand
05-01-2010, 01:48 PM
I pulled this off a blog...:worried:
The Oil Mess
12 days into the oil rig 'accident' events continue to evolve and weather is slowing down efforts to contain things, we have two interesting items to report that are not in the MSM yet...OK, three then.
1. While there are many reports on the 'net that the rig disaster was an attack by a North Korean mini-sub, and other such fanciful things, we have heard that a supply ship arrived just before the explosions and it was reported to be 'manned by all new people, nobody aboard was from the 'usual supply crew'. This purported industry source continues: there were a total of 14 explosions and these could have been cutting charges. Moreover, the shut off valve below the surface (5000 feet down) on the seabed is not longer controllable. Still, lots of disinfo and speculation scampering around the netosphere. While this is bad, it gets worse.
2. A reader who is an engineer of considerable experience says watch this one evolve carefully because it is destined to continue to grow and he shares this long (but worthy explanation why:
"Heard your mention of the oil disaster in the Gulf of Mexico this morning, and you (and most everyone else except maybe George Noory) are totally missing the boat on how big and bad of a disaster this is.
First fact, the original estimate was about 5,000 gallons of oil a day spilling into the ocean. Now they're saying 200,000 gallons a day. That's over a million gallons of crude oil a week!
I'm engineer with 25 years of experience. I've worked on some big projects with big machines. Maybe that's why this mess is so clear to me.
First, the BP platform was drilling for what they call deep oil. They go out where the ocean is about 5,000 feet deep and drill another 30,000 feet into the crust of the earth. This it right on the edge of what human technology can do. Well, this time they hit a pocket of oil at such high pressure that it burst all of their safety valves all the way up to the drilling rig and then caused the rig to explode and sink. Take a moment to grasp the import of that. The pressure behind this oil is so high that it destroyed the maximum effort of human science to contain it.
When the rig sank it flipped over and landed on top of the drill hole some 5,000 feet under the ocean.
Now they've got a hole in the ocean floor, 5,000 feet down with a wrecked oil drilling rig sitting on top of is spewing 200,000 barrels of oil a day into the ocean. Take a moment and consider that, will you!
First they have to get the oil rig off the hole to get at it in order to try to cap it. Do you know the level of effort it will take to move that wrecked oil rig, sitting under 5,000 feet of water? That operation alone would take years and hundreds of millions to accomplish. Then, how do you cap that hole in the muddy ocean floor? There just is no way. No way.
The only piece of human technology that might address this is a nuclear bomb. I'm not kidding. If they put a nuke down there in the right spot it might seal up the hole. Nothing short of that will work.
If we can't cap that hole that oil is going to destroy the oceans of the world. It only takes one quart of motor oil to make 250,000 gallons of ocean water toxic to wildlife. Are you starting to get the magnitude of this?
We're so used to our politicians creating false crises to forward their criminal agendas that we aren't recognizing that we're staring straight into possibly the greatest disaster mankind will ever see. Imagine what happens if that oil keeps flowing until it destroys all life in the oceans of this planet. Who knows how big of a reservoir of oil is down there.
Not to mention that the oceans are critical to maintaining the proper oxygen level in the atmosphere for human life.
We're humped. Unless God steps in and fixes this. No human can. You can be sure of that.
James48843
05-01-2010, 01:55 PM
Yeh.
What He said.
James48843
05-01-2010, 01:57 PM
P.S.- Might be a good time to move to the "G" fund. When the world economies understand (which they don't yet) what this oil slick is going to do- I am thinking it will not be good for stocks in general....
By the way- have the closed the oil terminals off Gulfport MS yet? Shortages of gasoline ahead, if they can't keep the oil flowing in from tankers.
nnuut
05-01-2010, 02:06 PM
It was GREENPEACE!!:worried::laugh:
coolhand
05-01-2010, 02:06 PM
P.S.- Might be a good time to move to the "G" fund. When the world economies understand (which they don't yet) what this oil slick is going to do- I am thinking it will not be good for stocks in general....
By the way- have the closed the oil terminals off Gulfport MS yet? Shortages of gasoline ahead, if they can't keep the oil flowing in from tankers.
I had not been paying particularly close to attention to this disaster until the last couple of days. This looks to be a real game changer if it's as bad as some think. I must say though, my retirement account won't mean much to me if that engineer is on target with his assessment.
CountryBoy
05-01-2010, 02:25 PM
Depending on how much panic or how big a crisis this turns into, a lotta folks are going to be laid off, because the oil industry and all the peripheral jobs is the major occupation along the entire Gulf Coast, except for Florida. This doesn't even account for all the oil that is shipped all the way to the Great Lake States and the Northeast.
If they begin shutting down terminals, that is a big indication that drilling is totally shutting down also. No oil, no need for refineries. This could make the Jimmy Carter oil embargo days look like a walk in the park.
This could be the crisis that Rahm was looking/wishing for.
coolhand
05-01-2010, 02:26 PM
http://blog.al.com/live/2010/04/gulf_mexico_oil_spill_worst_case.html
Buster
05-01-2010, 05:05 PM
Depending on how much panic or how big a crisis this turns into, a lotta folks are going to be laid off, because the oil industry and all the peripheral jobs is the major occupation along the entire Gulf Coast, except for Florida. This doesn't even account for all the oil that is shipped all the way to the Great Lake States and the Northeast.
If they begin shutting down terminals, that is a big indication that drilling is totally shutting down also. No oil, no need for refineries. This could make the Jimmy Carter oil embargo days look like a walk in the park.
This could be the crisis that Rahm was looking/wishing for.
As I stated before, it is a monster of a mess..really saddens me to know how much the wildlife is gonna suffer too, along with the people that depend on the oil industry and fishing industry there..Very sad indeed...But we must fix it and move on and try to improve offshore drilling safety and NOT stop it. I can only imagine OPEC is sitting around their Gold and Ivory palaces smiling ear to ear right now..
As I've been seeing, BP is really to blame for not following safety guide lines..just like that A-Hole mine owner in WV...they should pay dearly and hopefully not be allowed to pass the costs to the consumer of oil based products.
Buster
05-01-2010, 05:18 PM
Now, do you have any REAL data showing potential for the oil slick to end up in the Ohio Valley?
No?
I thought not.
Wake up Buster. This one is going to be incredibly, incredibly bad disaster. The oil isn't going to stop gushing out of that well for months and months and months. It's bad. Real bad. No, I'm not exagerating. Yes, it will eventually hit Key West. If not an entire slick, then at least ribbons of oil, and balls of tar, and all kind of yukky things. It's going to foul hundreds, if not thousands, of miles of beaches and coastlines before it's done.
And it has nothing to do with ethanol.
It has everything to do with OIL, large corporations, saving a few bucks, cutting corners, and the resulting disaster that follows from insufficient government regulation.
Over-reacting? I think not. We'll see. Time will tell.
No Jim..You wake up..people on this board are seeing you again in your own little crisis world again..We know from all your rantings in the past about OIL and the crown jewel in your battle headgear for Ethanoil...We are wiser than you give the MB credit for..
You are over reacting and I will mark this post and re-post it for you when this is all under control....Make a bet with you (Remember, you lost the $5.00/ gallon bet too)..But if the Oil reaches KEY WEST and slicks up the beaches like you want us to think..I will LEAVE this TSPTALK MB and never come back...If you however are wrong about your shade-tree meteorological forecast that the OIL will Cover the Beaches of KEY WEST, then YOU LEAVE US, forever!!..Put up, or shut up....Well is it a deal?
XL-entLady
05-01-2010, 05:31 PM
No Jim..You wake up..people on this board are seeing you again in your own little crisis world again..We know from all your rantings in the past about OIL and the crown jewel in your battle headgear for Ethanoil...We are wiser than you give the MB credit for..
You are over reacting and I will mark this post and re-post it for you when this is all under control....Make a bet with you (Remember, you lost the $5.00/ gallon bet too)..But if the Oil reaches KEY WEST and slicks up the beaches like you want us to think..I will LEAVE this TSPTALK MB and never come back...If you however are wrong about your shade-tree meteorological forecast that the OIL will Cover the Beaches of KEY WEST, then YOU LEAVE US, forever!!..Put up, or shut up....Well is it a deal?
Now THAT is a lose-lose deal if I've ever heard one!!! :worried:
XL-entLady
05-01-2010, 05:36 PM
As oil spill nears Gulf Coast, experts issue dire warnings
May 1, 2010 5:56 p.m. EDT
"As Gulf Coast residents braced Saturday for the arrival of a massive oil slick creeping toward shore, one environmentalist warned that the effects of the spill could resonate in the region for decades...
"This has the potential of being truly devastating," Tom McKenzie, of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, said Saturday."
http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/05/01/louisiana.oil.spill/index.html
coolhand
05-01-2010, 05:37 PM
NOAA Web Update April 30, 2010
DEEPWATER HORIZON Incident
Situation – Friday 30 April – NOAA Administrator Jane Lubchenco spoke with fishermen in Venice, Louisiana today as the Deepwater Horizon incident grows.
Also visiting the spill were Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano, Secretary of Interior Ken Salazar, Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, Admiral Mike Mullen, EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson, Rear Admiral Mary Landry, Deputy Secretary of Interior David Hayes and Assistant to the President for Energy and Climate Carol Browner. The Department of Defense authorized mobilization of the Louisiana National Guard to help protect critical habitats from contamination and assist local communities in the cleanup and removal of oil.
Oil continues to flow into the Gulf of Mexico at an estimated to 5000 barrels (210,000 gallons) per day from three leaks in damaged piping on the sea floor from the Deepwater Horizon incident recently declared a Spill of National Significance (SONS). NOAA is assisting the Unified Command in evaluating a new technique to apply dispersants to oil at the source - 5000’ below the surface, if successful this could keep plumes and sheens from forming. Work also continues on a piping system designed to take oil from a collection dome at the sea floor to tankers on the surface; this technique has never been tried at 5000’. Drilling of a relief or cut-off well is still planned - one drilling rig is on site and one should arrive this weekend, but the process will not be complete for several months. Aircraft have applied over 139,000 gallons of dispersant and will continue as conditions allow.
With shore impacts looming, more than 217,000 feet of boom have been assigned to contain the spill, with an additional 305,760 feet available. The Louisiana Department of Wildlife and Fisheries announced the closure of both recreational and commercial fishing in areas of likely impact and the Louisiana Department of Health and Hospitals closed molluscan shellfish (oyster) harvesting areas in the coastal parishes of Plaquemines and St. Bernard.
NOAA efforts have included: modeling the trajectory and extent of the oil, getting pre-impact samples surveys and baseline measurements, planning for open water and shoreline remediation, supporting the Unified Command as it analyzes new techniques for handling the spill and starting Natural Resource Damage Assessments (NRDA).
National Weather Service forecasts persistent southeast winds through the weekend which will push surface oil towards shore and hamper surface recovery efforts until a forecast shift on Monday
The Coast Guard is using forecasts and graphics of oil movement prepared by NOAA’s Emergency Response Division (ERD) and Marine Charting Division to keep mariners out of oil areas by depicting them on electronic charts
Baseline aerial surveys to assess marine life continued today with personnel from NOAA’s National Marine Fisheries Service (NMFS), more flights are planned this weekend
NOAA’s Assessment and Restoration Division (ARD) coordinated with natural resource trustees from five states and with Responsible Party representatives on seven resource assessment workgroups (birds, mammals and turtles, fish, shoreline habitats, water column injury, data management, and human use)
NOAA and the Louisiana Department of Health and Human Hospitals gathered oysters and water and sediment samples in four commercial harvest areas
An ARD natural resource economist arrives on scene tomorrow to lead a team that will evaluate spill related losses of human-use activities
BP is asking fishermen for their assistance in cleaning up the oil spill. BP is calling this the Vessel of Opportunities Program and through it, BP is looking to contract shrimp boats, oyster boats and other vessels for hire to deploy boom in the Gulf of Mexico. Fishermen should call 425-745-8017 about this program.
NOAA Roles: NOAA is a vital part of the massive response effort on the Deepwater Horizon incident. Many personnel are on scene and many more are engaged remotely, as follows:
Office of Response and Restoration (OR&R)
Scientific support to the U.S. Coast Guard and Unified Command
Emergency Response Division (ERD)
Predict where the oil is going and its effects
Overflight observations and mapping
Identify resources at risk
Predict fate (chemical changes) of oil
Recommend appropriate clean-up methods
Manage data and information
Assessment and Restoration Division (ARD)
Plan for assessment of injuries to natural resources
Coordinate with state and federal trustees
Implement sampling plans
National Weather Service
Incident weather forecasts including marine and aviation
National Environmental Satellite, Data, and Information Service (NESDIS)
Experimental imagery for spill trajectory forecasts
National Marine Fisheries Service (NMFS)
Issues related to marine mammals, sea turtles, and fishery resources
National Ocean Service
Public Affairs support to Joint Information Center
Buster
05-01-2010, 06:00 PM
Now THAT is a lose-lose deal if I've ever heard one!!! :worried:This town ain't big enough for the two of us..:D
James48843
05-01-2010, 06:44 PM
Oil slick may choke shipping along Gulf Coast
Sat May 1, 2010 1:08am IST
Shipping traffic in key U.S. Gulf of Mexico channels has been little affected by a giant oil spill in the region, but concerns mounted on Friday that the spill may soon choke off shipping arteries.
The Gulf of Mexico and Gulf Coast region is home to key transit routes for crude oil, refined products such as gasoline and diesel, and grains. The Mississippi River Delta includes key shipping lanes linking sea and land.
Crude from the spill, which began from a BP-operated oil field in the offshore Gulf last week after a drilling rig exploded and sank 50 miles south of the Louisiana shoreline, made landfall in the state on Friday.
Several forecasters warned the spill could affect Mississippi, Alabama and northwest Florida in coming days.
Depending on weather patterns, they said, the slick could also move westward, nearer to the country's top oil refining zone and its only offshore oil port.
Around a fourth of U.S. oil production and 15 percent of the country's natural gas production comes from offshore in the Gulf of Mexico. No production is currently affected by the oil spill, according to the U.S. Minerals Management Service, which said Friday it was in regular contact with all producers in the region.
U.S. investment bank Goldman Sachs warned its clients Friday that the slick may affect oil tanker traffic in the region starting Friday, likely cutting crude imports to the world's top consuming nation.
Goldman said the shipping lanes around the Louisiana Offshore Oil Port, which handles between 1 million and 1.5 million barrels a day of crude imports, could be affected.
LOOP, which is located off the Mississippi Delta area and west of the area affected by the spill for now, is connected by pipeline to the Gulf Coast, site of around half of U.S. refining capacity.
LOOP continued to operate normally following the spill, and did not expect any immediate impact from the oil slick.
"The heavy oil is a ways away from us. We don't expect an impact. We're operating normally, and we don't expect our offloading to be affected any time soon," LOOP's Barb Hestermann told Reuters on Friday.
U.S. refiners have yet to experience any supply disruptions, although the U.S. Coast Guard has recommended that seagoing vessels avoid the area of the oil slick, which has grown to around 100 miles wide, potentially impeding tanker traffic in days to come.
An industry source said Friday that at least one major port in the Gulf Coast region was not allowing ships that have transited through oil slick areas to dock until they have been inspected.
The State of Alabama Port Authority said on Thursday that shipping traffic could be significantly delayed in the region if ships are made to navigate through oil slick, since they would require cleaning.
Valero Energy Corp, a top U.S. refiner, said on Friday there has been no problem getting deliveries to its Gulf Coast refineries. "We're watching the situation closely," said Bill Day, Valero's spokesman. Exxon Mobil Corp, whose Gulf Coast refineries include Baytown, the nation's largest refinery at 572,000 barrels per day, also said the slick had not had any impact on its refineries in the region.
For a list of oil infrastructure in the Gulf of Mexico region, click:
GRAIN TRANSPORT UNIMPEDED
No restrictions have been imposed on vessels into the Mississippi River, a key channel for grain transport, according the U.S. Coast Guard, but grain traders were closely monitoring developments.
"There are no current shipping restrictions in place but we are encouraging all mariners to monitor Channel 16 for any that may come on line in the future," said Petty Officer David Mosley of the U.S. Coast Guard.
Shipments via the Southwest Pass, the main grain shipping lane into the Mississippi River, were proceeding normally early on Friday, grain traders said.
More: http://in.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idINTRE63T4SS20100430?sp=true
CountryBoy
05-02-2010, 05:37 AM
Oil end up in the Ohio Valley? :laugh: What an idiot, water runs downhill. Check your physics. I've spent the last 25 years following the flow of the inland waterway system. But being a know it all, I'm sure you're right and. :rolleyes:
Talk about trying to build this into a panic. It'll be bad enough along the Gulf without lying about it going up river all the way to the Ohio Valley. I;ll keep an ryr out for it. :laugh:
burrocrat
05-02-2010, 08:30 AM
anyone got some good website references to stay current on the gulf spill situations?
i've been to NOAA and see their projections i can put two and two together from there, but i'm looking for something more than shallow news stories that are more editorial content and human interest pieces than fact.
i'm looking for info on the physical conditions on the sea floor, the engineering challenges, the logistics of the massive effort. what is it going to take to gain a measure of control on this thing and slow it down a bit?
alevin
05-02-2010, 09:05 AM
I sometimes get more details from UK newspapers than from our own. Here's a couple things I learned today....
If it is taken by the Gulf’s defining current, which is known as the Loop, the oil may also reach the Florida Keys and endanger the region’s coral and resident marine populations.
The type of oil leaking from the sea floor is complicating matters. It is called sweet crude, which contains heavy compounds, known as asphaltenes, that do not burn easily or evaporate, even on the warm Louisiana coast.
With light crude, both burning and chemical dispersants work well, but neither tactic is very effective against sweet crude, raising fears that nothing can be done to stop the oil reaching shore.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article7112465.ece
coolhand
05-02-2010, 09:39 AM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8656627.stm
Latest news with video of Louisiana Gov.
James48843
05-02-2010, 10:50 AM
anyone got some good website references to stay current on the gulf spill situations?
i've been to NOAA and see their projections i can put two and two together from there, but i'm looking for something more than shallow news stories that are more editorial content and human interest pieces than fact.
i'm looking for info on the physical conditions on the sea floor, the engineering challenges, the logistics of the massive effort. what is it going to take to gain a measure of control on this thing and slow it down a bit?
The best data right now is coming from the NOAA site, and also the Joint Response website here:
http://www.deepwaterhorizonresponse.com/go/site/2931/
The EPA is doing air monitoring as well, and air monitoring results are here:
http://www.epa.gov/bpspill/
Note that multiple government agencies are reacting and the joint website is probably as good of info you are going to be able to get for a while.
BP has nothing on their website, other than a press release saying they plan to help pay for it, and a redirect to the government web site.
Hayward added: "BP is fully committed to taking all possible steps to contain the spread of the oil spill. We are taking full responsibility for the spill and we will clean it up, and where people can present legitimate claims for damages we will honour them."
http://www.bp.com/bodycopyarticle.do?categoryId=1&contentId=7052055
Oh, and that BP page also has a note that BP reports oil profits were 135% higher in the first quarter of 2010. That release came out Wednesday last week.
nnuut
05-02-2010, 11:04 AM
Who blew up the Oil Rig?:nuts:
James48843
05-02-2010, 11:11 AM
Wall Street Journal a few minutes ago:
Interior Secretary Salazar: US Gulf Oil Spill May Be Worse Than Valdez
WASHINGTON (Dow Jones)--The BP PLC (BP) oil spill in the U.S. Gulf of Mexico may be worse that the 1989 ExxonMobil Corp. (XOM) Valdez spill in Alaska, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar said on CNN Sunday.
"The worst-case scenario is we could have 100,000 barrels or more of oil flowing out," Salazar said on CNN's "State of the Union."
BP and the U.S. government have over the past week stuck to their raised estimate of 5,000 barrels a day spilling out of the deepwater well.
But Homeland Security chief Janet Napolitano said on ABC News that the current spill rate could currently be much higher.
"Right now that could be in the tens of thousands of gallons per day, of barrels per day," she said.
Coast Guard Admiral Thad Allen said their worst fear is that the well could leak at 100,000 barrels a day, if the well head breaks. Industry experts say that the well pipe appears to be crimped, curbing the potential leak rate.
Friday, industry experts said based on satellite images and standard measuring indexes, they estimate the spill rate at 20,000 barrels a day to 25,000 barrels a day. If those rates are accurate, the spill could already rival the 11-million gallon Valdez slick that economically and environmentally devastated part of Alaska.
Allen said three leaks have now been found at the well.
Asked if the 25,000 barrel a day figures were accurate, head of BP America, Lamar McKay, said on ABC that their own estimates were "very, very uncertain."
Salazar said that he believed BP could stop the leak, but he fears that it may take 90 days to do that. BP is placing a new rig over the leak and will soon attempt to use drilling tools to close the leak.
If the 25,000 barrel-a-day estimate is accurate and the leak lasts for 90 days, that's 2.25 million barrels, or 94.5 million gallons.
Besides hitting sensitive wetlands, marshlands, bird migration stops, and other wildlife, the leak is threatening major fishing and spawning areas in the Gulf. Coastal towns from Louisiana to Florida are also concerned that their beaches will be covered in oil tar, hurting their tourism industries.
Source: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20100502-702751.html?mod=WSJ_latestheadlines
If it's 25,000 barrels a day, that five times the estimates that were being used last week, which were five times the estimates being talked about the first week.
It's a bad, bad leak.
nnuut
05-02-2010, 11:16 AM
Who blew up the Oil Rig?:nuts:
coolhand
05-02-2010, 12:32 PM
http://blog.skytruth.org/2010/05/gulf-oil-spill-new-spill-rate.htm
Dr. Ian MacDonald at FSU just produced a new spill-size estimate based on the US Coast Guard aerial overflight map of the oil slick on April 28, 2010. The bottom line: that map implies that on April 28, there was a total of 8.9 million gallons floating on the surface of the Gulf.
That implies a minimum average flow rate of slightly more than 1 million gallons of oil (26,000 barrels) per day from the leaking well on the seafloor. Since we're now in Day 11 of the spill, which began with a blowout and explosion on April 20, we estimate that by the end of the today 12.2 million gallons of oil, at a minimum, have been spilled into the Gulf of Mexico.
The oft-quoted official estimate for the Exxon Valdez spill is 11 million gallons, although some think that is the lower limit of the likely range. It appears that we've just set a very sad new record.
coolhand
05-02-2010, 12:38 PM
http://www7320.nrlssc.navy.mil/global_nlom32/navo/IASSP1_nlomw129forc.gif
Good animated representation of the gulfstream. Should the oil drift to the East, you can see where it will be jetted up the East coast of Florida, not to mention the West and South sides. If this takes a long time to cap (which seems likely at this point) it's just a matter of time before we export sweet crude around the world.
James48843
05-02-2010, 12:41 PM
New sat photo from yesterday:
9228
James48843
05-02-2010, 12:43 PM
Don't worry Coolhand.
Buster promised us it would never make it to Key West.;)
Nice animation there Coolhand. Great find.
Yep-- that's "the loop" would could take it down the west coast of Florida, past Key West, and then up the other side of Florida. With tar balls and gunk for a long, long time.
Let's all hope they can find a way to choke it off soon.
James48843
05-02-2010, 12:45 PM
Who blew up the Oil Rig?:nuts:
I'm waiting for the conspiracy theorists to say the President did it.....
coolhand
05-02-2010, 01:18 PM
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704608104575218274064234934.html?m od=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsSecond
nnuut
05-02-2010, 01:23 PM
I'm waiting for the conspiracy theorists to say the President did it.....
Yer right, there everywhere but some sites are blocked?:confused:
SO Who blew up the Louisana Oil Rig?
A grim report circulating in the Kremlin today written by Russia’s Northern Fleet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Northern_Fleet) is reporting that the United States has ordered a complete media blackout over North Korea’s torpedoing of the giant Deepwater Horizon oil platform owned by the World’s largest offshore drilling contractor Transocean (http://www.deepwater.com/fw/main/Home-1.html) that was built and financed by South Korea’s Hyundai Heavy Industries Co. Ltd (http://english.hhi.co.kr/)., that has caused great loss of life, untold billions in economic damage to the South Korean economy, and an environmental catastrophe to the United States.
Most important to understand about this latest attack by North Korea against its South Korean enemy is that under the existing “laws of war” (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_of_war) it was a permissible action as they remain in a state of war against each other due to South Korea’s refusal to sign (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War#Stalemate_.28July_1951_.E2.80.93_July_1 953.29) the 1953 Armistice ending the Korean War (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War).
To the attack itself, these reports continue, the North Korean “cargo vessel” Dai Hong Dan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dai_Hong_Dan) believed to be staffed by 17th Sniper Corps “suicide” troops (http://alfin2100.blogspot.com/2010/04/north-koreas-secret-weapon-against.html) left Cuba’s Empresa Terminales Mambisas de La Habana (Port of Havana (http://portofhavana.com/)) on April 18th whereupon it “severely deviated” from its intended course for Venezuela’s Puerto Cabello (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto_Cabello) bringing it to within 209 kilometers (130 miles) of the Deepwater Horizon oil platform which was located 80 kilometers (50 miles) off the coast of the US State of Louisiana where it launched an SSC Sang-o Class Mini Submarine (http://virtualglobetrotting.com/map/north-korean-mini-sub-ssc-sang-o-class-in-drydock/) (Yugo class (http://www.hazegray.org/worldnav/asiapac/n_korea.htm)) estimated to have an operational range of 321 kilometers (200 miles).
On the night of April 20th the North Korean Mini Submarine manned by these “suicidal” 17th Sniper Corps soldiers attacked the Deepwater Horizon with what are believed to be 2 incendiary torpedoes causing a massive explosion (http://montgomery.injuryboard.com/workplace-injuries/transoceans-massive-oil-rig-sinks-in-the-gulf-of-mexico.aspx?googleid=280608) and resulting in 11 workers on this giant oil rig being killed outright. Barely 48 hours later, on April 22nd , this North Korean Mini Submarine committed its final atrocity by exploding itself directly beneath the Deepwater Horizon causing this $1 Billion oil rig to sink beneath the seas and marking 2010’s celebration of Earth Day (http://www.earthday.org/earthday2010) with one of the largest environmental catastrophes our World has ever seen. [more]
http://www.snooperreport.com/snooper-report/2010/5/1/so-who-blew-up-the-louisiana-oil-rig-nuke-north-korea.html
nnuut
05-02-2010, 01:39 PM
http://www.eutimes.net/2010/05/us-orders-blackout-over-north-korean-torpedoing-of-gulf-of-mexico-oil-rig/
James48843
05-02-2010, 02:00 PM
http://www.eutimes.net/2010/05/us-orders-blackout-over-north-korean-torpedoing-of-gulf-of-mexico-oil-rig/
FYI-
I got a spyware warning from my anti-virus program on that one.
Caution-
James48843
05-02-2010, 02:59 PM
FYI- It appears "Eutimes.net" is owned by a neo-nazi guy out of South Carolina, and routed through an anonymous server located in Toronto, Canada.
grandma
05-02-2010, 03:32 PM
FYI-
I got a spyware warning from my anti-virus program on that one.
Caution-
I had to manually shut down my computer because I couldn't get the pop-up to shut up & let me get out.....
And my pop-up-stopper was in effect, shining its bright orange lights at me..
"do you want.... "
nnuut
05-02-2010, 03:38 PM
FYI-
I got a spyware warning from my anti-virus program on that one.
Caution-
It was a popup program that scans your computer for spyware, you know the deal it says you have problems than wants your to buy the program. Disk cleanup will get rid of the cookies and temp files, sorry about that!! I hate those programs.:suspicious::embarrest:
nnuut
05-02-2010, 03:41 PM
I had to manually shut down my computer because I couldn't get the pop-up to shut up & let me get out.....
And my pop-up-stopper was in effect, shining its bright orange lights at me..
"do you want.... "
Close Internet Explorer and clean temp files and Cookies. If it won't close hit Ctrl-Alt-Del and open Task Manager go to Programs and close Internet Explorer and clean.:sick:
James48843
05-02-2010, 04:05 PM
Oh Nnuuttt...
better watch those websites!!!
Luckily, I'm clean.
Webroot Anti-virus (http://www.webroot.com/En_US/index.html) has been very, very good to me. :-)
nnuut
05-02-2010, 04:18 PM
Oh Nnuuttt...
better watch those websites!!!
Luckily, I'm clean.
Webroot Anti-virus (http://www.webroot.com/En_US/index.html) has been very, very good to me. :-)
My PopUp blocker got it and I didn't notice, when I read your post I went back to the site after turning off my blocker and let it do it's thing. No biggie, Symantec found nothing on my computer. It's the way it is in the Jungle!!:cool:
coolhand
05-02-2010, 05:36 PM
Good web site to check on updates. And it's not infected! :nuts:
http://www.incidentnews.gov/incident/8220
grandma
05-02-2010, 06:53 PM
Close Internet Explorer and clean temp files and Cookies. If it won't close hit Ctrl-Alt-Del and open Task Manager go to Programs and close Internet Explorer and clean.:sick:
The Ctrl-atl-del wouldn't come on At All, so I just shut the thing off.
Then did the cleaning, etc, when came back on.
I've been using Mozilla Firefox for several weeks now; my IE has a problem; I just haven't taken the time to call Dell & get them to work on it. I still have a couple of months before my one year warranty runs out...
I'd like to shuck the whole computer thing - I'm addicted...........:o
PessOptimist
05-02-2010, 07:23 PM
Well, Nnuut beat me to it but I still thought you guys would love this. I received it unattributed from a totally unreliable source. Apparently the North Koreans blew up the oil rig. This is a part of what I got which seems to be that same thing Nnuut posted.
To the attack itself, these reports continue, the North Korean "cargo vessel" Dai Hong Dan believed to be staffed by 17th Sniper Corps "suicide" troops left Cuba's Empresa Terminales Mambisas de La Habana (Port of Havana) on April 18th whereupon it "severely deviated" from its intended course for Venezuela's Puerto Cabello bringing it to within 209 kilometers (130 miles) of the Deepwater Horizon oil platform which was located 80 kilometers (50 miles) off the coast of the US State of Louisiana where it launched an SSC Sang-o Class Mini Submarine (Yugo class) estimated to have an operational range of 321 kilometers (200 miles).
Now you guys run with this one, I'm gonna go get a beer and some snacks. Oh, I bet Chavez had a hand in it too.;)
nnuut
05-02-2010, 07:49 PM
The Ctrl-atl-del wouldn't come on At All, so I just shut the thing off.
Then did the cleaning, etc, when came back on.
I've been using Mozilla Firefox for several weeks now; my IE has a problem; I just haven't taken the time to call Dell & get them to work on it. I still have a couple of months before my one year warranty runs out...
I'd like to shuck the whole computer thing - I'm addicted...........:o
Computers are wonderful things, I've been fighting them sense 1983, sometimes I win!!:laugh: 9230
nnuut
05-02-2010, 07:52 PM
Well, Nnuut beat me to it but I still thought you guys would love this. I received it unattributed from a totally unreliable source. Apparently the North Koreans blew up the oil rig. This is a part of what I got which seems to be that same thing Nnuut posted.
Now you guys run with this one, I'm gonna go get a beer and some snacks. Oh, I bet Chavez had a hand in it too.;)
That's it PO, it's amazing how this stuff pops up when something happens. There's another that blame it on the Environmental GREENIES, but you never know? When they float that thing and the explosives came from the outside that would make the news.;)
James48843
05-03-2010, 02:26 AM
'The following is not public' document states
http://media.al.com/live/photo/plumejpg-5e73159717b16990_medium.jpgView full size (http://media.al.com/live/photo/plumejpg-5e73159717b16990.jpg)
(AP Photo/U.S. Coast Guard)This image provided by the U.S. Coast Guard Saturday April 24, 2010, shows oil leaking from the drill pipe of the Deepwater Horizon drilling rig after it sank. A confidential government report on the unfolding spill disaster makes clear the Coast Guard now fears the well could be on the verge of becoming an unchecked gusher shooting millions of gallons of oil per day into the Gulf.
A confidential government report on the unfolding spill disaster in the Gulf makes clear the Coast Guard now fears the well could become an unchecked gusher shooting millions of gallons of oil per day into the Gulf.
"The following is not public," reads the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's Emergency Response document dated April 28. "Two additional release points were found today in the tangled riser. If the riser pipe deteriorates further, the flow could become unchecked resulting in a release volume an order of magnitude higher than previously thought."
Asked Friday to comment on the document, NOAA spokesman Scott Smullen said that the additional leaks described were reported to the public late Wednesday night. Regarding the possibility of the spill becoming an order of magnitude larger, Smullen said, "I'm letting the document you have speak for itself."
In scientific circles, an order of magnitude means something is 10 times larger. In this case, an order of magnitude higher would mean the volume of oil coming from the well could be 10 times higher than the 5,000 barrels a day coming out now. That would mean 50,000 barrels a day, or 2.1 million gallons a day. It appears the new leaks mentioned in the Wednesday release are the leaks reported to the public late Wednesday night.
http://blog.al.com/live/2010/04/deepwater_horizon_secret_memo.html
DAWG51
05-03-2010, 10:12 AM
Here is a good read on the subject. Pretty crazy down here right now.
http://thehayride.com/2010/05/the-latest-on-the-gulf-oil-spill-via-upstream-online-and-some-troubling-questions/
Buster
05-03-2010, 11:10 AM
Here is a good read on the subject. Pretty crazy down here right now.
http://thehayride.com/2010/05/the-latest-on-the-gulf-oil-spill-via-upstream-online-and-some-troubling-questions/
Wat up DAWG?...this is a very level headed, sensibly reported, calm, void of crisis mongering report..thank you!!!
UPDATE NO. 14, 5/3/10, 9:40 a.m.: We’re not going to try to make the case at this point that the BP spill isn’t that bad. It’s bad. But the scale of the disaster will only come close to matching the frenzy of the reporting we’re seeing if BP can’t stanch the flow of the oil at the source.
As of right now, the amount of oil spilled from the Macondo well represents less than 15 percent or so of what was spilled when the Exxon Valdez ran aground in Prince William Sound in 1989, and for this spill to represent a disaster on the scale of Valdez would require a free flow of oil from the source for 6-8 weeks or more.
Is that possible? Sure. Anything is possible. All kinds of terrible things could happen as BP attempts to shut down that spill in advance of completing a relief well in 60-90 days, and theoretically all of their actions described in our update last night could come to nothing.
But there are other possibilities. And those possibilities mostly serve to mitigate the amount of oil coming from the source.
BP has lots of assets out on the water engaged in an operation to skim the oil off the water. The effectiveness of a skimming operation depends on the weather – at first, before the high winds and seas kicked in over the weekend in the Gulf, BP had said they’d pulled some 20,000 barrels of an oil-water mix out of the slick in the first week or so. That represented some 20-40 percent of the Macondo spill at the time.
Since then they haven’t been able to make a lot of progress with skimming the oil. But conditions are improving, and when the weather cooperates, skimming can get as much as 60-80 percent of the oil on the slick. (http://liveshots.blogs.foxnews.com/2010/05/01/how-to-skim-a-massive-oil-slick)
Even assuming conditions don’t cooperate, if skimming operations can get 30 percent of the oil from the Macondo well that’s 30 percent more oil than was recovered in Alaska before the Valdez spill reached shore. Bear in mind that spill came from a supertanker running aground – the oil which came out of the Valdez was on land almost immediately, and the slick from the Valdez was a foot thick as opposed to the thin layer of oil floating on top of the Gulf at present.
In addition to skimming, they’re also spraying chemical dispersant both at the source and on the slick. As yet it’s difficult to say what percentage of the oil will be disposed of from the dispersant, but it’s generally regarded to be highly effective. (http://www.itopf.com/spill-response/clean-up-and-response/dispersants) Dispersant breaks an oil slick (or flow) into smaller droplets which are eaten away by bacteria, further broken apart by wave action or otherwise degraded.
The Valdez spill was ashore before anybody could do anything to disperse the oil. This spill happened 50 miles out and to date the oil still hasn’t come ashore, with the latest estimate saying it will be three more days before it does.
The lack of dramatic on-shore damage led Rep. Gene Taylor (D-Mississippi), who is the Congressman from the Gulf Coast area, to dismiss the spill as a major disaster (http://www.sunherald.com/2010/04/30/2145788/taylor-its-not-armageddon.html)…
U.S. Rep. Gene Taylor of Bay St. Louis said oil from the massive spill in the Gulf of Mexico is “naturally breaking up as it’s heading to shore” and that he’s less concerned about it after witnessing it firsthand.
“This isn’t Katrina. It’s not Armageddon,” Taylor said. “A lot of people are scared and I don’t think they should be,”
Taylor, along with Department of Marine Resources Director Bill Walker and U.S. Rep. Jo Bonner, R-Ala., flew at 1,000 feet over the spill today on a Coast Guard twin-engine CASA 144.
He described the spill as a light, rainbow sheen with patches that looked like chocolate milk.
He did not see any traces along the Louisiana shore, near the Chandeleur Islands in Louisiana or the barrier islands in Mississippi, he said.
This was Taylor’s first time to see the spill for himself.
“At the moment, it’s not as bad I thought it would be,” he said.
Taylor said the good news was the spill seemed to be breaking up and very little may actually come ashore here.
“If it gets here, it will be a very light sheen,” Walker said.
Walker said the sheen could collect on beaches and in estuaries, but it will evaporate after a few days to a week.
His advice is to “leave it alone and let nature take it’s course.”
automatic link (http://thehayride.com/2010/05/the-latest-on-the-gulf-oil-spill-via-upstream-online-and-some-troubling-questions/)
nnuut
05-03-2010, 11:19 AM
Updated May 03, 2010
How the Subsea Oil Recovery System Works
FOXNews.com
In its efforts to minimize the widening oil spill in the , BP will deploy a large structure in the next 6 to 8 days to capture leaking oil. Here's how it works.
http://www.foxnews.com/static/managed/img/Scitech/Subsea%20Oil%20Recovery%20System_doomsday_604x341. JPG BP
The Subsea Oil Recovery System is a large structure that can be placed over the largest leak source in the oil spill created by the explosion of the Transocean Deepwater Horizon Rig.
In its efforts to minimize the widening oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, BP will deploy a large structure in the next 6 to 8 days to capture leaking oil. Here's how it works.
Called the Subsea Oil Recovery System, the 125-ton structure is designed to be placed over the largest source of oil leaking 5,000 feet beneath the Gulf of Mexico. The system collects the leaking oil and pumps it through a and pipe to a tanker at the surface, which stores it and ships the oil to shore.
The structure is a 40-foot tall concrete chimney that conveys leaking oil to a ship on the surface, the Deepwater Enterprise. Once there, oil is separated from water and stored until the ship can return to shore, where it is offloaded and shipped to an on-shore terminal.
The ship is capable of storing 139,000 barrels of oil, processing it at a rate of 15,000 barrels per day. BP hopes it will be able to collect as much as 85 percent of the oil leaking from the sea floor.
Working in conjunction with Wild Well Controls, BP is building the system in Louisiana based on similar designs used during the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina. Containment systems used following the hurricane were in shallow water, however; to deal with the muddy conditions at the bottom of the sea, BP is adding mud flaps to the base of the structure, that should more thoroughly seal off the leak.
Last week officials drastically increased their estimate of the size of the spill, from 1,000 to 5,000 barrels a day. The Department of Homeland Security then declared the spill an incident of "national significance" on Thursday, freeing up resources to tackle the spreading problem.
BP has vowed to pay all necessary clean up costs for the massive oil leak, and the company also plans to drill a relief well near the original source in order to relieve pressure -- something Interior Secretary Ken Salazar called the "ultimate solution" to the . But finalizing that well could take up to three months. http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/05/03/subsea-oil-recovery-spill-bp-gulf-mexico/
DAWG51
05-03-2010, 03:13 PM
Buster - I worded my post incorrectly - I totally agree with the commentary on the Hayride.com.
Its pretty crazy down here because I live on the Gulfcoast and well...its pretty crazy down here right now! Lets pray that the dome-cap works! Cheers
James48843
05-03-2010, 03:43 PM
Subsea Oil Recovery System
(let's see, is there another name for that? Something that slips over the top of something to prevent the liquid from flowing outside...)
Nah..... I'll leave it alone.... :-)
James48843
05-03-2010, 09:50 PM
New pictures out of the rig burning. Incredible pics:
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/images/gallery-rigfire4.jpg
See all 9 pics here:
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/gallery/2010/05/fire-in-the-gulf-new-pictures-of-the-deepwater-horizon.php?img=1&ref=fpblg
Buster
05-03-2010, 10:13 PM
Buster - I worded my post incorrectly - I totally agree with the commentary on the Hayride.com.
I understood what you meant..My "wat up DAWG" was a greeting:)..anyway..that's why I thanked you for a very unspun, non emotional, intelligent report in that post...I know it's a freaking mess down there..my heart goes out to everyone affected..Thank you again..I hope more people read it.
burrocrat
05-03-2010, 11:01 PM
...is there another name for that? Something that slips over the top of something to prevent the liquid from flowing outside
yep, it's called we taxpayers and consumers are bout to get f****d.
oh sure BP will be responsible for their owns sins, just like GM was.
at least there's plenty of Greece and Oil to go round.
just lay back and count the cracks on the ceiling, we'll learn to like it.
XL-entLady
05-03-2010, 11:29 PM
9244
;)
burrocrat
05-03-2010, 11:41 PM
9245
CountryBoy
05-04-2010, 05:26 AM
No oil in the Ohio River Valley yet. I gotta see this water and oil running uphill. :laugh:
CountryBoy
05-04-2010, 05:43 AM
Despite plan, not a single fire boom on hand on Gulf Coast at time of oil spill
If U.S. officials had followed up on a 1994 response plan for a major Gulf oil spill, it is possible that the spill could have been kept under control and far from land.
The problem: The federal government did not have a single fire boom on hand.
The "In-Situ Burn" plan produced by federal agencies in 1994 calls for responding to a major oil spill in the Gulf with the immediate use of fire booms.
http://blog.al.com/live/2010/05/fire_boom_oil_spill_raines.html
Must be Bushes fault that no booms are there, they must be sitting in the Ohio RIver valley to burn off the massive oil making it's way upstream. :laugh:
grandma
05-06-2010, 06:37 PM
Will BP really pay for any of this? If not, where does the money come from to pay the wages, the ship fees, the docks, etc, etc., along with the oil damage itself to the land, the birds, etc....??
BP is getting more political, and that may help weather oil-spill stormBy Dan Eggen (http://projects.washingtonpost.com/staff/articles/dan+eggen/)
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, May 6, 2010 The company has mobilized a massive Washington lobbying campaign over the past week in response to the worsening crisis, dispatching senior executives to meet with Obama administration officials and members of Congress, while Hayward and other executives make frequent media appearances to defend BP's performance.
The onslaught underscores the expanding political role of BP, which has spent nearly $20 million on Washington lobbying since January 2009 and now ranks second only to ConocoPhillips within the powerful oil and gas industry, according to lobbying disclosure data. Its list of hired lobbyists (http://projects.washingtonpost.com/politicsglossary/general/lobbyist/) reads like a Who's Who of the profession, from .....
..........http://tinyurl.com/38v3b5j
Buster
05-06-2010, 08:13 PM
I really think BP will pay for it all...they have their backs against a wall..;)
CountryBoy
05-07-2010, 08:12 AM
Are Senators Unaware of Oil Spill Liability Trust Fund?
Quote of the day comes from Florida Senator Ben Nelson. He is one of three Senators introducing legislation to retroactively increase the maximum liability that an oil company is on the hook for, from $75 million to $10 billion.
Here is a LAWMAKER, suggesting that a company be punished beyond what the LAW allows:
BP says it'll pay for this mess. Baloney," said Nelson. "They're not going to want to pay any more than what the law says they have to, which is why we can't let them off the hook.
And for those wondering - yes, it it unconstitutional for Congress to do this, as CBS News reporter Mark Knoller wrote:
Even though the Constitution expressly forbids passage of ex post facto laws, some in Congress and at the White House want to retroactively raise the amount for which British Petroleum is liable in the April 20th oil well calamity.
Ex post facto is Latin for "after the fact." And an ex post facto law is one that is enacted or changed to apply retroactively to a crime or other action.
Under current law, BP is liable up to $75 million for cleanup of the oil spill.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/203481-are-senators-unaware-of-oil-spill-liability-trust-fund?source=email
Congress and people who want to change the laws in the middle of the game remind me of my days as a kid. When someone didn't like something, they'd try to change the rules in the middle of the game.
I think it is time that these folks grow up and follow and enforce the laws we already have on the books. What a novel idea these days, follow and obey the laws. :cool:
James48843
05-07-2010, 08:35 AM
Technical point-
The current liability is $75 million.
Nelson is proposing to raise the cap to $10 billion.
The technical point is this-
It's not an "ex-post-facto" law if it gets signed into law, BEFORE the damage is done.
This oil slick is out there, true. The well blew out last month. Also true.
But much of the damage is going to be six months from now, and a year from now.
The point at which the ACTUAL damage is done, for much of this- is IN THE FUTURE, not in the past.
Yes, the well blow-out happened in the past.
But the liability isn't from the well blowing out- it's from the economic damage that is going to be done a month from now. That is what will close the beach, and all the tourists will be gone after the slick comes ashore. Or six months from now- when the slick taints Key West.
Just sayin'......
Just putting out that tidbit as food for thought- as to why raising the cap doesn't rise to an "ex-post facto" law.
(Hey, that's my take, and I'm sticking to it.)
Buster
05-07-2010, 12:32 PM
But the liability isn't from the well blowing out- it's from the economic damage that is going to be done a month from now. That is what will close the beach, and all the tourists will be gone after the slick comes ashore. Or six months from now- when the slick taints Key West.
(Hey, that's my take, and I'm sticking to it.)
I respect your take..but I think you're full of it too..
Define SLICK...
Maybe a faint sheen will be seen at Key West at worst..But a slick? ..No I don't see it happening...A sheen will evaporate...Ever spill a little gasoline in the lake while filling the outboard?..a drop of gasoline will cover and acre of lake surface with a SHEEN..and that is what most the sheen is from in the Gulf...Volatile gasoline componets in the crude..it WILL evaporate.;)
Buster
05-07-2010, 12:46 PM
And Jim..if you really want to help...Cut your hair and send it to the Gulf...and I know you have a lot of hair to give too buddy;)
Human Hair Collected To Soak Up Oil Spill
http://cbs4denver.com/local/hair.oil.spill.2.1680495.html
DAWG51
05-07-2010, 12:55 PM
Went to the Carrie Underwood concert (Husbandly Duties) Wednesday night so I received a kitchen-pass for fishing yesterday. We bolted-out 30 miles SE of Pensacola, FL. The Gulf of Mexico was beautiful – Fish, turtles, rays and dolphin everywhere -Did not see any oil or sheen. I did notice some of the fish that are usually 80 miles out (Flying fish, tuna, etc..) were in-close. They know something is up.
I’ve spent most of my 47 years on this body of water. I pray that the skimmers keep skimming and the dome project is successful. Thought I would share a few photos from yesterday’s trip. Enjoy
Steadygain
05-07-2010, 04:28 PM
The Gulf of Mexico was beautiful – Fish, turtles, rays and dolphin everywhere -Did not see any oil or sheen. I did notice some of the fish that are usually 80 miles out (Flying fish, tuna, etc..) were in-close. They know something is up.
I’ve spent most of my 47 years on this body of water. I pray that the skimmers keep skimming and the dome project is successful. Thought I would share a few photos from yesterday’s trip. Enjoy
Thanks so much for sharing this!
'They know something is up' is incredibly accurate. Anything that happens in Nature -- they are way more in tune than any of us.
All we can do is hope for the BEST -- I'm prayin' too.
Well heading out for the weekend.
Buster
05-07-2010, 09:57 PM
Series of failures led to rig blast
ON THE GULF OF MEXICO – The deadly blowout of an oil rig in the Gulf of Mexico was triggered by a bubble of methane gas that escaped from the well and shot up the drill column, expanding quickly as it burst through several seals and barriers before exploding, according to interviews with rig workers conducted during BP's internal investigation...
Deep beneath the seafloor, methane gas is in a slushy, crystalline form. But as the bubble rose up the drill column from the high-pressure environs of the deep to the less pressurized shallows, it intensified and grew, breaking through various safety barriers, the interviews said.
"A small bubble becomes a really big bubble," Bea said. "So the expanding bubble becomes like a cannon shooting the gas into your face."
Up on the rig, the first thing workers noticed was the seawater in the drill column suddenly shooting back at them, rocketing 240 feet in the air. Then, gas surfaced. Then oil.
"What we had learned when I worked as a drill rig laborer was swoosh, boom, run," Bea said. "The swoosh is the gas, boom is the explosion and run is what you better be doing."
MORE (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100508/ap_on_bi_ge/us_gulf_oil_spill)
coolhand
05-08-2010, 07:15 PM
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/11/081124-giant-squid-magnapinna.html
James48843
05-10-2010, 05:19 PM
Oil leak is 5 times greater than reported by officials
From staff reports • May 10, 2010
The amount of oil gushing from BP's Deepwater Horizon oil disaster is five times more than what the oil company and the U.S. Coast Guard are currently estimating, said a Florida State University oceanography professor on Saturday.
At an oil spill environmental forum at the Hilton Pensacola Beach Gulf Front, Ian MacDonald said the blowout is gushing 25,000 barrels a day.
The Coast Guard and BP estimate 5,000 barrels a day of crude is spewing into the Gulf.
MacDonald said his estimate is based on satellite images and government maps forecasting the slick's trajectory.
MacDonald also told a crowd of about 100 gathered for the discussion that he's been frustrated by the lack of data from federal responders and BP since the April 20 explosion and subsequent spill.
Dick Snyder, director of the Center for Environmental Diagnostics and Bioremediation at the University of West Florida, said satellite imagery and maps give a misleading picture of the spread of the spill.
Chemical dispersants and exposure to sunlight have made some of the oil nearly invisible and hard to detect, he said.
Testing seawater for a hydrocarbon signature is needed to adequately track the oil spill so cleanup operations can be activated before it arrives, Snyder said.
A proposal by UWF to conduct such testing off the Pensacola coast was rejected by the state Department of Environmental Protection, Snyder said.
Both Snyder and MacDonald are members of the newly created Oil Spill Academic Task Force.
More: http://www.pnj.com/article/20100510/NEWS01/5100314
JimmyJoe
05-10-2010, 05:53 PM
Part of my perfect plan was to get in with the slide up today with the good old oil box stopping most of the mess in the gulf. Since the rise today was due to the IMF money to Greece, the word now is that later this week we'll ride the coattails of the new improved smaller heated box they're gonna send down on Thursday. Oils peeps are betting on it. It'll work to seal off 85% of the escaping oil and the parade will begin again. Stocks up, putt putt scores down. This week is good. And Birch says that the end of May, DOW 12k.:cheesy:
grandma
05-10-2010, 06:54 PM
maybe some entrepreneur independent businessmen/women can get together with some enterprising independent hay ranchers, load up a helicopter full of which-ever hay that was that works best, then dust the seashores with the loose hay. I know some places it is illegal to spread cremation ashes from an airplane, but maybe hay would be fine.
It could :D at least give roosting places for some birds, or even feed the :laugh:Seahorses, if nothing else -
nnuut
05-10-2010, 07:27 PM
Xlactly!:cool:
James48843
05-11-2010, 06:10 AM
To get an idea as to the size of this spill, here is a google-earth application that can give you an idea, compared to a city close to you. If you don't already have google earth installed, you'll have to install it if you want to enter your own city- but you get the idea. You'll get the picture.
From: http://paulrademacher.com/oilspill/
One pic- if the oil spill were overlaying the Washington DC area, this is what it would look like- Baltimore, to southern Virginia:
9376
You can plug in your own city at the link above.
Frixxxx
05-11-2010, 09:04 AM
Oil leak is 5 times greater than reported by officials
More: http://www.pnj.com/article/20100510/NEWS01/5100314
The article is estimations only. How do we get them in there to test?
I would like to ask the administration to get an independent look at things, and since these guys just formed their group. I'd like to make them part of it.
We don't need more sensationalism, just more action!:suspicious:
Silverbird
05-11-2010, 09:22 AM
BP, Halliburton, Transocean Blame Each Other in Gulf Oil Spill
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-10/bp-halliburton-transocean-blame-each-other-in-gulf-oil-spill.html
[Hokay, you had Haliburton do your subcontractor cement work for something critical??? I wouldn't trust them to make a sandwich right!]
Buster
05-12-2010, 09:18 PM
Any word on how the Gulf Gusher capping is going?..I Haven't been near a TV today.
XL-entLady
05-12-2010, 09:21 PM
Any word on how the Gulf Gusher capping is going?..I Haven't been near a TV today.
Hi, buddy. Here's the latest:
The "top hat" oil containment device has reached the sea floor in the Gulf of Mexico and should be in position over a leaking well head and operational by the end of the week, BP said Wednesday.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2010/gulf.coast.oil.spill/?hpt=C1&hpt=htopic
Buster
05-12-2010, 09:29 PM
Hi, buddy. Here's the latest:
The "top hat" oil containment device has reached the sea floor in the Gulf of Mexico and should be in position over a leaking well head and operational by the end of the week, BP said Wednesday.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2010/gulf.coast.oil.spill/?hpt=C1&hpt=htopic
Thanks Darlin...Vaarooooom!http://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_bike.gif
James48843
05-12-2010, 09:35 PM
Projection for next 48-72 hours:
9398
Buster
05-12-2010, 09:39 PM
Projection for next 48-72 hours:
9398
I don't see Key West near that....http://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_spitball.gif
James48843
05-12-2010, 09:54 PM
I don't see Key West near that....http://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_spitball.gif
I said six months for Key West. We'll see.
In the meantime, here is an aerial clip of footage shot back on May 7th- from a small plane. they picked up the sheen and slick seven miles offshore- and flew the all the way out to the platform region at 87 miles off shore. There was oil the whole way.
did-S6XbpMM
Buster
05-12-2010, 10:14 PM
I said six months for Key West. We'll see.
I looked back..didn't see that time prediction..but hey...it's all good..I pray that you are wrong even if you said a year from now.;)
JimmyJoe
05-12-2010, 10:25 PM
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2010/05/top-hat-reaches-gulf-floor-in-latest-bid-to-cap-oil-gusher/1
IT'S ON THE SEA FLOOR. For some reason BP is on the QT this time. My guess is that it'll work but it'll be unveiled on their schedual and on their timeframe. Still my bet is tomorrow afternoon for real and maybe the news, or by the Friday morn news. Either way, stocks will rise.
James48843
05-13-2010, 11:26 PM
NPR OPINION PIECE:
Gulf Oil Spill At Least 10X Greater Than Thought: Expert
By Frank James and Allison Richards
NPR's Richard Harris has learned that much more oil, 70,000 barrels a day or more than ten times the official estimate, is gushing into the Gulf of Mexico from the Deepwater Horizon pipe, based on scientific analysis of the video released Wednesday.
That's the equivalent of one Exxon Valdez tanker full every four days.
The U.S. Coast Guard has estimated that oil was gushing into the ocean at the rate of 5,000 barrels a day. But, again, NPR has been told that estimate is very low.
Here's a link (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=126809407) to a segment on All Things Considered (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=2) that explains more.
Others have estimated before now that oil was spilling at a much faster rate than the official Coast Guard rate of 5,000 barrels a day.
SkyTruth.org, (http://blog.skytruth.org/2010/05/gulf-oil-spill-new-spill-rate.html) for instance, had a post on May 1, May Day, which is apt since that's the call sign for calamity, that said the 11 million gallons spilled by the Exxon Valdez was surpassed by the gulf spill on that day. There are 42 gallons of crude oil in a barrel so 11 million gallons would equal about 261,904 barrels.
Assuming the flow rate has been steady since the gusher started on April 20, the gulf spill surpassed the Exxon Valdez in the first four days.
Link to story, with video:
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2010/05/gulf_oil_spill_more_than_10x_g.html
Video: http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid30317506001?bctid=85230779001
James48843
05-16-2010, 04:34 PM
Some pics:
9411
9410
9409
9408
James48843
05-16-2010, 04:41 PM
Some more pics:
9412
9413
9414
9415
James48843
05-16-2010, 04:47 PM
[/URL]
Models indicate Gulf spill may be in major current
9416
By JASON DEAREN (AP) – 1 hour ago
NEW ORLEANS — Researchers tracking the massive oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico say computer models show the black ooze may have already entered a major current flowing toward the Florida Keys, and are sending out a research vessel to learn more.
William Hogarth, dean of the University of South Florida's College of Marine Science, told The Associated Press Sunday that one model shows that the oil has already the loop current, which is the largest in the Gulf. The model is based on weather, ocean current and spill data from the U.S. Navy and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, among other sources.
Hogarth said a second model shows the oil is 3 miles from the current — still dangerously close.
The current flows in a looping pattern in the Gulf, through the area where the blown-out well is, east to the Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary.
[url]http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jwYFoBlYjTHWsi1MaarZvk_C_ljwD9FO4PGO6 (http://www.desdemonadespair.net/2010/05/models-indicate-gulf-oil-spill-may-be.html)
James48843
05-16-2010, 06:51 PM
wwPRTfrRHZg
JimmyJoe
05-16-2010, 07:33 PM
HA!
James48843
05-17-2010, 12:06 AM
60 Minutes: Critical equipment damaged weeks before blowout
by Keith Pickering
Sun May 16, 2010 at 05:39:58 PM PDT
60 Minutes may be the last bastion of real journalism on television. Tonight they did it again, interviewing Mike Williams, a surviving crewmember of the Deepwater Horizon. Key points revealed, below the jump.
1. This was the second attempt to drill a well in about the same spot. The first well had to be abandoned because the well had been drilled too fast (under pressure from BP to bring the well in quickly). Result: the rock fractured, causing loss of control of pressure in the well. Twenty-five million bucks down the drain, said BP to the crew. So they had to try again, in a rock formation known to be problematic.
2. Early on while drilling the second well (the one that eventually blew up) an accident damaged part of the blowout preventer (BOP). According to Williams, they were conducting a routine test of the annular, a ring of rubber that closes around the well at the top of the BOP stack. While the annular was closed, thus closing off the well, a driller accidentally pushed a joystick, which pulled the pipe casing up through the rubber seal at very high pressure. A short time later, after drilling had resumed, pieces of rubber began coming up from the bottom of the well. A drilling supervisor told Williams that the rubber debris was "no big deal".
3. The BOP has two redundant electronics boxes, called pods, which communicate with the surface. These are critical devices which trigger the BOP to close the well in emergency. One of the two pods was problematic and occasionally inoperable. The batteries on the BOP were also weak.
4. The well was in the process of being closed with cement plugs when the blowout occurred. The day of the blowout, there was a disagreement between the Transocean supervisor and the BP supervisor over how that should be accomplished. The Transocean guy wanted to keep mud in the well (i.e., keep pressure in the well) during the cementing. The BP guy wanted the mud pulled from the well for cementing, because it was faster and they were already behind schedule. The BP guy won the argument. If pressure had been maintained in the well during the cementing operation, the blowout would not have occurred.
The bottom line: the blowout was caused by gross negligence on the part of BP. There is no other way to spin it.
that's from Daily Kos:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/5/16/867033/-60-Minutes:-Critical-equipment-damaged-weeks-before-blowout
Here's the link to the 60-Minutes story:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/16/60minutes/main6490197.shtml
It's an incredible 60-Minutes story- worth watching.
Any way you cut it, it isn't good.
Our ocean waters are blown for years and years.
James48843
05-17-2010, 12:23 AM
BP ‘Burying Its Head in the Sand’ on Oil Flow Size, Markey Says
May 17, 2010, 12:39 AM EDT
(For more on the Gulf oil spill, see {EXT4 <GO>}.)
By Kim Chipman and Jordan Burke
May 16 (Bloomberg) -- BP Plc is “burying its head in the sand” and refusing to give details about the magnitude of the oil flow in the Gulf of Mexico, U.S. Representative Edward Markey said today.
The oil company should immediately release video that would help independent researchers gauge the size of the almost month- old spill, Markey, a Massachusetts Democrat, said in a statement. Markey accused the company of failing to provide him with requested information about the amount of oil flowing beneath the Gulf’s surface.
“These huge plumes of oil are like hidden mushroom clouds that indicate a larger spill than originally thought and portend more dangerous long-term fallout for the Gulf of Mexico’s wildlife and economy,” Markey said.
Scientists working on the research ship Pelican, a mission backed by the Obama administration, found submerged pools of oil-contaminated water in the Gulf of Mexico as big as 10 miles long, 3 miles wide and 300 feet thick in some parts, according to Samantha Joye, a researcher at the University of Georgia who is part of the group gathering details about the spill.
Flow Findings Differ
The findings raise more questions about BP’s estimate that the oil flow stands at 5,000 barrels a day.
“It’s clear I think now that this leak is a lot bigger,” Joye said in an interview today. “There’s much more material flowing out of this pipe than was previously expected or accepted.”
The Pelican’s mission was reported earlier today by the New York Times.
Judy Haner, marine program director for the Nature Conservancy in Mobile, Alabama, said the discrepancy in estimates doesn’t surprise her. “There’s a lot of uncertainty out there,” she said in an interview.
BP spokesman Mark Proegler said earlier today that the company is looking into the scientists’ claims about the size of the flow, though the main focus remain on “stopping the leak and minimizing the impact on the surface.” The oil producer didn’t immediately respond to requests for comment on Markey’s statement.
Joye said that she supports Markey’s call for BP to provide more video to help scientists study the spill.
“I think the heat will be turned up” and BP will have “no choice,” she said. Joye also noted that BP gave her group “amazing” access to the leak site, allowing researchers to get samples “very, very close,” or about 200 feet away, from the well head.
Deep-Water Plumes
Joye also said BP’s use of about 28,000 gallons of subsea dispersants may be contributing to formation of the large deep- water plumes.
The chemical dispersants, which have been approved by the Obama administration, break up the oil so that it sinks below the water’s surface, where BP and government officials say it will do less harm to the environment. The submerged oil has raised more questions about how the oil may affect sea life.
“It’s unclear at this point what’s going to happen,” Joye said.
“We are now entering a different phase of this disaster,” she said. “Everybody has been focusing on the surface impacts, which is normal. But now what we’ve got to switch gears and start thinking about the deep water.”
--Editors: Theo Mullen, Susan Warren
Businessweek:
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-17/bp-burying-its-head-in-the-sand-on-oil-flow-size-markey-says.html
nice work on your expose'. thank you
burrocrat
05-17-2010, 11:29 PM
ok, i just have to say this, no matter how much it pains me.
so we poke a big hole in mother earth and it gets away from us bad, so bad we won't know for a long time how bad.
then our solution is to poke two more holes in mother earth to fix it? ever time we try to dictate how the resources should serve us we get our ass handed to us in a sling.
but hey, i'm a slow learner. now i'm not saying give up on fossil fuels, you dance with the one who brung you. lots of strageries to contain the damage, but the one getting the most coverage is the one that recovers 20% of the product, there's some beancounters at BP salivating at how much that is worth on the market.
how arrogant, God help us.
James48843
05-17-2010, 11:40 PM
I did notice that too.
They COULD have tried to close off the well.
Instead, they tried sticking a tube into it, and then gave a press conference about how much of it that they are able to suck up into a ship and capture to sell it.
Um.... why not try to shut it off, instead of just trying to capture some of it flowing out????
reminds me of drinking water out of a fire hydrant. Yeh, sure, you'll get some in your mouth- but wouldn't it be better to just stuff the thing until it stops, and try sticking the needle elsewhere later?
I know it's down there 5,000 feet deep- but it isn't rocket science if all you are trying to do is cap it.
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5676174.pdf
James48843
05-18-2010, 08:05 AM
Hey Buster - did you see this, this morning?
http://cbs2.com/national/gulf.oil.spill.2.1700040.html
Tar balls have reached.....Key West.
It's only the start. Just wait until the ribbons of oil begin floating in. Then more when the slicks and sheen laps over the beaches.
Bad.
Very very very bad.
Yuk.
----------------------------------------------
OK Folks- THIS IS OUR WAKE UP CALL.
CHANGE IS NEEDED.
BREAK OUR DEPENDENCE ON FOREIGN OIL, AND ON OFF-SHORE OIL.
IT CAN BE DONE.
CNG. ELECTRIC. ETHANOL. BIODIESEL.
All are needed to change the way we power things.
If we can land a man on the moon- we can rethink about the way we use energy here, and start working AWAY from oil, and towards other, cleaner technologies.
Warrenlm
05-18-2010, 08:22 AM
...Instead, they tried sticking a tube into it, and then gave a press conference about how much of it that they are able to suck up into a ship and capture to sell it.
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5676174.pdf
And everyone still uses the 5,000 per day number so the company says they're getting 20%. No one gives credence to the much higher total number from that professor analyzing the video.
Buster
05-18-2010, 08:58 AM
Hey Buster - did you see this, this morning?
http://cbs2.com/national/gulf.oil.spill.2.1700040.html
Tar balls have reached.....Key West.
.
Let's not over state and keep it real right now...
Tar Balls Found Off Key West, Fla, not ON Key West
Nearly two dozen tar balls have been found off Key West, Fla., the U.S. Coast Guard said, but the agency stopped short of saying whether they came from a massive oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico.
A SLICK this does not make!..Tar balls are manageble..even all two dozen of them...That's like 24 of them, in case you don't own a calculator;)
nnuut
05-18-2010, 11:13 AM
The real dope is here, you know in OIL SLICK STUFF!!::nuts:
http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=272342&postcount=7796
James48843
05-18-2010, 11:52 AM
BP Awards Tourism Grants to Gulf States
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Tuesday, May 18, 2010
BP announced grants to each of the states of Florida, Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana to help their Governors promote tourism around the shores of the Gulf of Mexico over the coming months.
This is part of our ongoing commitment to help mitigate the economic impact of the oil spill.
BP is providing $25 million to Florida and $15 million each to Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana.
"The Gulf Coast is our home too. We are doing everything we can to plug the leak, contain the spill offshore and protect the shoreline. With the deployment of the riser insertion tool yesterday, we made important progress in containing the spill, and that will further strengthen our ability to keep oil off the shore," said Tony Hayward, BP's Group Chief Executive.
"We understand the Governors' concerns for the impact on the tourism industry, and are making funds available so that they can support the industry's efforts to provide accurate information about the state of the beaches across the region."
These grants are in addition to the $25 million grants BP announced May 5 to help each of the four states accelerate the implementation of Area Contingency Plans.
The grants announced today are for the Governors to distribute as they see fit to promote tourism.
The grants BP has made to the four states do not affect BP's response to the Deepwater Horizon incident or existing claims process, but are supplemental to them.
http://www.rigzone.com/news/article.asp?a_id=93450
James48843
05-18-2010, 11:56 AM
Let's see- $25 million, Florida
$15 million, Alabama
$15 million, Louisiana
$15 million, Mississippi
Some "walking around money"?
Given to each Governor to be used "as they see fit"?
9439
Buster
05-18-2010, 12:25 PM
Let's see- $25 million, Florida
$15 million, Alabama
$15 million, Louisiana
$15 million, Mississippi
Some "walking around money"?
Given to each Governor to be used "as they see fit"?
9439
I'm glad they are paying up now a little in advance for the guilty sentence in the future..wonder if it will be tax deductible?
Warrenlm
05-18-2010, 03:25 PM
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/05/17/reid_bps_greed_caused_gulf_oil_spill_11_deaths.htm l
Reid cites BP greed as cause of spill.
The simple message keeps playing for the masses to hear and absorb and accept.
Reminds me of the Faber interview with Greenspan where Faber said, as if just realizing it, the financial crisis was due to greed. Greenspan smiled and said "and you're going to pass a law that will stop that."
Frixxxx
05-18-2010, 05:13 PM
Let's see- $25 million, Florida
$15 million, Alabama
$15 million, Louisiana
$15 million, Mississippi
Some "walking around money"?
Given to each Governor to be used "as they see fit"?
9439
James, are you being sarcastic here or not? I don't understand what this is supposed to be saying. A very public display of money to "aid" in tourism. Bribe? I don't think their estimate to cleanup the spill (750 Million by their numbers) even warrants that type of comment.
I'm trying to go over all the oil rig accidents that have made it to the news. I do not see anything close to this since Valdez but that was a ship and not a rig. Does not an accident make us safer? I believe that all "known" safety devices were in place but failed. I have two friends who work the rigs off Santa Monica and up. They say no matter what they do there is always a risk.
I wish I could flip the switch and turn off the oil dependency. I really do. Anything that makes us self-sufficient, I'm all for it....Until that day, we are reliant on it and we need to make it safer. This horrible accident should be a catalyst for change, not finger-pointing and calling out.
I have contacted my marine biologist friends for their take and where and how I should focus my effort to assist on this issue.
I will let you know!:cool:
James48843
05-18-2010, 06:25 PM
What I was intending to say is this-
Last week, a single county in Mississippi asked BP for $7.5 million for that single county- to spend on television advertising, to try and get tourists to come back.
"We understand the governors' concerns for the impact on the tourism industry, and are making funds available so that they can support the industry's efforts to provide accurate information about the state of the beaches across the region," Tony Hayward, BP's Group Chief Executive, said Monday.
The amount is significantly less than the Harrison County Tourism Commission requested last week. They said it would take $7.5 million a month for television ads to combat the negative media impact on the Mississippi coast.
"It's not anywhere close to what we asked for in our original request of $7.5 million per month, but it is fantastic news to know that in less than a week BP has acted on our request," said Ken Montana, a member of the Harrison County Tourism Commission.
Details on how the grant money will be distributed were not in the announcement, but it will go through the governor's office in each state.
"I want to make it clear that the time is of the essence. The Harrison County Tourism Commission has already started spending its own existing funds," said Montana.
http://www.wlox.com/Global/story.asp?S=12495421
This week BP responds to the request, by doling out $25 million to Florida, and $15 million each to the other states.
Florida's tourism economy is huge.
According to Businessweek- it's $65 billion worth a year:
More than 80 million tourists visited Florida last year, the state’s website says. They generated $65.2 billion of economic activity and $3.9 billion of tax revenue in 2008
Source: http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-18/florida-gulf-cities-credit-may-suffer-from-bp-spill-update1-.html
While $25 mil for Florida is something, and $15 million for each of those other states is something- it's not much more than a drop in the bucket compared to what the states are losing. And giving to the Governors doesn't look very good in my book- looks kind of like it's a cash payment in order to reduce the likelihood of lawsuits, or, as a payoff to the governors.
There is no way to package the payment that makes it look nice, I know.
And this isn't really something that money can fix. At any amount. It is what it is. That's all.
Every day the oil continues to spew, is another day of worse and worse contamination. It's going to be really, really bad.
And I'm still reeling from that 60 minutes piece over the weekend, pointing out what they think happened. This never should have happened- it was human error and human greed that did it.
We're all guilty of greed- but this is on a scale unlike anything the Gulf of Mexico has ever seen before, and it's not going to stop flowing anytime soon.
This is one of those times where you just scratch your head, and say "What were those guys- what ARE those guys thinking?"
Not only to cause it to happen, but now in the effort to stop the flow.
It now appears to me that they aren't trying to stop the flow- they are trying to scoop up as much as they can. Even if it's a portion of one out of the three pipes broken- They are now saying something like 40% of one of the three pipes, is being sucked up into a tanker so they can sell it.
Not trying to stop the oil-
Trying instead to suck up what they can get in order to sell it.
Totally different mission-- and totally different mindset.
It floors me.
I'm thinking- if that is what they are trying to do, perhaps we need to NATIONALIZE the oil being gathered by those tankers, and use that money to come up with a way to STOP the flow.
My two cents for the day. :-)
Bullitt
05-18-2010, 06:32 PM
Some good words James. I'm sick over this thing. Every day some jerk is on the news trying to explain the 'flash crash' (duhh, we're in a stock bubble) but nobody seems to realize the long term effects of this ecological disaster in progress.
I can't imagine how bad it has to be in areas of Africa with these oil companies. If this happened there they'd probably 'cover it up'.
James48843
05-18-2010, 06:34 PM
Does not an accident make us safer? I believe that all "known" safety devices were in place but failed.
After watching the 60-minutes piece, it was clear that, if what they had was correct, then "all known safety devices" were NOT in place- were known to be defective, had people on the rig reporting the failure, and the BP guy deliberately overrode the existing safety protocol. If that is true, then it is criminal in my book.
And no, I don't think "accidents make us safer".
Technology, well thought out plans, reasonable regulations and oversight, and adherence to safety standards make us FAR safer than having more accidents ever will. The sad thing in this accident is that we HAD the technology that would have prevented this from happening. We simply had human greed intervene instead.
The 60 minutes piece, and what I've gathered, said the blowout prevent was damaged 4 WEEKS before the accident. The evidence was there. The data was reported. But BP made the decision to go on anyway. That is greed over safety.
The drilling took place too fast for the rock formation- people knew that. It damaged the casing. But they went on anyway. THAT is greed over safety.
The 60 minutes piece said the cementing job was not done properly. The contractor told BP it wasn't right. But they went forward anyway, after an argument on deck, and went forward anyway. THAT is greed over safety.
It's a lot like the airline industry. Accidents don't make us safer- they did for a while, as regulation and technology improved. Now the number of accidents caused by equipment failure is nearly non-existent. The majority of accidents are caused by human error, and doing things that are KNOWN to be unsafe, but doing them anyway.
Accidents RARELY are the result of one single error. It's when errors compound, and the layers of safety technology that have been developed over the years are removed, one by one, that you expose yourself to the potential of catastrophic failure.
The good thing about all of this, I think, is that it will cause us to really think hard about HOW we do undersea drilling. More regulation is required. No doubt in my mind that is the case. And more oversight will be required. No doubt in my mind.
Yes, we're going to keep drilling- but you can bet that future leases are going to have far more attention.
James48843
05-18-2010, 06:42 PM
The 60-Minutes piece I was talking about:
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/60minutes/main3415.shtml
I don't know if it's true, but I tend to believe 60-minutes reporting for it's accuracy far more than some other news programs.
Buster
05-18-2010, 06:45 PM
It just pisses me off to no end that BP and their subs involved, could have fixed the problem before it happened..IT IS BP I blame now for the delay or halting of future offshore oil drilling..now we will pay OPEC dearly..course, OPEC might have been behind the whole thing...(Just a little conspiracy theory there of my own..:rolleyes:)
James48843
05-18-2010, 06:55 PM
...OPEC might have been behind the whole thing...(Just a little conspiracy theory there of my own..:rolleyes:)
Hey- I heard it was an environmental WACKO who was on a North Korean submarine that departed Cuba and torpedoed the rig-
Didn't you see that on the web, Buster? :nuts:
http://www.therightperspective.org/2010/05/02/did-north-korea-torpedo-oil-rig-in-us-gulf/
(note- that is intended to be snarky sarcasm....)
9440
James48843
05-18-2010, 09:29 PM
Update today from the NOAA website- closure of some addtional fishing areas. The coastal areas of Florida are still open and fine, but they are extending another 150 miles of deep water far off-shore as now closed to any fishing.
Here's the NOAA data:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
NOAA Extends Fishing Closed Area to Portion of Loop Current as Precaution
More Than 81 Percent of Gulf Remains Open to Fishing
NOAA has extended the boundaries of the closed fishing area in the Gulf of Mexico into the northern portion of the loop current as a precautionary measure to ensure that seafood from the Gulf will remain safe for consumers.
Though the latest analysis shows that the bulk of the oil remains dozens of miles from the loop current, the new boundaries address the possibility that a tendril of light oil has entered or will enter the loop current.
The closed area now represents 45,728 square miles, which is slightly less than 19 percent of Gulf of Mexico federal waters. This leaves more than 81 percent of Gulf federal waters—or nearly 195,000 square miles—still available for fishing. The closure will be effective at 6 p.m. EDT. Details can be found at http://sero.nmfs.noaa.gov/.
The newly closed area is more than 150 miles from the nearest port and primarily in deep water used by pelagic longline fisheries that target highly migratory species, such as tuna and swordfish. Coastal fisheries, such as grouper, snapper and shrimp, will not be affected by the expansion of the closed area.
”The BP oil spill is unprecedented and quickly changing. The administration’s response since the beginning has been aggressive, strategic, and science-based," said Dr. Jane Lubchenco, under secretary of commerce for oceans and atmosphere and NOAA administrator. "As we expand the fishing closed area, we are doing what science demands of us and are acting with caution to ensure the safety of the seafood Americans will put on their dinner plates. We stand shoulder-to-shoulder with Gulf coast fishermen and their families during these challenging times.”
The loop current is an area of warm water that comes up from the Caribbean, past the Yucatan Peninsula, and into the Gulf of Mexico. The current is also known as the Florida current as it flows through the Florida Strait and then into the Gulf Stream as it heads north to the east coast of the U.S. Both the location of the loop current and the location of the oil slick are dynamic. Both move around from day to day. Satellite imagery on May 17 indicates that the bulk of the oil is dozens of miles away from the loop current, but a tendril of light oil has been transported close to the loop.
The federal and state governments have systems in place to test and monitor seafood safety, prohibit harvesting from affected areas, and keep oiled products out of the marketplace. NOAA continues to work closely with the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (http://www.fda.gov/) and the states to ensure seafood safety, by closing fishing areas where tainted seafood could potentially be caught, and assessing whether seafood is tainted or contaminated to levels that pose a risk to human health. NOAA and FDA are working to implement a broad-scaled seafood sampling plan. The plan includes sampling seafood from inside and outside the closure area, as well as dockside- and market-based sampling.
“Due to the unprecedented and ongoing discharge of oil, FDA agrees that NOAA's closure of these federal waters is one appropriate public health measure to prevent potentially unsafe seafood from being harvested and reaching consumers,” said Dr. Margaret Hamburg, FDA commissioner. “We understand that it will be necessary to continually evaluate the boundaries as the situation evolves.
“FDA will also continue to work closely with NOAA on future decisions to reopen the closed fishery,” she added.
According to NOAA, there are 3.2 million recreational fishermen in the Gulf of Mexico region who took 24 million fishing trips in 2008. Commercial fishermen in the Gulf harvested more than one billion pounds of finfish and shellfish in 2008.
James48843
05-18-2010, 09:31 PM
Here's the map of the current closed fishing areas:
9443
That's the fishing areas currently closed.
The coastal areas of Florida are fine for now.
Keep your fingers crossed they can cap it soon!
Buster
05-18-2010, 10:36 PM
Didn't you see that on the web, Buster? :nuts:
http://www.therightperspective.org/2010/05/02/did-north-korea-torpedo-oil-rig-in-us-gulf/
No I missed this one..So thank you sooooo Much for bringing it to this board..we can now see what is going on ..this Video I found with it is extremely important..didn't you think so too?..Hope you'll watch it this time all the way to the end...awesome truths here folks..and scary as hell!!!
s4DnU_8RhEg&feature=player_embedded
Buster
05-18-2010, 10:54 PM
The 60-Minutes piece I was talking about:
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/60minutes/main3415.shtml
I don't know if it's true, but I tend to believe 60-minutes reporting for it's accuracy far more than some other news programs.
Really?..before and or after Dan Blather left in shame?
Rather narrated for the now-defunct "60 Minutes II," in which he reported that Bush got preferential treatment during his Vietnam War-era service in the Texas Air National Guard.
Rather cited new documents CBS had obtained, but the authenticity of the documents later came under attack.
Rather kept reporting for "60 Minutes" but was dumped by CBS in June 2006 after 44 years with the network.
CountryBoy
05-19-2010, 06:11 AM
No I missed this one..So thank you sooooo Much for bringing it to this board..we can now see what is going on ..this Video I found with it is extremely important..didn't you think so too?..Hope you'll watch it this time all the way to the end...awesome truths here folks..and scary as hell!!!
s4DnU_8RhEg&feature=player_embedded
Anything to get that crisis they want so bad. What does a SWAT team know about oil drilling and safety problems? Socialism at it’s best or worst, depending on who you are. They already said they want to nationalize the oil industry and this regimes wants to be like it’s hero chavez.
They’ll never listen to the end or if they do it’ll just fall on deaf ears. Rahm wants a crisis so bad he’ll make up anything..
I can’t get to my email this morning, that darn Bush,, send in the SWAT Team
Thanks for sharing Buster.
James48843
05-20-2010, 09:21 PM
4h4yHPt7ejs
BP says now it's getting 5,000 barrels a day from ONE hose down there. They put a "straw" in it, and are sucking that much. Yet, it's less than half the flow out of that break, and the other break is flowing MORE now, because the restriction on the first one is rerouting oil flow out of the second one.
Bottom line- much, much more than 5,000 barrels a day going into the water still.
CountryBoy
05-21-2010, 05:22 AM
I haven’t the faintest idea whether this will work on such a big scale, but I do know locally they used hay bales to serve as spill control on construction projects having portable fuel or oil tanks to soak up any spillage.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5SxX2EntEo
These guys, I know they are the Progs kind of people, work for CW Roberts, big contractor in Walton County, Florida . They have just received contract to do the “HAY THING” for all the 26 miles of Walton County, Florida beaches including Sandestin.
They start off shore with tug boats and barges spreading or blowing the hay over the oil. If this works it will make the EPA look silly.
But we’ll never know, because the state run MSM won’t cover it. Mustn’t make the regime look bad.
The main thing is, these guys are trying to come up with a plan and not whining, crying and pointing fingers at everyone and being part of the problem.
The feds should help solve this problem, that's part of their job, not agree with the prez of Mex and bad mouth our our country in front of congress and the Mex prez got applause fromn the libs, that was so shameful, again where's the shame being heaped on Cali for almost the very same immigration bill, anyhoo, they’ll (Know it all Progs in Congress) have plenty of time later to form their committees to ream out the oil industry and show how knowledgeable they are when it comes to drilling for oil, so they can take over the oil industry or totally shut it down.
If we shut down coal mining and oil drilling every time we had an accident, what would we use for energy now, not 20 years from now, right now?. Think if the feds reacted like this every time we had a salmonella scare and said lets stop farming. That’s exactly what they are acting now, oh they want a crisis so bad, so they can step in and really jam socialism down our throat.
Accidents happen, so folks don’t drive to work today, ride the subway or train, because ya may have an accident and somebody may die. For those of you that want to stop drilling or mining, be sure to disconnect your AC unit this summer, because it is about the biggest, if not the biggest consumer of power. You'll save energy and the environment, if you really believe the global warming scambola.
So come on watermelons, if you’re going to talk the talk, then walk the walk. :D
Have a good weekend all, I will becasue I'll be nuturing my 40 acres of woodlands. that I have to drive the loggers off about every 3 years, so that I can reduce the so called bad air from the atmosphere. :laugh:
Enough for my rant, it's been awhile, feels good. :D
CB
PS Rant: I can already hear the 2 or so naysayers on the MB saying it won't work, because they know it all, but we'll always have these type of wet rags dumping rahm on any idea that they didn't thnk of or that is different, but s*&^w them, these are the speed bumps that are always placed in front of new ideas. These people are useless to the building of America and I totally ignore there self rightgeous, arrogant blatherings, since they rarely if ever stay on point. But this idea has worked on smaller scales.
James48843
05-21-2010, 10:20 AM
CB- I'm probably one of the two you think will say "It won't work".
I'll tell you this- I am all for trying ANYTHING THAT HELPS.
It's a bad, bad deal going on, and whatever ANYONE can think of to give a try, I'm all for trying it and seeing if it helps the situation at all.
MSM did run a piece on them about two weeks ago- when they held their press conference originally, and before they got the contract you mentioned above.
If it works, great. the issue I see is that we can't grow enough hay to cover the area that needs help. The scale is huge. If these guys can protect the 26 miles up at Walton Beach, more power to them.
James48843
05-21-2010, 10:30 AM
EPA has been asking the public for any ideas they have for specific things to try- here's the link to submit ideas.
http://www.epa.gov/bpspill/techsolution.html
This gets ideas straight into the hands of the people who are charged with cooridinating the emergency. They have teams of people working on trying things, and support for any and all ideas.
I posted that a few weeks ago, here:
http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=269302&postcount=39
The priorites are, and have been-
#1- Stop the flow into the Gulf from this scene
#2- Inspector other rigs for any issue with blow-out preventers, or equipment issues, so that there aren't any other ones that are in a situation like this one was- that they knew had problems, broken wires or circuits, etc, and make sure those get fixed before any driller continues with work. That was the "Swat teams" that the President was referring to- He ordered all rigs to have special techincal teams to travel to all sites that are currently drilling, and verify that there are no defective blowout prevention devices that are known about.
#3- clean, try to keep the oil away from land, and do whatever anyone can think of or try in order to start the cleanup.
James48843
05-22-2010, 07:46 PM
Louisiana Fishermen Contemplating Suicide, Need Mental Health Services (http://www.neworleans.com/news/local-news/399556.html)
Written by WGNO ABC26 News |
Friday, 21 May 2010 14:00
The situation in the gulf is getting so dire for some in the seafood industry, they've thought about committing suicide. Steps to intervene are underway.
Desperation is setting in in Southeast Louisiana. "I spoke to a group of fishermen, mainly Vietnamese Americans and a group of them came up to me and said, they told me that they contemplated suicide because they're in such despair," says Congressman Joseph Cao. He says fishermen are feeling compounded stress on top of post-Katrina troubles. "For some people, this is almost a boiling point where they can no longer handle it and they're going to crack."
"These are grown men that broke down and cried this morning because they don't know what to do and we don't know how long it's going to be," says Plaquemines Parish President Billy Nungesser.
That's why Cao and organizations like Volunteers of America are working to get mental health workers on the ground to intervene. "They've just recovered as a result of their businesses, their homes and the rebuilding effort and now you have a number of these small businesses, these fishermen, who have to go through this all over again," says Voris Vigee with the Volunteers of America. She says organizations are expediting crisis and mental health counseling among other disaster-related services.
More: http://www.neworleans.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=399556&Itemid=2603
James48843
05-22-2010, 08:04 PM
From NOAA- current maps:
Offshore long range map:
9468
Nearshore short-range map:
9469
Source:
http://response.restoration.noaa.gov/topic_subtopic_entry.php?RECORD_KEY%28entry_subtop ic_topic%29=entry_id,subtopic_id,topic_id&entry_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=809&subtopic_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=2&topic_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=1
James48843
05-26-2010, 05:42 AM
Pray for success of the "topkill" attempt this morning.
On CNN, "Bill Nye, the Science Guy" explains the "Topkill" procedure they are going to try-
http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/05/26/gulf.oil.spil/
If it works, it will cut off the flow.
If it doesn't work- it could make the gusher even worse, AND make it harder to do anything in the future- and it could continue to flow for months and months.
Pray.
Buster
05-26-2010, 07:47 AM
Pray for success of the "topkill" attempt this morning.
On CNN, "Bill Nye, the Science Guy" explains the "Topkill" procedure they are going to try-
http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/05/26/gulf.oil.spil/
If it works, it will cut off the flow.
If it doesn't work- it could make the gusher even worse, AND make it harder to do anything in the future- and it could continue to flow for months and months.
Pray.
http://www.google.com/url?source=imgres&ct=img&q=http://files.myopera.com/Mathilda/albums/83697/Kid%2520and%2520Dog%2520Praying.png&ei=TBj9S_vgKI_ANrHKpTk&sa=X&oi=image_landing_page_redirect&ct=legacy&usg=AFQjCNHmepehwTU0a2iFxqWOQbVfiuW9kA
James48843
05-26-2010, 07:57 PM
YwISS8vIF2c
James48843
05-26-2010, 08:03 PM
Live video feed of the wellhead:
http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_internet/globalbp/globalbp_uk_english/homepage/STAGING/local_assets/bp_homepage/html/rov_stream.html
James48843
05-27-2010, 05:00 PM
New, giant sea oil plume seen in Gulf
By MATTHEW BROWN and JASON DEAREN Associated Press Writers © 2010
The Associated Press
May 27, 2010, 3:33PM
http://us.bc.yahoo.com/b?P=d55591b4-69da-11df-8420-572b12cfd08b&T=199lhtejk%2fX%3d1274997444%2fE%3d2022775850%2fR% 3dncnws%2fK%3d5%2fV%3d8.1%2fW%3d0%2fY%3dPARTNER_US %2fF%3d1438002057%2fH%3dYWx0c3BpZD0iOTY3MjgzMTUxIi BzZXJ2ZUlkPSJkNTU1OTFiNC02OWRhLTExZGYtODQyMC01NzJi MTJjZmQwOGIiIHNpdGVJZD0iNzYxMDUxIiB0U3RtcD0iMTI3ND k5NzQ0NDczNDA5OCIgdGFyZ2V0PSJfdG9wIiA-%2fQ%3d-1%2fS%3d1%2fJ%3d28558862&U=128onaukj%2fN%3d85MMJUwNiZw-%2fC%3d-1%2fD%3dBTN2%2fB%3d-1%2fV%3d5
NEW ORLEANS — Marine scientists have discovered a massive new plume of what they believe to be oil deep beneath the Gulf of Mexico, stretching 22 miles (35 kilometers) from the leaking wellhead northeast toward Mobile Bay, Alabama.
The discovery by researchers on the University of South Florida College of Marine Science's Weatherbird II vessel is the second significant undersea plume recorded since the Deepwater Horizon exploded on April 20.
The thick plume was detected just beneath the surface down to about 3,300 feet (1,000 meters), and is more than 6 miles (9.6 kilometers) wide, said David Hollander, associate professor of chemical oceanography at the school.
Hollander said the team detected the thickest amount of hydrocarbons, likely from the oil spewing from the blown out well, at about 1,300 feet (nearly 400 meters) in the same spot on two separate days this week.
The discovery was important, he said, because it confirmed that the substance found in the water was not naturally occurring and that the plume was at its highest concentration in deeper waters. The researchers will use further testing to determine whether the hydrocarbons they found are the result of dispersants or the emulsification of oil as it traveled away from the well.
The first such plume detected by scientists stretched from the well southwest toward the open sea, but this new undersea oil cloud is headed miles inland into shallower waters where many fish and other species reproduce.
The researchers say they are worried these undersea plumes may be the result of the unprecedented use of chemical dispersants to break up the oil a mile undersea at the site of the leak.
Hollander said the oil they detected has dissolved into the water, and is no longer visible, leading to fears from researchers that the toxicity from the oil and dispersants could pose a big danger to fish larvae and creatures that filter the waters for food.
"There are two elements to it," Hollander said. "The plume reaching waters on the continental shelf could have a toxic effect on fish larvae, and we also may see a long term response as it cascades up the food web."
Dispersants contain surfactants, which are similar to dishwashing soap.
A Louisiana State University researcher who has studied their effects on marine life said that by breaking oil into small particles, surfactants make it easier for fish and other animals to soak up the oil's toxic chemicals. That can impair the animals' immune systems and cause reproductive problems.
"The oil's not at the surface, so it doesn't look so bad, but you have a situation where it's more available to fish," said Kevin Kleinow, a professor in LSU's school of veterinary medicine.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/top/all/7025368.html
James48843
05-27-2010, 09:05 PM
i8Vn3h8kjWQ
James48843
05-28-2010, 06:31 PM
BP Buses In 400 Workers During Obama's Visit
Jefferson Parish Councilman Calls Company's Actions 'Shameful'
POSTED: 2:18 pm CDT May 28, 2010
UPDATED: 5:21 pm CDT May 28, 2010
GRAND ISLE, La. -- Officials from Jefferson Parish claim BP bused 400 cleanup workers into Grand Isle on Friday in time for a visit from President Barack Obama. Jefferson Parish Councilman John Young said the workers were brought in to clean oil off Grand Isle's beaches.The extra workers were brought in for Friday only, at a rate of $12 an hour, officials told WDSU. They were mostly from Terrebonne and Lafourche parishes.
http://www.wdsu.com/images/structures/buttons/button_enlarge.gif
http://www.wdsu.com/2010/0528/23713692_240X180.jpg (http://www.wdsu.com/news/23711711/detail.html#)
Jefferson Parish Councilman Chris Roberts called BP's efforts "shameful.""The level of cleanup and cooperation from BP in the last week in no way compares to the effort shown on the island today," Roberts said. "This is a total shame that a mockery has been made of this visit by the executives of BP."
During a visit Friday to Louisiana, Obama toured a beach where tar balls are washing ashore and attended a briefing at a Coast Guard station in Grand Isle.
Oil has been washing ashore in Grand Isle for about a week.
http://www.wdsu.com/news/23711711/detail.html
Buster
05-28-2010, 06:49 PM
BP Buses In 400 Workers During Obama's Visit
Jefferson Parish Councilman Calls Company's Actions 'Shameful'
Jefferson Parish Councilman Chris Roberts called BP's efforts "shameful.""The level of cleanup and cooperation from BP in the last week in no way compares to the effort shown on the island today," Roberts said. "This is a total shame that a mockery has been made of this visit by the executives of BP."
Not only that..As soon as the the President took off...there was only 12 people left cleaning the beaches...Talk about a facade..:mad:
James48843
05-28-2010, 08:56 PM
Not only that..As soon as the the President took off...there was only 12 people left cleaning the beaches...Talk about a facade..:mad:
BP = scum.
nnuut
05-28-2010, 09:28 PM
He must be a Big Lier, yesterday he said he had 20,000 people working on the cleanup?:nuts:
James48843
05-28-2010, 09:34 PM
Note- BP's on-line live webcam appears to be offline right now. The last time I saw it, a few hours ago, it was still showing full gushing of oil out into the ocean. No appearance of all of any change from the "top kill" attempt.
And now the webcam has gone off-line.
Disappointing.
Buster
05-28-2010, 10:06 PM
BP chief operating officer Doug Suttleshttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/2_bing.gif (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37394541/ns/gulf_oil_spill#) said Friday the top kill was going basically as planned, though the pumping has stopped several times.
“The fact that it’s stopped and started is not unusual,” Suttles said. “We’re going to stay at this as long as we need to.”
He said the company has also shot in assorted junk, including metal pieces and rubber balls, to try to counter pressure from the well. It seemed to be helping, Suttles said.
I saw this Press conference..you could tell he was talking out his ass....:mad:..I hope he wasn't bullsh!tting like he was about the bogus cleaning crew they mustered for the President.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37394541/ns/gulf_oil_spill
Buster
05-28-2010, 10:19 PM
Note- BP's on-line live webcam appears to be offline right now. The last time I saw it, a few hours ago, it was still showing full gushing of oil out into the ocean. No appearance of all of any change from the "top kill" attempt.
And now the webcam has gone off-line.
Disappointing.
It was just mentioned on CNN's AC360 that the Webcam if off and on top being serviced, and that's why the live streaming is off right now.
James48843
05-29-2010, 08:29 AM
Fishery closure update (effective May 28):
NOAA Fisheries Service revised the fishery closure effective 6:00 p.m. EDT on Friday, May 28. The closure now encompasses approximately 25 percent of the federal waters in the Gulf of Mexico exclusive economic zone.
Marine mammals and turtles (effective May 27):
Sea Turtles
The total number of sea turtles verified from April 30 to May 27 within the designated spill area is 238. The 238 turtles verified include three entirely oiled sea turtles that were captured alive during dedicated on-water surveys last week: two small Kemp's Ridley and a larger sub-adult Loggerhead turtle. They were taken to the Audubon Aquarium where they are undergoing de-oiling and care and are doing well. In addition, 222 dead and 13 live stranded turtles (of which three subsequently died in rehab) have been verified. A total of 12 live turtles are now in rehabilitation. One of the live stranded turtles –caught in marine debris -- was disentangled and released. One of the turtles that stranded dead – a Kemp’s Ridley - had visible evidence of external oil.
All others that stranded dead and alive have not had visible external oil. Turtle strandings during this time period have been higher in Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama than in previous years for this same time period. This may be due in part to increased detection and reporting, but this does not fully account for the increase.
Dolphins
From April 30 to May 27, there have been 24 dead dolphins verified within the designated spill area. So far, one of the 24 dolphins had evidence of external oil. It was found on an oiled beach. We are unable at this time to determine whether the animal was externally covered in oil prior to its death or after its death. The other 23 dolphins have had no visible evidence of external oil.
Since April 30, the stranding rate for dolphins in Louisiana has been higher than the historic numbers for the same time period in previous years. This may be due to increased detection and reporting and the lingering effects of the earlier observed spike in strandings.
*Strandings are defined as dead or debilitated animals that wash ashore
(from NOAA's website this morning.
http://response.restoration.noaa.gov/topic_subtopic_entry.php?RECORD_KEY%28entry_subtop ic_topic%29=entry_id,subtopic_id,topic_id&entry_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=809&subtopic_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=2&topic_id%28entry_subtopic_topic%29=1 )
Warrenlm
05-29-2010, 10:15 AM
Not to demean the losses, but the following old story is for perspective. We humans don’t give much priority to saving wild creatures from the effect of our activity unless the media gets excited, and that’s as temporary as our attention.
http://www.greenpeace.org/international/en/news/features/dolphins-die-in-trawler-nets/ (http://www.greenpeace.org/international/en/news/features/dolphins-die-in-trawler-nets/)
“Observers of pair trawling in 2001 saw 53 dolphins killed in 116 hauls of the net; with two Irish boats in 1999, 145 dolphins were killed in 313 hauls, with 30 animals being killed by one single haul of the net. There are hundreds of boats in the whole EU fleet mainly from UK, France, Spain, Ireland, the Netherlands, and Denmark.”
James48843
05-29-2010, 11:32 AM
It doesn't have to be this way.
We DO have a choice.
s9___ZyBkmQ
JimmyJoe
05-29-2010, 12:30 PM
Car bodies made with hemp. :D Air less tires. Bicycle roads. Corner vegetable stands. Keeping aging parents at home, multi generational families under one roof. Available, cheap, alternate energy. I live in the southwest and love my 'swamp coola'. It sits on my roof and cools the house to a sweet 75 degrees. That's alternative energy that has been round for decades. Course the refridgerant AC folks are woiking hard, advertising, to get folks to change over. Walking to corner veg markets, if they existed. Stop running on the streets. Who says you can add to the public appearance of self torment and aggravation. Stretch in your house or out in your backyard. Have sex. Eat vegs to moderate your heft and improve your appearance. Smile when you open your eyes in the morning. Don't believe the news or the commercials or tv in general. Believe in your self. I know. I know. Believing in yourself is likely to get peoples not to like you, but they can get bent or pack sand (their preference). Have a good memorial holy day y'all.
Buster
05-29-2010, 02:17 PM
Car bodies made with hemp. :D Air less tires. Bicycle roads. Corner vegetable stands. Keeping aging parents at home, multi generational families under one roof. Available, cheap, alternate energy. I live in the southwest and love my 'swamp coola'. It sits on my roof and cools the house to a sweet 75 degrees. That's alternative energy that has been round for decades. Course the refridgerant AC folks are woiking hard, advertising, to get folks to change over. Walking to corner veg markets, if they existed. Stop running on the streets. Who says you can add to the public appearance of self torment and aggravation. Stretch in your house or out in your backyard. Have sex. Eat vegs to moderate your heft and improve your appearance. Smile when you open your eyes in the morning. Don't believe the news or the commercials or tv in general. Believe in your self. I know. I know. Believing in yourself is likely to get peoples not to like you, but they can get bent or pack sand (their preference). Have a good memorial holy day y'all.
I'm gonna go easy on you with this one as it sounds pretty darn good..but you are living in a dream State...3/4 of the rest of the country would not be able to do all those things..especially in the big cities and that's where 3/4 of our population lives....I wish it could be as simple as you put it, but it ain't..that's the reality and you need to check it once in a while..other than that./.well said.:)
James48843
05-29-2010, 02:27 PM
I like the car bodies made from hemp part....
JimmyJoe
05-29-2010, 03:07 PM
Buster. You going easy on me is like a complement. James is cool too. I'm on my third beer so I hope you two are doing just as good.
Warrenlm
05-29-2010, 04:10 PM
Never mind, wrong thread.
James48843
05-29-2010, 04:26 PM
Buster. You going easy on me is like a complement. James is cool too. I'm on my third beer so I hope you two are doing just as good.
Uh oh...
Posting under the influence? (PUI)
9501
James48843
05-29-2010, 04:41 PM
News reports say BP about to announce "Topkill" is officially a failure.
Says next they'll try something else- cutting off the riser, and trying to capture the oil with a new pipe.
Note: Once again I have to ask- WHY is BP more concerned with trying to capture the oil, rather than stopping the flow???
Because by capturing the oil, they continue to make money from it.
While the gusher continues.
Bad.
very, very bad.
James48843
05-29-2010, 05:28 PM
BP's top kill effort fails to plug Gulf oil leak
ROBERT, La. – BP has failed in its latest attempt to plug the oil leak in the Gulf of Mexico (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100529/ap_on_bi_ge/us_gulf_oil_spill#) with mud and cement.
BP chief operating officer Doug Suttles (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100529/ap_on_bi_ge/us_gulf_oil_spill#) said Saturday that the maneuver known as a top kill had failed. It was the latest setback for the company trying to stop the crude from further fouling waters, wildlife and marshland.
The spill is the worst in U.S. history and has dumped between 18 million and 40 million gallons into the Gulf, according to government estimates.
BP's top executive had put the chances of success for the top kill at 60 to 70 percent, but officials had cautioned that it had never been done 5,000 feet below the sea.
BP says it's already preparing for the next attempt to stop the leak. Under the new plan, BP would cut off the damaged riser from which the oil is leaking and cap it with a containment valve.
Source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100529/ap_on_bi_ge/us_gulf_oil_spill
James48843
05-29-2010, 05:47 PM
T_HvLKdefx0
XL-entLady
05-29-2010, 05:49 PM
BP, just plug the d@mn hole. How many more lives and land are you willing to ruin for greed?
Buster
05-29-2010, 06:02 PM
This is how I invision them plugging the well..
Per their discussion/press conference..they are gonna cut off the top of the well Riser above the BOP and remove the damaged well riser pipe, then stick a Cork in it..
http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b47/Atwater/bop.jpg
James48843
05-29-2010, 06:34 PM
Put a cork in it?
Nope. That won't work either. Too much pressure coming out to cork it.
But hey- I wish them good luck with that.
Let's see:
Large dome didn't work.
Small "top hat" didn't work.
"Topkill" procedure didn't work.
So now they are going to try to cut and cap.
Yah- good luck with that.
My prediction- how I envision it- (not that I want this, but this is what I think will happen)
1. Cut and cap won't work.
2. Gusher will continue to gush.
3. BP will keep trying, by cutting, crimping, stuffing, etc. Nothing will work.
4. About three months from now, maybe four months, they will finally get either the second or third well drilled, and will try to intercept the pipe several thousand feet below the sea floor. It's hitting a 14 inch pipe on an angle, from 4 miles away, and hoping that you hit it squarely the first time. Cause that's all you are gonna get.
If they get lucky then, they'll relieve enough pressure out of the pipe to be able to do the "topkill" procedure again, IF they can still do it then.
If they are not lucky, then it lasts another YEAR.
We'll see.
nnuut
05-29-2010, 08:43 PM
Think Atomic Bomb! 9503
Buster
05-29-2010, 10:19 PM
Put a cork in it?
Nope. That won't work either. Too much pressure coming out to cork it.
But hey- I wish them good luck with that.
So now they are going to try to cut and cap.
Yah- good luck with that.
Really?:nuts:..you know this How?...My God man!!!!!..what the hell are you sitting around for?..You need to Call BP and the Coast Guard and all the Scientists on the project, and, and OBAMA.. and tell them to halt and not try this or even attempt it..because, YOU know there is too much pressure and it wont' work...And to go ahead with drilling relief wells instead, that will take three more months (maybe)..even though they have drilled one already and they are 2/3 of the way there...But YOU say 2 to 3 wells will be needed....you are incrediblehttp://www.hummeraddicts.com/Smileys/Lots_O_Smileys/notworthy.gif
XL-entLady
05-29-2010, 10:33 PM
....you are incrediblehttp://www.hummeraddicts.com/Smileys/Lots_O_Smileys/notworthy.gif
Takes one to know one ....
James48843
05-29-2010, 11:00 PM
Really?:nuts:..you know this How?...My God man!!!!!..what the hell are you sitting around for?..You need to Call BP and the Coast Guard and all the Scientists on the project, and, and OBAMA.. and tell them to halt and not try this or even attempt it..because, YOU know there is too much pressure and it wont' work...And to go ahead with drilling relief wells instead, that will take three more months (maybe)..even though they have drilled one already and they are 2/3 of the way there...But YOU say 2 to 3 wells will be needed....you are incrediblehttp://www.hummeraddicts.com/Smileys/Lots_O_Smileys/notworthy.gif
Yes Buster, I'm a pretty smart guy. Not a brilliant one, but smart enough to know to get facts- and I do try to learn, get real data, and analyze data rapidly.
I do that based on a lot of years of taking little bits of data, and putting together the clues, to figure out what the h-e-double-tooth-picks is going on. Detective work, if you will.
Sherlock Holmes author Arthur Conan Doyle put it best.
He said: "Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.”
You go ahead and think what you will.
For me, I've picked up enough little pieces out of the news, out of the scientists reports, out of the mechanical data that is floating up, out of the Congressional testimony, to recognize this-
It is going to be a very, very bad deal, for a LONG time to come.
I give the "cut and cap" about a 10% chance of success. I would love to give it higher probability- but the pressure in the well continues to make me think it simply is impossible to do it that way. And once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, whatever remains is...the truth.
"cut and cap" isn't going to work, because we're still looking at huge pressures in the pipe. that' s why "topkill" didn't work. I WISH cut and cap would work. By all means, give it a try, because it isn't going to change the fact that they will need to try to do the second/third well thing to intercept the well far below, and divert the pressure that way. "cut and cap" does nothing adverse to that need, and will at least keep some people busy giving it a try while they work on the real solution- which won't actually come to fruition until, let's say- August 10 to 20th. You can quote me on that- Look for an attempt to tap the main well with a second one in the second or third week of August. That MIGHT work.
I give the second and third relief wells a bit better chance- but still no higher than 50=50 at best. Based on all the little tidbits of data I have been able to absorb.
It's not that I know everything about drilling oil, Buster. I don't.
But I can read.
And learn. and search out the truth.
We'll see.
James48843
05-29-2010, 11:30 PM
Here is a satellite photo from a couple days ago (May 25th) to give you an idea of the size of the spill so far. The oil slick has extended south more than 85 miles from the well.
This is from NASA for May 25th:
9504
James48843
05-30-2010, 11:17 AM
Russian news media offers a suggestion:
Just nuke it.
7ojCbqfRRr8
alevin
05-30-2010, 11:31 AM
The Russians have done it a couple times when they had an out-of-control deepsea gas drillhole, from what I've been reading. they were successful at getting the things plugged. From what else I'm reading today, it may not be that simple with this one.
nnuut
05-30-2010, 12:08 PM
NUKE IT and the Tsunami will wash away the oil in the wet lands! :eek:
Buster
05-30-2010, 02:53 PM
Takes one to know one ....
And I guess you know them all..huh?:suspicious:
You know what you remind me of?..the kid that gets down behind someone when they’re not looking, while another kid pushes them over backward over you…tisk, tisk..
XL-entLady
05-30-2010, 03:30 PM
Takes one to know one ....
And I guess you know them all..huh?:suspicious:
Only the important ones. ;) :toung:
You know what you remind me of?..the kid that gets down behind someone when they’re not looking, while another kid pushes them over backward over you…tisk, tisk..
Oh yeah, I really deserved that. Because I'm always sneaking up behind people and hitting them when they're not looking. You bet. That's me. :rolleyes:
What I am, Buster, 'ol bud, is someone who appreciates a factual and cogent argument rather than a rabble-roused regurgitation of the latest Limbaugh show.
9505
nnuut
05-30-2010, 03:34 PM
The Russians have done it a couple times when they had an out-of-control deepsea gas drillhole, from what I've been reading. they were successful at getting the things plugged. From what else I'm reading today, it may not be that simple with this one.
Yeah and that fire burned for what 9 Months, that's where GLOBAL WARMING came from!!:laugh::laugh::laugh:
You guys are way too intelligent for me to compete with so I'll just shut up!:suspicious:
Buster
05-30-2010, 05:42 PM
You guys are way too intelligent for me to compete with so I'll just shut up!:suspicious:
Probably the best thing for me too Norm..I should've learned long ago there is no reasoning with sticks and stones throwing Liberals that don't posses a mirror to see themselves as others see them..they are NEVER wrong.:laugh:
alevin
05-30-2010, 06:03 PM
WHAT is the problem? I was agreeing nuking it might be a workable solution, considering it's been tried and successful elsewhere!
When I said it would not necessarily be any more successful than anything else tried so far, I was referring to logistical factual assessments of the option I've been reading about. Not speaking my opinion! I don't have one on that option, yet! won't know until they've tried it. Jeez. :suspicious:
XL-entLady
05-30-2010, 06:27 PM
WHAT is the problem? .... I was referring to logistical factual assessments of the option I've been reading about.
Ah! Logistical factual assessments! There's your problem right there! :laugh:
James48843
05-30-2010, 08:31 PM
Tiny scale, but at least it's a start:
Jx5XgUYDQ3k
James48843
05-30-2010, 08:36 PM
BP CEO disputes claims of underwater oil plumes
VENICE, La. – Disputing scientists' claims of large oil plumes suspended underwater in the Gulf of Mexico, BP PLC's chief executive on Sunday said the company has largely narrowed the focus of its cleanup to surface slicks rolling into Louisiana's coastal marshes.
During a tour of a BP PLC staging area for cleanup (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#) CEO Tony Hayward said the company's sampling showed "no evidence" that oil was suspended in large masses beneath the surface. He didn't elaborate on how the testing was done.
Hayward said that oil's natural tendency is to rise to the surface, and any oil found underwater was in the process of working its way up.
"The oil is on the surface," Hayward said. "There aren't any plumes."
Scientists from several universities have reported plumes of what appears to be oil far from the site of BP's leaking wellhead, which is more than 5,000 beneath the surface.
Those findings — from the University of South Florida, the University of Georgia, Southern Mississippi University and other institutions — were based on video images and initial observations of water samples (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#) taken in the Gulf over the last several weeks. They continue to be analyzed.
One researcher said Sunday that their findings are bolstered by the fact that scientists from different institutions have come to similar conclusions after doing separate testing.
"There's been enough evidence from enough different sources," said marine scientist James Cowan of Louisiana State University (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#), who reported finding a plume last of oil last week about 50 miles from the spill site. Cowan said oil reached to depths of at least 400 feet.
An even larger plume — 22 miles long, six miles wide and more than a thousand feet deep — was reported by the University of South Florida.
"We stand behind it," said William Hogarth, dean of the school's College o (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#)f Marine Science. Hogarth (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#), the former head of the National Marine Fisheries Service, said laboratory results are due this week.
A third scientist, LSU chemist Ed Overton, said simple physics sides with BP's Hayward. Since oil is lighter than water, Overton said it is unlikely to stay below the surface for long.
But Hogarth and Cowan said BP's use of chemical dispersants to break up the oil before it reaches the surface could reduce its buoyancy, keeping it in deeper water.
An estimated 18 to 40 million gallons of oil have been unleashed since BP's Deepwater Horizon platform exploded and sank last month, killing 11. With the undersea leak now expected to continue spewing oil until August, Hayward said the cleanup effort (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#) could last for months or even years.
The embattled CEO spent only a few minutes on the subject of plumes on Sunday, concentrating instead on outlining his company's cleanup efforts.
"The fight on this battlefield today is in Louisiana," he said.
Calls to BP seeking more information on how they tested for the underwater plumes (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#) weren't immediately returned.
Source - http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes
Buster
05-30-2010, 10:27 PM
BP CEO disputes claims of underwater oil plumes
During a tour of a BP PLC staging area for cleanup (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill_plumes#) CEO Tony Hayward said the company's sampling showed "no evidence" that oil was suspended in large masses beneath the surface. He didn't elaborate on how the testing was done.
A third scientist, LSU chemist Ed Overton, said simple physics sides with BP's Hayward. Since oil is lighter than water, Overton said it is unlikely to stay below the surface for long.
But Hogarth and Cowan said BP's use of chemical dispersants to break up the oil before it reaches the surface could reduce its buoyancy, keeping it in deeper water.
During the explanation of the use of this underwater dispersing agent..it was said that it acted like soap and broke the oil into tiny droplets and therefore the ocean's microbes could eat this up and bio-degrade it into something harmless...This could be bullsh!t...I don't know for sure..But I will tell you for a fact (http://www.debugamericalatina.com/bacteria-in-diesel.html), (are you happy now Lady?) that there is 27 varieties of microorganisms that lives and thrives on diesel fuel and water...So it maybe possible about what they are saying..
XL-entLady
05-30-2010, 10:48 PM
..But I will tell you for a fact (http://www.debugamericalatina.com/bacteria-in-diesel.html), (are you happy now Lady?) ..
You are good, my friend.
:-{}
My daughter just showed me that emoticon and told me it means "blowing a kiss". :D
Buster
05-30-2010, 10:56 PM
You are good, my friend.
:-{}
My daughter just showed me that emoticon and told me it means "blowing a kiss". :D
Thanks sweetie..http://www.hummeraddicts.com/Smileys/Lots_O_Smileys/awe.gif
James48843
05-31-2010, 06:01 AM
Map of the oil from NOAA-
Nearshore:
9506
Offshore:
9507
That's the spread so far. They are now saying on TV this morning that a half-a-million gallons of oil are escaping each day. And they are saying that the "topkill" has now been abandonded, and they say it will be at least August before they have another attempt to shut the oil down. The White House doesn't expect the "Cut and Cap" to work- and warns America to anticipate it may be August before those two relief wells can take the pressure off the main well, and allow it to be plugged again. (AFTER the relief wells are done, then AFTER those relief wells take some pressure out of the pool of oil, THEN they can try a "topkill" again and hope it works if there is less pressure fighting back. August? September? October? We'll see. )
"White House energy and climate adviser Carol M. Browner said Sunday that the oil spill was "probably the biggest environmental disaster we've ever faced in this country" and that "we are prepared for the worst."
On the CBS show "Face the Nation," she said that the "American people need to know that it is possible we will have oil leaking from this well until August when the relief wells will be finished." More: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/05/30/AR2010053002195.html
James48843
05-31-2010, 06:12 AM
Really?:nuts:..you know this How?...My God man!!!!!..what the hell are you sitting around for?..You need to Call BP and the Coast Guard and all the Scientists on the project, and, and OBAMA.. and tell them to halt and not try this or even attempt it..because, YOU know there is too much pressure and it wont' work...And to go ahead with drilling relief wells instead, that will take three more months (maybe)..even though they have drilled one already and they are 2/3 of the way there...But YOU say 2 to 3 wells will be needed....you are incrediblehttp://www.hummeraddicts.com/Smileys/Lots_O_Smileys/notworthy.gif
Read it Buster- on today's Washington Post:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/05/30/AR2010053002195.html
White House energy and climate adviser Carol M. Browner said Sunday that the oil spill was "probably the biggest environmental disaster we've ever faced in this country" and that "we are prepared for the worst."
On the CBS show "Face the Nation," she said that the "American people need to know that it is possible we will have oil leaking from this well until August when the relief wells will be finished."
I get my information from the facts, and make educated factual estimations based on those facts.
So does the White House, Buster.
burrocrat
05-31-2010, 09:45 AM
rather crude armchair analysis here, sources from the internet and ever-changing estimates in the news...
9508
bottom line: the amount of oil leaking into the gulf daily is less than 3% of BP's US production, much less than one percent of total U.S. production, and negligible on a world production scale.
conclusions: the world produces a lot of oil, the U.S. consumes a lot of oil, BP is spilling a lot of oil, and it's just a drop in the bucket...
but it's a biiiiigg bucket.
XL-entLady
05-31-2010, 10:17 AM
"...Perhaps most alarming of all, 40 days and 40 nights after the Deepwater Horizon blew up and began the underwater deluge, hurricane season is at hand. It brings the horrifying possibility of wind-whipped, oil-soaked waves and water spinning ashore and coating areas much further inland. Imagine Katrina plus oil spill.
"...the only permanent solution is the drilling a relief well that would relieve the pressure on the runaway gusher in favor of a controlled pumping ... But that will take at least two months. That's not just two months of dealing with the extensive damage done until now to oceans, beaches and marshlands. It's two months more of oil pouring outward and upward — and two months more toward the heart of hurricane season and its potential to sow destruction....
"They are going to destroy south Louisiana. We are dying a slow death here," said Billy Nungesser, president of Plaquemines Parish, La.
Coastal tent cities are about to rise to house the workers and contractors charged with fixing and minimizing the damage. Sand banks and barriers are being built. But the consensus around the Gulf Coast is turning more apoplectic and apocalyptic. This is, people are starting to say, a generational event — tragic to this generation, potentially crippling to the next."
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700036430/Summer-of-oil-anger-lies-ahead-in-Gulf.html?pg=1
James48843
05-31-2010, 05:26 PM
They are cutting on stuff right now-
Live video:
http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_internet/globalbp/globalbp_uk_english/homepage/STAGING/local_assets/bp_homepage/html/rov_stream.html
A sample- from five minutes ago- here's sawing through one of the side pipes, before the blade pops out of the cut groove:
0rzF0ruBiDA
Buster
05-31-2010, 06:09 PM
Hope they're careful of sparks..we don't need a fire too..:rolleyes:
Buster
05-31-2010, 10:54 PM
Read it Buster- on today's Washington Post:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/05/30/AR2010053002195.html
I get my information from the facts, and make educated factual estimations based on those facts.
Yes, but you apparently editorialise these facts and make little to no sense when you do...
So does the White House, Buster.
Now that is funny...Do you make this up as you go?
Deflect, deflect..I read it Jim..and it said NOTHING about too much pressure...Will you please, I beg you, Please stay on point even if your inexpert opinions are the point....
Really?:nuts:..you know this How?...My God man!!!!!..what the hell are you sitting around for?..You need to Call BP and the Coast Guard and all the Scientists on the project, and, and OBAMA.. and tell them to halt and not try this or even attempt it..because, YOU know there is too much pressure and it wont' work
So you made your claim to be an expert here on May 29th, long before this non-relevant article you posted came out May 31st...Yeah man, you are one smart cookie based on FACTS before they are published, even when they're not..HA,HA!:laugh:
http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=274042&postcount=193
XL-entLady
05-31-2010, 11:10 PM
Deflect, deflect..I read it Jim..and it said NOTHING about too much pressure...Will you please, I beg you, Please stay on point even if your inexpert opinions are the point....
So you made your claim to be an expert here on May 29th, long before this non-relevant article you posted came out May 31st...Yeah man, you are one smart cookie based on FACTS before they are published, even when they're not..HA,HA!:laugh:
"...Some drilling experts said that the "top kill" effort failed over the weekend because the force of the oil and gas pushing up from the reservoir 13,000 feet below the seafloor was so great that it had shoved most of the drilling mud through the blowout preventer and into the sea.
Tadeusz W. Patzek, chairman of petroleum and geosystems engineering at the University of Texas at Austin, said it was the "equivalent of six or seven fire hoses blasting oil and gas up, while two fire hoses were used to blast the drilling mud down. They never stood much of a chance." ..."
This was in the article I read by following James's link, buddy. What article were you reading?
James48843
06-01-2010, 05:28 AM
Here is one for your conspiracy theory, Buster.
How is it that Haliburton bought the small company "Boots and Coots", on April 10, 2010- just ten days before the Gulf blowout?
Boots and Coots being, of course, the tiny company known for putting out oil well fires, and dealing with pressure problems? The company responsible for putting out 1/3rd of all the oil well fires in Kuwait back in Gulf War I? The little company dating back to 1978. when Ed "Coots" Matthews started his own company after spinning off of Red Adair's company? The same Ed Matthews who was found dead back on March 31, 2010?
Isn't it amazing that Ed dies on March 31? And then Haliburton pulls off a coup and buys the company for just $3 a share-- of which only slightly more than half was cash- the balance was Haliburton stock- on April 10, just 10 days before the biggest blowout in Oil company history???
http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/investing/halliburton-snaps-up-boots-and-coots/19435689/
Think about that one for a bit....
nnuut
06-01-2010, 07:23 AM
Now that's funny right there! 9509
Warrenlm
06-01-2010, 07:29 AM
New debate is about requiring BP to compensate those employees and businesses who claim losses but have no documentation, because they do everything in cash. BP is asking for receipts and tax returns to document compensation requirements.
One on the fly opinion on the radio was that the USG would require BP to make a lumpsum payment to the USG and then it would be administered to payout to those impacted but not possessing proof. Right up this administration's alley.
Buster
06-01-2010, 07:55 AM
Here is one for your conspiracy theory, Buster.
...
What conspiracy theory???!!??..Where do get this stuff?:D:D:laugh:
Silverbird
06-01-2010, 10:48 AM
I'm hearing this song (parody)in my head.
"What shall we do with the drunken sailor?" "Put mine on the rocks (hiccup)" (the last stanza of the Ballad of the Exxon Valdez):sick:
BBC:
BP's shares fall 17% after plan to stop oil leak fails
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/10202162.stm
Warrenlm
06-01-2010, 10:54 AM
That's why Birchtree is a buyer now. They do seem to have a nice dividend and a lot of revenue.
James48843
06-01-2010, 07:49 PM
Put a cork in it?
Nope. That won't work either. Too much pressure coming out to cork it.
But hey- I wish them good luck with that.
Let's see:
Large dome didn't work.
Small "top hat" didn't work.
"Topkill" procedure didn't work.
So now they are going to try to cut and cap.
Yah- good luck with that.
My prediction- how I envision it- (not that I want this, but this is what I think will happen)
1. Cut and cap won't work.
2. Gusher will continue to gush.
3. BP will keep trying, by cutting, crimping, stuffing, etc. Nothing will work.
4. About three months from now, maybe four months, they will finally get either the second or third well drilled, and will try to intercept the pipe several thousand feet below the sea floor. It's hitting a 14 inch pipe on an angle, from 4 miles away, and hoping that you hit it squarely the first time. Cause that's all you are gonna get.
If they get lucky then, they'll relieve enough pressure out of the pipe to be able to do the "topkill" procedure again, IF they can still do it then.
If they are not lucky, then it lasts another YEAR.
We'll see.
Hey Buster- you see today's news?
AUGUST. That's what they are talking about now- it will be at least AUGUST before they have two more wells drilled, and then they hope that can relieve the pressure enough to cap this one.
BP Seeks to Divert Oil Flow Until Relief Well Is Done (Update1)
June 01, 2010, 5:13 PM EDT More From Businessweek
(Updates with hurricane strategy in seventh paragraph. For more on the Gulf of Mexico oil spill, see {EXT4 <GO>}.)
By Jim Polson
June 1 (Bloomberg) -- BP Plc said it won’t be able to stop the flow of oil from a gushing well in Gulf of Mexico until August when a relief well can be finished, and in the meantime it will divert as much of the oil as it can to surface ships.
The diversion strategy, unlike capping the flow, is subject to disruption by tropical storms and hurricanes.
The oil spill, the worst in U.S. history, so far has soiled 100 miles (161 kilometers) of coastline, brought the Gulf’s exploratory deep-water drilling to a halt, shut down more than a fourth of its fishing areas and cost BP almost
$1 billion.
Interim efforts to stop the leak, estimated by government scientists last week at 12,000 barrels to 19,000 barrels a day, are over after the failure of an attempt to stanch the flow called “top kill,” Thad Allen, the U.S. government’s national commander for the incident, said.
“We’re talking about containing the well,” Allen said. “We don’t want to restrict the pressure or flow down that well bore because I don’t think we know the condition of it after the top kill.”
BP had hoped to plug the well before today’s arrival of hurricane season in the Gulf, where warm waters can help create devastating storms. In 2005, hurricanes Katrina and Rita tore through the Gulf with winds of 170 miles per hour, toppling production platforms, setting rigs adrift and rupturing pipelines.
more: http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-06-01/bp-seeks-to-divert-oil-flow-until-relief-well-is-done-update1-.html
So there you have it Buster. Straight from Businessweek magazine. August, at the earliest.
If you want tomorrow's news headline, Buster, just ask, and we'll post it in this thread here today on TSPTALK.
Well, maybe not tomorrow's headline. Maybe a couple of days from now headline, here today on TSPTALK.
Here's the scoop for you Buster- the next big headline isn't going to be pretty. It's going to be this-
Once they cut into the wellhead, and lop it off- the flow of oil is going to increase greatly.
Greatly.
The headline will be - "Spill worsens, will be worse for months".
You think it was bad before- just wait. When you get a clean, straight pipe flowing with no resistance, you're going to see a lot more dark oil flowing. Volume maybe double what it is today. Of black, gooey oil.
Bad, bad news.
Till August.
No Buster- it's not going to get better anytime soon. I only hope they still will be able to SEE WHAT THEY ARE DOING once the increased flow of oil clouds everything up. If the cameras are blinded by the deluge of new, higher flowing oil, then it's going to be even worse than it is now.
Sad stuff.
Bad, bad news.
Hey- as Sarah would say - how is that "drill baby drill" thingy working out for you, anyway?
Buster
06-01-2010, 07:56 PM
Hey Jim..Are watching the live feed??..One of us will be eating A LOT of crow real soon...hope you're hungry....At least I'm hoping for a positive outcome from this latest effort..you are looking to prove me wrong..that is what is sad!
James48843
06-01-2010, 08:04 PM
Buster, if they are able to stop the flow of oil, within the next week, I'll buy you a nice retirement dinner.
Ain't gonna happen. But I'll happily put the offer on the table.
By the way- here's some video from last week's Congressional hearings on the disaster:
http://resources.edgeboss.net/wmedia/resources/10_05_27_full.wvx
Hear from the companies directly.
I'll go watch the live feed now and see how it's going.
James48843
06-01-2010, 09:03 PM
hHA96w8zA9o
James48843
06-01-2010, 10:34 PM
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burrocrat
06-02-2010, 12:01 AM
James and Buster, i'll take you both up on the offer.
that way i'll break even and one of you buys, can we make it jumbo shrimp?
James48843
06-02-2010, 07:32 AM
James and Buster, i'll take you both up on the offer.
that way i'll break even and one of you buys, can we make it jumbo shrimp?
Shrimp Tar-tar?
Steadygain
06-02-2010, 09:32 AM
Maybe we're looking at this from a 'wrong perspective'
'When you're smiling :)
'When you're smiling :D
'The whole world smiles with you' :toung:
So let's not get lost in this one little 'episode' and let it ruin the entire movie. Gosh folks, it's just a drop in the bucket and the ocean is very huge. The ocean is simply too big for us to damage and we've proved this over our span on Earth.
Today we need to put ourselves in the place of others -- and know that there are bound to be people in other Nations that are somehow enjoying this -- because it's US and NOT them. And I know that sounds terrible -- but it's the way of Karma -- what goes around comes around and we just have to deal with it.
So today I have decided I'm not going to let anything bog me down and I want this same freedom of happiness and a deeper sense of contentment to spread everywhere.
Well I must depart -- for others are calling -- the nurse is bringing the pills and the doctor has an injection he thinks will help me.
Silverbird
06-02-2010, 10:13 AM
Broken saw- try again tommorow
http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/06/02/gulf.oil.spill/index.html?hpt=T1
Silverbird
06-02-2010, 11:11 AM
Hayward [BP CEO] urges oil industry rethink
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e1e0e21c-6e53-11df-ab79-00144feabdc0.html?ftcamp=rss
Buster
06-02-2010, 12:38 PM
Hayward [BP CEO] urges oil industry rethink
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e1e0e21c-6e53-11df-ab79-00144feabdc0.html?ftcamp=rss
Please post links, one doesn't have to register to view...thanks.:)
Steadygain
06-02-2010, 03:29 PM
Broken saw- try again tommorow
Silverbird,
I have kept up with a number of technological advancements and developments over the years and one of the biggest that stood out YEARS past was the engineering and development of 'new life forms'.
I'm totally shocked they have NOT employed this method of dealing with the oil spill. 'We' have long been able to develop new forms of life that are wholly engineered towards dealing with kind of stuff and would be million times over safer for the environment and a far better solution.
My guess is -- them using chemicals that probably make things even more toxic than the oil itself -- may be better accepted from our society than 'a life we developed'.
Well all we can do is wait for it to end. In the meantime ... have you ever considered the 'safety features' of electronic devices ???
Goodnight
XL-entLady
06-02-2010, 04:03 PM
You guys will have to make it Blackened Shrimp unless it comes from somewhere other than the Gulf or (soon) Atlantic. :sick:
wwwtractor
06-02-2010, 05:14 PM
Down here on the gulf coast we call it pre-basted seafood. Following are links where you can find it.
http://delicious.com/wwwtractor/OilSpill/
The smell of burnt oil in the morning is delicious of course!
Viva_La_Migra
06-02-2010, 06:32 PM
The smell of burnt oil in the morning is delicious of course!
I thought it was the smell of napalm that smelled so good in the morning?:D
James48843
06-02-2010, 07:27 PM
New invention-
Shrimp on the BBQ- that you don't even need charcoal. Just toss a few in the bottom of the grill, and set them on fire.
James48843
06-02-2010, 08:46 PM
From http://www.NOAA.gov
Fishery closure update: (effective June 2)
NOAA Fisheries Service revised the fishery closure effective 6:00 p.m. EDT on Wednesday, June 2. The closure now encompasses approximately 37 percent of the Gulf of Mexico exclusive economic zone. A 2,637 square mile area of the western-most boundary south of Louisiana was reopened today - oil was projected to be in this area, but was never actually observed there.
Marine mammals and turtles (effective June 1):
Sea Turtles
The total number of sea turtles verified from April 30 to June 1 within the designated spill area is 277. The on-water surveys by NOAA, the Florida Fish and Wildlife Commission and other partners working under the Unified Command captured 10 heavily oiled young turtles (8 Kemp's ridley, 1 loggerhead, 1 hawksbill) in areas 40 miles offshore on Tuesday, June 1. The turtles' behavior was abnormal, but they were responsive All the turtles were cleaned aboard the vessel, received initial veterinary care and were transported to Audubon Aquarium outside New Orleans where they are receiving further care. In addition, Louisiana Department of Fish and Wildlife captured 4 live and one dead Kemp's ridley turtle, all oiled, in waters off Grand Isle, La. A total of 24 live turtles and one dead turtle have been captured during on-water surveys. Surveys continue this week. Oil was found covering the 24 live sea turtles, the one dead sea turtle captured during a directed survey, two live stranded sea turtles caught in skimming operations and one dead stranded turtle. All others have not had visible evidence of external oil.
Of the 277 turtles verified from April 30 to June 1, a total of 232 turtles stranded dead, 20 stranded alive. Three of those subsequently died and one of the live stranded turtles –caught in marine debris -- was disentangled and released. There are 40 turtles in rehabilitation. Turtle strandings during this time period have been higher in Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama than in previous years for this same time period. This may be due in part to increased detection and reporting, but this does not fully account for the increase.
Dolphins
From April 30 to June 1, there have been 29 dead dolphins verified within the designated spill area. So far, one of the 29 dolphins had evidence of external oil. Because it was found on an oiled beach, we are unable at this time to determine whether the animal was covered in oil prior to its death or after its death. The other 28 dolphins have had no visible evidence of external oil. Since April 30, the stranding rate for dolphins in Louisiana has been higher than the historic numbers for the same time period in previous years. This may be due to increased detection and reporting and the lingering effects of the earlier observed spike in strandings.
*Strandings are defined as dead or debilitated animals that wash ashore
James48843
06-02-2010, 08:49 PM
Pensacola, Florida will be hit tomorrow- according to forecasts:
http://response.restoration.noaa.gov/book_shelf/2112_TMF72-2010-06-01-2100.pdf
The "offshore forecast" shows the edge approaching Key West by Friday, and some in loop current now:
http://response.restoration.noaa.gov/book_shelf/2109_SOFM72-2010-06-01-1900.pdf
alevin
06-02-2010, 09:09 PM
My sister's been slowly working on prepping her home in Pensacola to sell so she can move closer to family this year. I tried to urge her to get the house sold before summer (before the $8K tax credit expired and foreclosures start dumping on the market)-but she just wasn't able to move that fast-many reasons. I fear it'll take years to get it sold now that the beaches and fishing and economy will be impacted longterm. who'd want to move there unless they have to now?
It is a small house tho-if people are looking to downsize into something more affordable (assuming they can get a mortgage) and willing to put sweat equity into it....hmmm-maybe it getting sold is not the impossible dream after all-if she gets it up for sale this year and no later.
burrocrat
06-02-2010, 09:31 PM
You guys will have to make it Blackened Shrimp unless it comes from somewhere other than the Gulf or (soon) Atlantic. :sick:
never had blackened scrimps, but they got some good blackened alligator on a stick in Nagogdoches LA (pronounced nakka-tesh loo-zee-anna if i remember correctly).
after working 6-12's+ all week at a sawmill across the line, we would head there for sunday brunch, little place on the river ?canal? fancy white linen and everything, now i'm usually a biscuits and gravy type but they had the best eggs benedict in the lower 48, and i've never tried it in the other two.
then it was off to the drive-in margarita stand for a couple of adult slushies, no better way to start the day, surprising what you can run into down there.
James48843
06-02-2010, 10:31 PM
pzNHjguvpAM
Steadygain
06-03-2010, 09:02 AM
[QUOTE=James48843;274365]
A 2,637 square mile area of the western-most boundary south of Louisiana was reopened today - oil was projected to be in this area, but was never actually observed there.
Sea Turtles
277 turtles verified from April 30 to June 1
Dolphins
29 dead dolphins verified[/QUOTE
I think these are totally seperate issues. 'They' have no choice but to open as many areas as possible to shipping and do whatever they can to keep things flowing.
To even pretend -- or remotely believe the damage is limited to 29 dolphins and 277 sea turtles is absolutely ridiculous. The BEST thing they could do is more elaborate on the species that are most sensitive to even 'LOW oil contamination' - Humans, dophins, turtles and such....
Then they should stress all other species -- oysters for instance being able to deal with 1,000 times more oil than most species.
The most important and far reaching aspect is NOT how many have actually died. The most important aspect is knowing what is presently happening to every species that has faced exposure and continues to face it.
Anyway -- I guess it will all come out down the line. :mad::mad::mad:
James48843
06-03-2010, 04:40 PM
They are working on adding a washer to a shaft-
http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_internet/globalbp/globalbp_uk_english/homepage/STAGING/local_assets/bp_homepage/html/rov_stream.html
James48843
06-03-2010, 05:21 PM
Updated complex computer modeling released today:
Ocean currents likely to carry oil along Atlantic coast
June 03, 2010
News Release
Multimedia Gallery (http://www2.ucar.edu/news/oil-spill-animations)
BOULDER, Colorado—A detailed computer modeling study released today indicates that oil from the massive spill in the Gulf of Mexico might soon extend along thousands of miles of the Atlantic coast and open ocean as early as this summer. The modeling results are captured in a series of dramatic animations produced by the National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR) and collaborators.
This animation shows one scenario of how oil released at the location of the Deepwater Horizon disaster on April 20 in the Gulf of Mexico may move in the upper 65 feet of the ocean. This is not a forecast, but rather, it illustrates a likely dispersal pathway of the oil for roughly four months following the spill. It assumes oil spilling continuously from April 20 to June 20.
The colors represent a dilution factor ranging from red (most concentrated) to beige (most diluted). The dilution factor does not attempt to estimate the actual barrels of oil at any spot; rather, it depicts how much of the total oil from the source that will be carried elsewhere by ocean currents. For example, areas showing a dilution factor of 0.01 would have one-hundredth the concentration of oil present at the spill site.
The animation is based on a computer model simulation, using a virtual dye, that assumes weather and current conditions similar to those that occur in a typical year. It is one of a set of six scenarios released today that simulate possible pathways the oil might take under a variety of oceanic conditions. Each of the six scenarios shows the same overall movement of oil through the Gulf to the Atlantic and up the East Coast. However, the timing and fine-scale details differ, depending on the details of the ocean currents in the Gulf. The full set of six simulations can be found here (http://www2.ucar.edu/news/oil-spill-animations). (Visualization by Tim Scheitlin and Mary Haley, NCAR; based on model simulations.) [Download high resolution video (http://www.ucar.edu/multimedia/videos/2010/2monCol4.1386x1054-trimmed.mov)]
pE-1G_476nA
The research was supported in part by the National Science Foundation, NCAR’s sponsor. The results were reviewed by scientists at NCAR and elsewhere, although not yet submitted for peer-review publication.
alevin
06-03-2010, 09:37 PM
I find myself reacting like I did in my Watergate years-its all making me so sick I can't watch or read, except in tiny samples. I checked out the 6 different modeled routes at the link above, couldn't make myself read any of the text. Eeesh.
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