Tracking TSP Returns

[burrocrat]

Ask and you shall recieve!

A few weeks ago I made up my mind to do a better job of managing my personal finances in general, and to get an accurate (honest) picture of my TSP performance specifically.

That led to conversations and/or contributions from Boghie, Nasa1974, Scout, and Tsptalk.

I am excited about what I have found so far. It is amazing to learn how different folks have arrived at similar solutions to the same problem. I'm sure there are others out there too.

Now is a great time to get on track with a system that works and start new year off on the right foot.

Thanks you guys for sharing the fruits of your labor.

I didn't want to clutter up any one person's thread and didn't see a forum or thread where it might belong so it is here on the bulletin board.

[Show-me]

What you going to do?

[burrocrat]

I was (not very diligently) using an outdated version of 2005 money software and wanted to upgrade to something that could track investments too, particularly TSP. Also, I almost certainly think I'm a better investor than I actually am and as my TSP balance grows I want to refine my strategy and give myself a better shot .

That starts with taking an honest look at how succesful my past performance was. I found out that Quicken Premier will (automatically if you want) keep track of multiple checking/savings accounts and brokerage/roth ira accounts for a good 'net worth' picture.

Turns out that there are utilities on this site that also allow it to track tsp, including the L-funds. That was important to me because up until June of this year I always had some in those funds, mostly L2040, and I need to evaluate a few years of contributions and transfers.

But it costs about $90, has a steep learning curve, and will take a while to populate with past transactions.

The size of that job gets a little intimidating, and may require some motivation to complete.

[burrocrat]

I have been given three different spreadsheets that all track TSP, thanks Tsptalk, Scout, and Nasa1974.

All require that you enter ending 2009 shares and prices, then keep track as you go for 2010 performance. Simple to start and maintain, perfect timing as the new year rolls around.

When I first joined I noticed Scout's and Tsptalk's in the utilities section here, but then never made it back to follow through. Nasa1974 recently shipped me his version.

I haven't taken a detailed look yet, but I did run some pretend numbers through each to get a feel for it.

[tsptalk]

Great feedback! Thanks. What did you decide on, as far as tracking and, if you don't mind sharing, have you decided on a system or strategy for your TSP for 2010?

[tsptalk]

Woops, looks like it was answered as I was writing...

[burrocrat]

Each one does a good job of tracking TSP, but in slightly different ways. If you are looking for a system to use, I'm sure one of them will appeal to you.

None of them track the L-funds, but I understand that those aren't really meant for active trading. I don't use the L-funds anymore since June 2009 (man that sounds like a 12-step confession ... 'hello my name is burrocrat') so that's not an issue, and I can backtest past IFT's through the commercial software.

Tsptalk's seems clearly laid out and simple to use, just enter current shares and prices anytime holdings change via IFT or payroll contribution, keeps a running total.

Scout's is similar but you enter total $ amount of contribution and it splits it out for you based on % in each fund. Also has some analysis features and flags like SAFE amount to keep you on track and can split out stock funds returns from lily pad stuff.

Both of those seem to require you only update when # of shares change (or when you want get an updated peek).

Nasa1974's is pretty comprehensive with daily, weekly, and monthly performance features. Just enter shares and/or prices and it runs out a bunch of calculations for you. This one seems to be well set up for daily maintenance, if you miss a day then daily totals are off until you get a second price update in there, presumably as long as you enter fridays then weekly totals will still be accurate, same goes with monthly.

All keep a running total so that's good.

[burrocrat]

I'm still a little confused about how regular payroll contributions affect things. I think one's yearly totals with contributions will be much greater than start of year amount, so not a true gain/loss type purely on trading/investments performance.

I think that is what's wrong with the PIP thing on the TSP.gov website, just doesn't make sense to me. I suppose one could subtract out DCA contributions for a better picture of actual gains, but that number will still be higher because some of the gains will be 'interest/dividends' on the additional contributions. How do other people handle that?

Maybe I'm just thinking too much (better than talking too much I guess) but I do that too.

What tracking sytems are other's using?

Any other's out there someone wants to share?

[WorkFE]

but that number will still be higher because some of the gains will be 'interest/dividends' on the additional contributions.

Burro,
I have never seen interest/dividends on my statements, just automatic 1%, Your contribution and employer match. The only other thing that affects gains and losses is price per share. Either that or I am lost

[burrocrat]

Great feedback! Thanks. What did you decide on, as far as tracking and, if you don't mind sharing, have you decided on a system or strategy for your TSP for 2010?

That's two questions there I think?

Question 1: I haven't decided yet. I will eventually configure and use Quicken to work with TSP but that will take awhile and might not show me the simple breakdown I'm looking for. I will probably play with all three spreadsheets until I settle on one or modify one to my taste. I've only taken each for a quick drive, I'm sure there's some things I'm missing.

[burrocrat]

Burro,
I have never seen interest/dividends on my statements, just automatic 1%, Your contribution and employer match. The only other thing that affects gains and losses is price per share. Either that or I am lost


Poor choice of words on my part. Let me see if I can explain my thinking here:

Let's say you start the year with $100 in your account. You contribute (with match) $10 per month. You finish the year with $300 in your account.

That looks like 200% return, but it really isn't since $120 of it was just your own money contributed. Subtract contributions out and you have $80 profit = 80% return? But not really because some of the value of the extra $80 is gains (increase in share prices) on some of the shares the $120 in contributions bought you?

Does that make sense? (don't ever let me write a math story-problems textbook).

[burrocrat]

I'm sure there's a two-word technical term for that phenomenom that better describes my essay there, but it escapes me.

I'm a think outlouder and just writing it down seems to have helped.

I bet the math to track that number is to complex to do internally with your real account. Why bother, all one has to do is make a 'pretend' account with a set beginning amount, never add or subtract from original capital, and then mirror your trades in that.

That should give you a pure gain/loss based only on trading activity?

That is what I was trying to say, I think.

[WorkFE]

Got it.
Tracking interest or dividends if we acquired those would actually be easy.
If I track the closing price everytime I purchase one would think I could track my gains/losses at years end.
If your annual contributions are be used to calculate the PIP that would seem munipulative.
Seems like alot of information to track especially if you don't B&H

[burrocrat]

Great feedback! Thanks. What did you decide on, as far as tracking and, if you don't mind sharing, have you decided on a system or strategy for your TSP for 2010?

Question 2 trading strategy: When i can identify a trading range/channel I think I'm going to continue with #3, the 'multifund swing trade' model, see:
http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=76255&postcount=8, I call it the 'small baskets were on sale' strategy, see: http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showthread.php?t=7883 post #4.

I'm afraid, however, that after tracking/analyzing my trading history and performance that i'm going to discover that I'm more of a #6, 'the little chicken inside my head told me too'.

That's what I'm trying to fix here.

[burrocrat]

I know I should be careful what I ask for, time is precious, and there's many times it would have been convenient to turn back the clock.

But I wish the new year would hurry up and get here so I can start using these cool spreadsheets.

Please, please, please let's see a big drop today, and keep it coming, so I can get back on the birchtrain at a discount after the first of the month.

[Scout333]

I'm still a little confused about how regular payroll contributions affect things. I think one's yearly totals with contributions will be much greater than start of year amount, so not a true gain/loss type purely on trading/investments performance.

I think that is what's wrong with the PIP thing on the TSP.gov website, just doesn't make sense to me. I suppose one could subtract out DCA contributions for a better picture of actual gains, but that number will still be higher because some of the gains will be 'interest/dividends' on the additional contributions. How do other people handle that?

Maybe I'm just thinking too much (better than talking too much I guess) but I do that too.

What tracking sytems are other's using?

Any other's out there someone wants to share?

Burro, I just link my spreadsheet amounts to another worksheet to cut down on the input. i.e. dates, TSP totals, etc. and put in a simple formula to calculate return on my TSP account. Looks like (current account value-beginning account value) -total contributions year to date/ beginning account value. i.e. (10,000-5000)-3000= 2,000/5000 =40% return

One quirk, if you receive matching contributions you will have to decide whether that is part of your return or not. You can leave it in and your return% will be higher or take it out and your return will more closely represent what your actual earnings were. Enjoy!:)

[Boghie]

Burrocrat,

The statistic you are seeking is called an Internal Rate of Return.

You are very close to describing it when you take what was in the account at a certain time (2009/12/31) and subtract that number from a later date (2010/12/31) and then subtract your contributions.

You have also hit the nail on the head regarding the complexity of the math. Your example was simple, but let me confuse everyone::confused:

Instead of contributing $10 a month for a year in 2009, let's add this to the equation.

From 2009/01/01 to 2009/03/31 you contribute $5.
From 2009/04/01 you see that you can buy equities on sale and contribute $20.

Now, how do you do the math???

The earlier contributions are earning (or losing) money for a longer time than the latter ones. But, the latter ones are larger and thus affect the earnings more per day. Yowser:confused:

That is why Quicken is good. Make certain to use the Buy/Sell rather than the Add/Remove to manage contributions and allocation changes. That is where the 'Decoder Wheel' comes in handy. Also, maybe initiate the use of Quicken at the new year. Then you are not face with going the Whole Monty on day one. You can backdate enter 2009 on a boring non-sports Sunday in March or something:)

I use the TSP spreadsheet for allocation management. And, once your account builds its asset base your contributions will not affect it dramatically. Plus, you can modify the percentages every payday anyway. Will be looking at Scout's and requesting NASA's.

[James48843]

You guys get waaayyy to caught up in details.

I look at it this way-

Did I end up with more $$$$$ at the end of the year, then I had at the beginning?

If yes -> GOOD. I like it that way.
If no -> Ah shucks.


Worked real well until 2008 came along. I am still licking my wounds out of that.

Other than that, everything else is gravy.


7789

[Boghie]

You guys get waaayyy to caught up in details.

I look at it this way-

Did I end up with more $$$$$ at the end of the year, then I had at the beginning?

If yes -> GOOD. I like it that way.
If no -> Ah shucks.


Worked real well until 2008 came along. I am still licking my wounds out of that.

Other than that, everything else is gravy.


7789

James,

It does get kinda annal :o

Just downloaded Quicken 2010 (was using 2008). It makes investment performance a one click event. No more funny reports you have to play with. Just click the 'Investing' tab then click the 'Performance' button.

And, it gives the performance for the indexes we use.

[Birchtree]

Gee, there is only one n in anal - even phil knows that much.

[mayday]

Gee, there is only one n in anal - even phil knows that much.

Leave it to Birch to pick up on that word.:D

[Boghie]

Gee, there is only one n in anal - even phil knows that much.

I'm not real aNal about spelling, though:p

I think I'm going to sue UCSD.

Phil would tell you that the two 'n' version of anal is spelled annal. That is the way it is spelled, that is the way it should be, and here is a wiki proof of that (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annal).

Then, he would hope you don't read his link...

Here is just one example (http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showpost.php?p=247962&postcount=31).

:)

[burrocrat]

You guys get waaayyy to caught up in details.

I look at it this way-

Did I end up with more $$$$$ at the end of the year, then I had at the beginning?

If yes -> GOOD. I like it that way.
If no -> Ah shucks.


Worked real well until 2008 came along. I am still licking my wounds out of that.

Other than that, everything else is gravy.



7789


I'm with you there James, here's to plenty of gravy for all of us in 2010, if I can beat the 20% each allocation then I'll be happy.

Of course, if you know exactly how much gravy you got, it makes it a lot easier to order the potatoes.

[Boghie]

Of course, if you know exactly how much gravy you got, it makes it a lot easier to order the potatoes.

I think Quicken 2010 is a tremendous upgrade.

All that stuff about clicking reports, choosing investment reports, blah, blah, blah...

All you have to do is select your TSP account (I called mine 'Federal TSP 401(k)', then select the 'Performance' button. Viola, you have an annual chart, a 1 year, 3 year, and 5 year IRR, and value verse cost basis.

I am a happy vacationer.

Thanks Burrocrat.

[Bullitt]

I tried to track my TSP in Microsoft Money for about a year and half and then stopped. I intended to track my cost basis and actual percent gains. Yes, the percentages were off from what the tsp tracker excel file gave me because the excel doesn't provide for contribution allocations or buy-ins on a portfolio rebalance. I missed one pay period in July or so and when I tried to fix it I just said, "WTF am I spending time adding and subtracting shares for? Am I going to spend 10 minutes on this every pay day for the next 30 years?" I no longer bother with the cost basis.

You can probably get the same advice (or better) from a book on portfolio indexing than what Quicken can tell you weekly. Yeah, it might remind you to rebalance every now and then, but if you take the asset allocation approach, then the day to day moves should no longer matter in your investment outlook. Unfortunately too many on this MB spend their time looking at 15 minute charts and then can only claim that the market is rigged after they realize they are down 15% and the market is up 5%.

I wish you guys luck, not only in developing your system, but more importantly, staying the course.

[Boghie]

Bullitt,

I use Quicken mostly for my bank account and loans. However, the investment stuff become real good sometime aroung 2006 or so. That is also around the time I started poking around...

For me, this is not part of a system. I am more wedded to 'Buckets of Money' and Ric Edelman portfolios than market timing. But, I can look at actual numbers. They kinda kick you in the noggin. No more wishful thinking.

In fact, the only transaction(s) I have made this month have been to allocate to a moderate portfolio I picked from 'The Lies About Money'. I flubbed the first one (using a very fallible memory) - so, the next one rejiggered my allocation to what I wanted.

Hopefully, I can bore Tom and the rest of you to tears in 2010:p

[burrocrat]

So I'm doing a little advance work on these tracking spreadsheets. I plan to use all three at first here and see how it goes.

Tsptalk: I was going to enter # of shares (I don't plan on a IFT tomorrow)and then just have to enter tomorrow's closing prices for the baseline. But I notice on this spreadsheet one enters % instead. So I will have to wait until tomorrow's close to get exact percentages of my tsp holdings.

It looks like I will enter those in row 6 (the gray area) under 'Fund Price' correct? Do I also enter 2009 closing % in row 6 too?

Then whenever shares change I just start on row 7 with 'Trans' 1 and fill in both price and current %? The spreadsheet does the rest right?

Column S shows returns of last trade, Column T shows returns YTD, and if I fill in the L-funds data then I can do more comparison at the bottom?

Did I miss anything?

[burrocrat]

You can probably get the same advice (or better) from a book on portfolio indexing ...

Got any reccomendations?

[burrocrat]

The statistic you are seeking is called an Internal Rate of Return ... Make certain to use the Buy/Sell rather than the Add/Remove to manage contributions and allocation changes.

Yes, those were the droids I was looking for, thanks.

Do I also use the Buy/Sell when starting out in Quicken, or just for subsequent changes?

I don't have it in front of me right now so I can't check, maybe it's self explanatory when setting it up?

[burrocrat]

Scout: yours takes %'s too so when I have the closing for tomorrow after the TSP.gov website updates, then I enter data on row 7 right? Stock/Cash values, fund prices, and porfolio value in cell T7?

After that just follow tips tab and enter when contributions or IFT's happens, spreadsheet does the rest?

[Bullitt]

The beauty of TSP is that when you make an IFT you input the percent you'd like in each fund. Seeing that TSP has only a few funds, it's very very easy to maintain a balanced portfolio. Most 401K's are made up of 12-20 crummy mutual funds run by a retirement manager. With TSP we can easily maintain a portfolio that many followers of John Bogle lay awake dreaming of, and that being a 30%C, 30% I, 30% F allocation. Set it and forget it- or so they say.

Boghie, I also like Ric Edelman and it's funny how in his earlier work he recommended trying to find a fund that outperforms while recently he's been on an index fund kick. Anyway, he does give very good money/investment advice. In fact, I'm looking at his book, The Truth About Money (http://www.amazon.com/Truth-About-Money-3rd/dp/0060566582/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_3), on my shelf right now. I'm with you on your thoughts on an indexed portfolio with a smart allocation.

One good thing about figuring the cost average was seeing first hand how well it works once we bounced off the March lows. Bottom line: Saving money and investing it bi-weekly into a managed portfolio of index funds works.

[grandma]

....being a 30%C, 30% I, 30% F allocation. Set it and forget it- or so they say.


...30% in F ? What do you do with the other 10%?:o

[Bullitt]

Burrocrat: If you're looking for books on indexing, I would start with The Little Book of Common Sense Investing (http://www.amazon.com/Little-Book-Common-Sense-Investing/dp/0470102101/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262220216&sr=8-1).

Any book by Larry Swedroe works just as good. Here's another (http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Winning-Investment-Strategy-Youll/dp/0312339879/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262220306&sr=1-5)on my shelf.

Coffee House Investor (http://www.amazon.com/New-Coffeehouse-Investor-Wealth-Ignore/dp/B002UXRZ7Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262220283&sr=1-1) is my personal favorite.

Richard Ferri has written a few good books on indexing. Here's All About Asset Allocation (http://www.amazon.com/About-Asset-Allocation-Richard-Ferri/dp/0071429581/ref=pd_sim_b_4).

Another classic, Intelligent Asset Allocator (http://www.amazon.com/Intelligent-Asset-Allocator-Portfolio-Maximize/dp/0071362363/ref=pd_sim_b_3) by William Bernstein.

Read these five books and you'll know more than 95% of your co-workers when it comes to investing.

[burrocrat]

Nasa1974: in row 5 4-Jan I entered my # of shares from TSP.gov website and price per share just to see (i'll update prices after the close), after that i just update prices daily, only update shares when they change due to contribution or IFT?

Also put in total porfolio value after the close tomorrow on the daily-weekly-monthly tabs and it does the rest?

The Fund% tab updates automatically it looks like, and i can add Tracker position and % just to see.

Looks like I'm good to go, let's get this party started.

[burrocrat]

Burrocrat: If you're looking for books on indexing, I would start with The Little Book of Common Sense Investing (http://www.amazon.com/Little-Book-Common-Sense-Investing/dp/0470102101/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262220216&sr=8-1).

Any book by Larry Swedroe works just as good. Here's another (http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Winning-Investment-Strategy-Youll/dp/0312339879/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262220306&sr=1-5)on my shelf.

Coffee House Investor (http://www.amazon.com/New-Coffeehouse-Investor-Wealth-Ignore/dp/B002UXRZ7Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262220283&sr=1-1) is my personal favorite.

Richard Ferri has written a few good books on indexing. Here's All About Asset Allocation (http://www.amazon.com/About-Asset-Allocation-Richard-Ferri/dp/0071429581/ref=pd_sim_b_4).

Another classic, Intelligent Asset Allocator (http://www.amazon.com/Intelligent-Asset-Allocator-Portfolio-Maximize/dp/0071362363/ref=pd_sim_b_3) by William Bernstein.

Read these five books and you'll know more than 95% of your co-workers when it comes to investing.

Thanks Bullit,

I'll start with Bogle, and if i add in James's book suggestion then I've almost got enough for free shipping already.

Also noted is the advice about staying the course.

[Bullitt]

...30% in F ? What do you do with the other 10%?

Speculate. No, no just kidding. I meant for the final 10% to go in the G fund.

Of course, that was a hypothetical portfolio. The rule of thumb is age in bonds, so I'd say 30 F 10 G would be suitable for someone around 40-45 years old.

[Scout333]

Scout: yours takes %'s too so when I have the closing for tomorrow after the TSP.gov website updates, then I enter data on row 7 right? Stock/Cash values, fund prices, and porfolio value in cell T7?

After that just follow tips tab and enter when contributions or IFT's happens, spreadsheet does the rest?

Burro, Just put in your fund balances for each fund on line 7 and 12-31-09 share prices as a beginning point for 2010. Fairly self-explanatory. Check the tips tab for helpful hints,quirks, etc. Hope to have the 2010 version out early next week. Good luck!

[nasa1974]

Nasa1974: in row 5 4-Jan I entered my # of shares from TSP.gov website and price per share just to see (i'll update prices after the close), after that i just update prices daily, only update shares when they change due to contribution or IFT?
I copy/paste the shares daily unless I change the percentages in each fund. Then I input the current shares.

Also put in total porfolio value after the close tomorrow on the daily-weekly-monthly tabs and it does the rest?
If I remember correctly it is in the top left hand corner.

The Fund% tab updates automatically it looks like, and i can add Tracker position and % just to see.

Looks like I'm good to go, let's get this party started.

I will double check tomorrow at work but I believe you are correct.

[nasa1974]

Originally Posted by burrocrat http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showthread.php?p=248042#post248042)
Nasa1974: in row 5 4-Jan I entered my # of shares from TSP.gov website and price per share just to see (i'll update prices after the close), after that i just update prices daily, only update shares when they change due to contribution or IFT?
I copy/paste the shares daily unless I change the percentages in each fund. Then I input the current shares.
You are correct for updating shares. You will change the shares depending on contributions (every payday) or IFT's made (including any <1% IFT's).
I use the TSP website to verify my shares after making a contribution or an IFT.

Also put in total porfolio value after the close tomorrow on the daily-weekly-monthly tabs and it does the rest?
If I remember correctly it is in the top left hand corner.

The Fund% tab updates automatically it looks like, and i can add Tracker position and % just to see.
Correct. Inside the funds tab everything should be automatic. The tracker feature is just an FYI to see how you are moving up or down the tracker.
If you wanted to you could add extra columns to track how some of your friends are doing also. :laugh:

[burrocrat]

I didn't expect TSP.gov to update so soon, thought I'd have to wait until Monday. But I've got all three populated with 2009 ending data and ready to go.

Since they're all the same software it occurs to me that I could enter current values in a new simple spreadsheet and then copy/paste or 'call' the new data into each one instead of typing it each time. I'll have to look into that after we're up and going for a bit. Maybe the 1212 files or decoder wheel may already have that, eliminating typing altother, I haven't look at them closely yet.

Happy new year all.

[Boghie]

Quicken 2010 provided the IRR for the following indexes:

S&P 500:

1 Year: 20.69%
3 Year: -7.19%
5 Year: -0.50%
Russell 2000:

1 Year: 24.68%
3 Year: -7.64%
5 Year: -0.65%
DOW:

1 Year: 16.64%
3 Year: -5.44%
5 Year: -0.46%

By the way, the new TSP web site (in beta) looks real good. They have a bunch of the same stats as the above. I think this is a reflection of BlackRock purchasing the account.

[Scout333]

Hello FERS employees out there, I am working on a return on investment calculator for TSP and I wondered how matching contributions are reported on the TSP accounts for FERS employees. Are they reported seperately so you can easily tell how much of the contributions into your TSP account are yours vs. government matching contributions? I am a CSRS Offset employee and don't receive matching contributions so I don't worry about matching vs. my contributions. I just back mine out and compute my rate of return. Would appreciate anyone who could give me a quick description of how this is reported for FERS employees. Thanks,

[burrocrat]

Scout,

TSP contributions for FERS employees are shown on TSP.gov website as total amount in. It does not split out how much is employee contribution and how much is matching funds government contribution.

The Earnings and Leave Statement only shows employee contribution taken out of gross pay.

If one is contributing 5% of gross salary, then the number on the E&L statement is exactly 1/2 of amount shown as what TSP.gov shows as 'deposited'.

Happy New Year.

[burrocrat]

They say knowledge is power, but who knew it could also be so inexpensive?

Soon (within 5-9 business days, free shipping is cool) I'll be expanding my horizons, today I'm just working on expanding my waistline - Sunday brunch.

Thanks for the suggestions James and Bullitt, Today I was going to start eating better and exercising more, oh and quit smoking and drinking, but you guys have given me so much to work with I'll just have to put those other things on the back burner for a bit, the mind is a terrible thing, To Waist!

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[Boghie]

Hello FERS employees out there, I am working on a return on investment calculator for TSP and I wondered how matching contributions are reported on the TSP accounts for FERS employees. Are they reported seperately so you can easily tell how much of the contributions into your TSP account are yours vs. government matching contributions? I am a CSRS Offset employee and don't receive matching contributions so I don't worry about matching vs. my contributions. I just back mine out and compute my rate of return. Would appreciate anyone who could give me a quick description of how this is reported for FERS employees. Thanks,

Scout,

That will be a tough one. It probably is functionally impossible to use any of the data provided to generate IRRs for the individual funds. However, the automatic 'Agency 1%' and 'Matching Contributions' are shown on the quarterly and annual reports. Together, those are the matching contributions you mention.

What I do is to take the whole contribution dollar ammount (mine and matching) and break it up by the percentages. That gives me a dollar amount per fund that I am contributing to. Then, if you want you can multiply those by the ratio of matching/total contribution to get the matching dollar amount.

Personally, I don't break out my and my matching contributions. It will not affect the IRR. Kinda just more mulla going into the account. You can think of it as a pay period bonus:)

[Scout333]

Thanks for the info re the FERS matching contributions! Mine will be a very basic return calculator. No need to get too fancy.:)

[beafet]

I keep track of my TSP using mint.com

You link your actual TSP account to it.
Oh yeah, it's free.

[JTH]

I keep track of my TSP using mint.com

You link your actual TSP account to it.
Oh yeah, it's free.

Looks like a pretty cool sight for us Excell-graph challenged, how do you like it?

[burrocrat]

I keep track of my TSP using mint.com

You link your actual TSP account to it.
Oh yeah, it's free.

I heard about that place. I assume you store your password and it goes there and updates balances? Does it offer any returns annalysis (there's that double n word again)?

I'm a little nervous about storing financial info in the cloud. On the other hand why worry, if someone steals my identity they are gonna get what they deserve, hell maybe they'll even improve my credit rating.

Didn't need it anyway, don't borrow anymore, have gotten quite comfortable saving and doing without, peace of mind has it's own value. Only debt is a student loan at a fixed 1.50% (1.25% for doing the auto-debit thing), even if i had the money it wouldn't pencil out to pay it off. Also because of my only recent boarding on the fed bus i qualify for the IBR repayment plan, they just take a certain percentage of my income. Eventually i will gradute to the ICR plan, and at some point just be making standard payments. Bonus is the public service forgiveness option, after ten years of payments they wipe whatever balance due away. I will never pay more than the monthly standard 10-yr payment, benefit comes from the period of time i paid less than that. figures to be about $16,000 forgiven down the road, unless i hit the lottery or they decide i'm just too dangerous to actually do the work and promote me to management.

[beafet]

Looks like a pretty cool sight for us Excell-graph challenged, how do you like it?

I like it a lot. It's not perfect, but works good enough for me. Keeps everything pretty simple and graphical.

It sometimes doesn't update as quickly as I would like, but other than that, I haven't had any problems with it. I use it for a lot more than just my TSP though.

For the security conscious:http://www.mint.com/features/security/

[burrocrat]

The TSP.gov website is still showing shares/prices from COB 12/31/09 this morning so I can't update the spreadsheets yet.

I haven't seen anything about this beta version of a new website others have mentioned.

[nasa1974]

The TSP.gov website is still showing shares/prices from COB 12/31/09 this morning so I can't update the spreadsheets yet.

I haven't seen anything about this beta version of a new website others have mentioned.

burrocrat, I use this site to update my daily price per share. Just go to the top left hand corner of this page and click on the LOGO. Then scroll down about 2/3rd's and there it is.

[burrocrat]

burrocrat, I use this site to update my daily price per share. Just go to the top left hand corner of this page and click on the LOGO. Then scroll down about 2/3rd's and there it is.

roger that, done. entered prices from tsptalk and copy/pasted shares existing shares since they didn't change, profit of 0.76% yesterday, all tabs appear to update correctly and the math looks good, except for the little 'g' on the 'daily profit-loss'. even though G share price increased i get a ready of 0.00. little f,c,s,i show the right numbers and all cells have the same formula so i'm not sure why, maybe just need more coffee.

thanks nasa.

[burrocrat]

from tsptalk's spreadsheet, this one shows percent changes not dollar amounts, same results displayed differently, doesn't show returns for period or year until i get a second days worth of data in there i think (i didn't fill in ending 2009 numbers except in the fund price and fund allocation columns).

GFCSI 0.03%0.12%1.61%1.95%1.92%

[burrocrat]

from scouts, same %'s so all look like they're accurate, just display data in different formats, i'm not posting actual $ change because y'all might laugh at my small balance.

when i paste all of them in the reply they look just like the spreadsheet display, but when i actually post it it comes out modified, comma-delimited, whatever. numbers are good though.

G %F %C %S %I %ChangeChangeChangeChangeChange100.00100.00100.001 00.00100.000.0003 0.0012 0.0161 0.0195 0.0192

thanks guys.

[burrocrat]

i'll have to watch, but i think using the numbers from this site could potentially differ on occasion from tsp.gov site, maybe because of tracking proxy's for share prices vs. whatever magic tsp.gov does behind the curtain from time to time. probably so insignificant as to not matter.

[burrocrat]

So the share prices available on tsptalk this morning match exactly what is posted now on tsp.gov, no divergence.

All spreadsheets returning accurate data (and handy during tracker maintenance downtime), it's just a matter of how you like your tea, no bag for me please.

[burrocrat]

oh and i like cream and sugar, but don't call me sugar.

[Birchtree]

Please speak in soft tones when you say that name. Don't even ask...

[burrocrat]

ssshhhhugar. like that you mean?

[grandma]

the numbers are now up on the Official site, if there are any like me that have been waiting for them.......

[burrocrat]

Scout has the new 2010 version of the spreadsheet available on the utilities section of this site. It has a few columns re-ordered but is basically the same, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Jan. 04 closing prices are already entered, just put in your 2009 ending account values and allocation, update share prices when you feel like it, it's all there, trust the numbers.

I confess, i played around with the 2009 version, simple stuff like centering text in columns etc., then decided to display some cells in % instead of extended decimal places. Only later i realized it affected other calculations (and helped me figure out what i 'thought' was wrong with he other trackers - but wasn't), and ultimately just redownloaded the 2010 version and started over.

It works just fine the way it is.

[burrocrat]

I thought nasa's was not displaying day change in G fund on the Fund % tab but finally figured out it is just rounding/display. It was showing 0.00 but i wanted to see a '3' in there somewhere. Turns out there is a 3 in there at the 4th decimal place 0.0003. Back to the old extended decimal vs. % display thing. The data is correct and when the cumulative change is enough it will roll over and display one penny, no need to get too particular here.

This spreadsheet has a couple of cool features, it tracks the net changes in the funds themselves independent of your allocation for comparison purposes, if you're good at graphs/charts then this is a playground, i'm not. Also, over time the running day/monthly/yearly things hold some promise for the introspective types.

[burrocrat]

I had to beat my head against the same wall again just to be sure it still hurt, so in TspTalk's tracker i entered in allocation percents accurate to two decimal places - 59.92% vs 60%, to account for daily changes. back to the old extended decimal to % display issue. hey, sometimes it takes me a while. It makes no material difference. The data is correct no matter how you display it. I should have known that (or just trusted the expertise of those on this site), but i learn best the hard way.

Also if you enter the % allocations on each line even if they don't change then you get the period and yearly returns, should have figured out that yesterday, but in addition to the hard way i also learn best slowly.

[burrocrat]

so i'm up .76% on monday and .12% on tuesday for a +0.88% return this year. surprising since i'm 60% in the G fund, there's a lesson in there i'm sure. i'm going to keep feeling good about that until the autotracker is fixed and i see how far i am behind those with the stones to be allin in this market.

[nasa1974]

roger that, done. entered prices from tsptalk and copy/pasted shares existing shares since they didn't change, profit of 0.76% yesterday, all tabs appear to update correctly and the math looks good, except for the little 'g' on the 'daily profit-loss'. even though G share price increased i get a ready of 0.00. little f,c,s,i show the right numbers and all cells have the same formula so i'm not sure why, maybe just need more coffee.

thanks nasa.
The lower case g column shows 0.00 in my spreadsheet also. If I took the numbers out more than 2 places past the decimal point it would show a change. The important thing is that it shows the monthly total at the bottom of the current month. Glad everything is working correctly.

[burrocrat]

bottom line: i can't single out just one of these spreadsheets, but i can recommend all of them. they all work just fine, it's a matter of personal preference.

Tsptalk's: quick and dirty, easy on the eyes. (sounds like a girl i used to date)

Scout's: deadly accurate and to the point with extras. (sounds like why she dumped me)

Nasa's: complex and deep, there's a lot to understand here (sounds like why she won't go out with me anymore)

pick your poison, you can't go wrong with any of these. well, you can, but that's on you.

[alevin]

That's our burro :laugh:. I must say I got some belly laughs outside the jailcell tonight. Kudos on how you spend your time in the joint-I'd have said it there, but I'm not ready to wait for my 3 rolls of the dice to get out. Even just visiting is likely to get me mistaken for one of the inmates, which could be hazardous to my unstable state of mind. Now that just can't happen-tho I think my work attire may look similar at times-jeans and workshirt and all-on the days I get to go outside and play-the whole reason I signed up for this job in the first place.

[burrocrat]

does anyone know why the tsp fund charts shown at the bottom of the page only show data from about 10 am today?

was there a late open or something happening in the markets that i missed today?

[grandma]

Will someone explain for me why 13% in C is not the same number of shares as 13% in S? The confirmation of my IFT has come, and even though I put 13% in both C and S, the number of shares are very different...very nearly a quarter off. How can that be? :confused:

[burrocrat]

Will someone explain for me why 13% in C is not the same number of shares as 13% in S? The confirmation of my IFT has come, and even though I put 13% in both C and S, the number of shares are very different...very nearly a quarter off. How can that be? :confused:

because the share prices are different i think? 13% is the portion of your dollars invested in C and/or S but the same amount of money buys different number of shares?

say you have $100 dollars and go to the grocery store with your list. you have budgeted 13% of your cash for bread and 13% for seafood (don't want to know what you plan on shopping for with the remaining $74 - a girl needs to keep a few secrets).

you will have different numbers of loaves and fishes in you cart when you arrive at the checkout counter due to different prices on the tags.

i assume the difference in price between the funds happens over time. perhaps at inception they began at equal cost, but since then the market has valued them differently / they do not move in tandem up or down on any given day?

[tsptalk]

Yahoos quotes weren't working early Monday morning for some reason. I guess they never updated them after they came back up.

does anyone know why the tsp fund charts shown at the bottom of the page only show data from about 10 am today?

was there a late open or something happening in the markets that i missed today?

[burrocrat]

Yahoos quotes weren't working early Monday morning for some reason. I guess they never updated them after they came back up.

thanks tsptalk, so they traded normally, just technical difficulties in data service.

i was worried we had a market shutdown or suspended trading or maybe some kook was streaking through the exchange and the traders all got distracted or some such.

[nasa1974]

Grandma, Burrocrat is correct. Your shares will reflect the price per share and the percentage in the account. The example burrocrat used was 13% of $100. It might make more sense if you used $1000. 13% of $1000 is $130, take the $130 and divide it by $13 (cost per share of the C fund, I am using whole numbers) and you end up with 10 shares. Now take $130 and divide it by $17 (cost per share of the S fund) and you have 7.65 shares. Make sense?

[grandma]

thank you, burrocrat & nasa -
The more I ruminate about it, the more I think that I have been aware of it,

8543

just hadn't digested it enough to keep from being indignant when I Really Noticed it yesterday eve.

... it would sure have been nice for the `S' fund 13% to have been the shares yesterday instead of the balance!

thank you -

[Guest2]

Tom & Friends,

I use MSN Portfolio to track the Market. One HUGE change I made was
utilizing the symbol $EFDY to track the (I) Fund as the EFA is a ETF and
$EFDY represents the actual MSCI EAFE Index. (price and all). The only
problem I noticed is that $EFDY appears to be unique to MSN. ;)