Attention: Transfer Limits in the Auto Tracker

[tsptalk]

Attention AutoTracker Members:

It was brought to our attention that some members are making more interfund transfers in the auto tracker than the TSP would allow.

Although the software has not yet been set up to prohibit the excess transfers, we will be looking to make sure any interfund transfers made after #2 is only a move to increase the allocation in the G fund, same as the TSP. Otherwise, some will be playing within the TSP rules, and some not and it will make for an unfair comparison, and an unrealistic simulated TSP account.

If anyone happens to see others making extra transactions in the autotracker, please let us know so we can remove the transfer.

Here is the rule:

- You can make 2 IFT's per month.

- After that, only IFT's that increase the G fund allocation, without increasing any other fund's allocation, will be allowed.

- A transfer made on the last day of the month before the 12 noon ET deadline, will count toward the prior month's transfer. Any transfer made after the 12 noon ET deadline on the last day of the month counts toward the next month's transfers.


If anyone continues to go over the limit, we will have to impose some sort of penalty and/or disqualify them from any tally listing.

Thanks for your cooperation in this matter.

Tom
tsptalk

TSP's rule summary:

The Federal Retirement Thrift Investment Board (Agency) amends its interfund transfer (IFT) regulations to limit the number of interfund transfer requests to two per calendar month. After a participant has made two interfund transfers in a calendar month, the participant may make additional interfund transfers only into the Government Securities Investment (G) Fund until the first day of the next calendar month.

[Guest2]

Tom, I sent you a PM concerning why the rules you've highlighted
below don't necessarily hold true. I don't wish to confuse anyone
on the Board, so please check it out. ;)

[tsptalk]

Hi all -

We can go in and check every transfer, but we decided not to do that since it had never been officially made into a rule here. We have kept half an eye on this and the problem does not appear to be widespread, nor overly abused. But obviously some extra transfers were getting through. We will not go back and make adjustments to extra transfers made prior to today.

The new interfund transfer limit in the autotracker will officially begin today. See post #1 above.

Thanks again!

[James48843]

Just a note-

I DID make an adjustment, not a transfer, in the autotracker this month. I have had a lot going into "F" fund for the last three months as new deposits, and it now passed 1% of the account balance, so I did a "trim adjust to refect actual holdings".

Since I haven't actually moved anything, just had new deposit money flowing in, I didn't know how to do that on the autotracker. I haven't used my 2 for the month, although it's showing one because of the adjustment I did. I probably should have PM'd Ocean, but I know Ocean is very busy, and I don't think I'm going to make two real moves this month- I can't get a good target going to pull a trigger, so I am simply letting it ride.

Just thought I would pass that along.

[tsptalk]

Sounds like a couple of people have done that as their allocation shifts with the ups and downs of the market. But remember, this is not an accurate indication of your account balance. It is just a measure of how your account transfers are fairing against others. All accounts are calculated using a 10,000 balance with no added contributions so we can compare apples to apples.

I'd suggest using the spreadsheet (http://www.tsptalk.com/utilities.html) to tweak your allocation and get your own personal adjustments and deposits considered. The one we provide will allow you to tweal the allocation, but it doesn't consider deposits. I thought I saw someone say they had one that does consider deposits, that they would share (was it frixxxxx maybe?).

[Frixxxx]

I'd suggest using the spreadsheet (http://www.tsptalk.com/utilities.html) to tweak your allocation and get your own personal adjustments and deposits considered. The one we provide will allow you to tweal the allocation, but it doesn't consider deposits. I thought I saw someone say they had one that does consider deposits, that they would share (was it frixxxxx maybe?).

Sorry chief, it wasn't me, but Malyla stated that she might have a spreadsheet that she has modified to fit her needs. Maybe it is the one you are looking for. I have personally dropped out of the autotracker. I didn't want to see how bad I was doing earlier this year and since I have straightened out my direction, been pretty much in the "G".

[tsptalk]

Sorry frixxxx. Maybe it was scout333 http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/showthread.php?p=181530

[tsptalk]

squalebear -

Would you mind posting those rules here? I doubt many people have seen the part you PM'd to me. I had never heard them so it should probably be discussed.

Thanks!

Tom, I sent you a PM concerning why the rules you've highlighted
below don't necessarily hold true. I don't wish to confuse anyone
on the Board, so please check it out. ;)

[Guest2]

squalebear,
Would you mind posting those rules here? I doubt many people have seen the part you PM'd to me. I had never heard them so it should probably be discussed. Thanks!

Tom, If this gives all the membership a better idea of their abilities, then
I'm down right honored you asked and I'd be happy to share this information ! ;)

THE TSP's DOCUMENTED GENERAL RULES:
First, when the TSP Board decided to place restrictions on unlimited IFT's
they documented some general rules. (2) Unrestricted moves to any fund,
then, only back to the (G) Fund. Not all at once, but you could actually
move small percentages back to the (G) as often as you'd like. You just
can't move your money out of the (G) and go back into the Risk Funds
until the following month.

THIS IS "NOT" ENTIRELY TRUE ! ALTHOUGH I'VE POSTED THIS INFORM
WITHIN MY THREAD IN THE PAST, I'VE BEEN ASKED TO SHARE SOME
OF MY FINDING WITH THE MEMBERSHIP. IT'S MY PLEASURE TO DO SO.
SOME OF THE OLDER MEMBERS HAVE SEEN THIS INFO BEFORE, BUT
IT IS MY HOPE THAT NEWER MEMBERS WILL BECOME MORE AWARE
OF THEIR IFT CAPABILITIES. WITH THAT SAID, HERE YOU GO;

WHAT THE TSP WEBSITE DIDN'T TELL YOU ABOUT IFT's:
The software that the TSP utilizes to determine whether you can make
a IFT during the month, utilizes whole percentages and not fractional
percentages. However, you'll find that your account balances change
each day. In turn, so does your Fund Percentages change. When you
check your account balance, you might see that you have 74.02% in
the (G) and 25.98% in the (F) Fund. Because of the limitations of the
software (among other reasons) this can and has worked in my favor.
I currently have no more unrestricted IFT's left. Lets make believe the
above percentages were true for my account. The TSP Website says
I can only go back to the (G) Fund. TOTALY UNTRUE ! I can submit a
IFT that looks something like this; 74%(G) and 26%(F) and it will be
accepted. In essense. I moved 0.98% out of the (G) and moved it to
the (F) Fund. Why? Because my IFT was moving less then <1% at a
time and the software looks at only whole numbers. Alls I did was
round up the (F) Fund and round down the (G) Fund. In turn, I moved
more money out of the (G) and put more money in the (F) Fund. This
is not explained within the walls of the TSP Website, but I've done so
on just a few occassions. Moving smaller then <1% into another Fund
isn't all that beneficial in the way of gains, however, some of our TSPtalk
members have huge balances and might find this information useful. If
you take notice of my MTD IFT's on the Automated Tracker, you'll see
that I used 5 so far in September. You'll also see that I upped my (F)
Fund in the same manner as described above. This action "IS" playing
within the rules and limitations that the TSP Website have allowed. The
problem within the Automated Tracker comes into play when TSPTalk
starts to see IFT's that are greater then >1% after reaching the 2 move
limit.

In closing, If you see that someone has made a 2% move to the risk funds
(after reaching the limit), we have a problem. But I could have as many as
31 IFT's in one month and still be within the rules. I hope this helps every
single member understand their TRUE abilities with concerns to their IFT's.
I'm not saying that this capability is all that useful, but it does exist and
everyone of you have the right to know. The TSP Website has other goals
in mind and probably found this information confusing to the average TSP
investor and against their goals to lower the amount of IFT's being made
by devients such as myself. Long Live The Freedom Of Choice ! ;)

[EW_ret]

The rule we have posted for the Automated Tracker is sufficient since we do not track fractional percentages. The only case not stated is if G fund percentage remains unchanged while the remaining percentage shifts by one percent among the other funds. It could appear that one fund increases by one percent while another decreases by one percent. This is case that James48843 mentioned. This is splitting hairs and unnecessary for tracking purposes.

[Guest2]

The rule we have posted for the Automated Tracker is sufficient since we do not track fractional percentages. The only case not stated is if G fund percentage remains unchanged while the remaining percentage shifts by one percent among the other funds. It could appear that one fund increases by one percent while another decreases by one percent. This is case that James48843 mentioned. This is splitting hairs and unnecessary for tracking purposes.

I am not advocating any changes within the Tracker. I was asked by Tom
to share the information I had with the other members. When I make a
change in the tracker through a IFT, I want it to be accurate and reflect
what and when I actually did it, plain and simply. I was never included
in the original concerns that Tom had posted. Even Tom didn't know of
the fractional abilities that we all share. Now, everyone knows. But if my
(F) Fund goes up from 25% to 26% by way of a IFT (after I've used all
of my unrestricted IFT's), I don't want the Tom, the Membership or any
one else thinking that I'm trying to pull a fast one. More then that, I don't
want to see my IFT erased from existance. What better way to avoid this,
then sharing this information and discussing it as Tom has requested. As far
as the others who may not have the integrity that most of us have, they
should be banished and exposed by the Moderators for such behavior.

[dchev327]

OK here is the question!!! If I move to two different funds in the same day at the same time example 30% to the S furnd and 30% to the C fund is that considered two moves??? thanks

[Gumby]

OK here is the question!!! If I move to two different funds in the same day at the same time example 30% to the S furnd and 30% to the C fund is that considered two moves??? thanks

Only one move for IFT is counted.
Example on 10/7/2008 if you move from 100% G to 40%G, 30%C, and 30%S...that is considered one IFT move.

[Callme_CO]

what about if i say have 30 percent in G fund and 70 in the c fund and my bi weekly contributions started putting some in the S fund? how would i make the tracker see that without making and IFT?

[tsptalk]

It would not see that CO. The autotracker is measuring our timing skills vs. other members', not actually tracking our accounts.

[Rod]

>>> Bumped For Newbies

[msls6]

" I could have as many as
31 IFT's in one month and still be within the rules. "

Appreciate the great info! Just a minor correction : You can only make IFTs on the days that the TSP is "open" ( Monday thru Friday except Holidays).

[Guest2]

" I could have as many as
31 IFT's in one month and still be within the rules. "

Appreciate the great info! Just a minor correction : You can only make IFTs on the days that the TSP is "open" ( Monday thru Friday except Holidays).

You couldn't be more correct. Further, you have to wait until the 1st
market day of the next month, that brings the 31 IFT number down
even more. I stand corrected and WELCOME to the MB. ;)

[msls6]

Hello SB,
Thank you for the reply. I enjoy reading your posts. I have been lurking on the boards for about two years. I'm amassing my 10 posts required to join the tracker.
msls6

[msls6]

Hello SB,
You may have covered this, but here goes: Do IFTs less than 1% count towards the two IFT per month limit into F,C,S,I (if I made no moves yet this month, can I make say four <1% moves, then still make the two >1% moves?
Thank you,
msls6

[FUTURESTRADER]

Hello SB,
You may have covered this, but here goes: Do IFTs less than 1% count towards the two IFT per month limit into F,C,S,I (if I made no moves yet this month, can I make say four <1% moves, then still make the two >1% moves?
Thank you,
msls6

IFTs <1% WILL count towards your 2 IFTs/month in your actual TSP account.

[Guest2]

Hello SB,
You may have covered this, but here goes: Do IFTs less than 1% count towards the two IFT per month limit into F,C,S,I (if I made no moves yet this month, can I make say four <1% moves, then still make the two >1% moves?
Thank you,
msls6

First, please accept my apology for not seeing your question. In December
I injured my Back and couldn't sit in front of a computer. FT gave you the
answer you seeked below. Since you only have two moves (unrestricted)
per month, the tiny percentage moves count towards the limit as well. I
use the <1%IFT allocations to stay in the game in a attempt to beat the
(G) Fund,,,,,,in leiu of,,,,,,,sitting in the (G) until the following month.

[msls6]

IFTs <1% WILL count towards your 2 IFTs/month in your actual TSP account.

Thank you for the info FT! That is good to know. No sense wasting precious IFTs!
msLs6

[msls6]

First, please accept my apology for not seeing your question. In December
I injured my Back and couldn't sit in front of a computer. FT gave you the
answer you seeked below. Since you only have two moves (unrestricted)
per month, the tiny percentage moves count towards the limit as well. I
use the <1%IFT allocations to stay in the game in a attempt to beat the
(G) Fund,,,,,,in leiu of,,,,,,,sitting in the (G) until the following month.

Thank you SB! No apology necessary! I hope you can recover from your back injury.
msLs6