Furlough Thread

[James48843]

There are a couple other threads already started about furloughs - or the potential of furloughs.


I'd like to use THIS THREAD to post factual furlough information links, and federal employee related news threads and opinion pieces, to help keep employees informed as to what is happening for furloughs.

If your agency posts stuff, feel free to link it here. And /or if you see a good article about the possibility of a furlough, link that here as well.


I'll start:


Here is a link to a Mike Causey piece over on Federal News radio this morning, with some interesting commentary about the possibility of furloughs kicking in:

Furloughs: So, who's in charge? - FederalNewsRadio.com (http://www.federalnewsradio.com/20/3217984/Furloughs-So-whos-in-charge)

Enjoy.

[James48843]

And here is OPM guidance about possible administrative furloughs.

OPM updated this information last month:

Furlough Guidance (http://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/furlough-guidance/#url=Administrative-Furlough)

and Supplemental Guidance:

http://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/furlough-guidance/supplemental-guidance-administrative-furloughs.pdf

[James48843]

White House: President Obama Making Statement At 1:15 PM ETSource: TPM



DAVID TAINTOR 10:59 AM EST, TUESDAY FEBRUARY 5, 2013

The White House updated the press schedule for President Obama Tuesday, adding a statement at 1:15 p.m. ET from the President in the briefing room. Reports indicate that Obama will call on Congress to delay the automatic spending cuts scheduled to take effect in March.

-30-

Read more: White House: Obama Making Statement At 1:15 PM ET | TPM LiveWire (http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/white-house-obama-making-statement-at-1-15)


OBAMA SEEKS TO AVOID SEQUESTER WITH SHORT-TERM FIX
By JIM KUHNHENN

— Feb. 5 11:17 AM EST

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Barack Obama will ask Congress to come up with tens of billions of dollars in short-term spending cuts and tax revenue to put off the automatic across the board cuts that are scheduled to kick in March 1.

Obama will make his request afternoon in a public statement at the White House.

The automatic cuts, if they are allowed to proceed, could require widespread layoffs and indiscriminately affect defense programs and domestic spending accounts.

Obama will ask for a targeted way to reduce the deficit in the short term, perhaps several months. White House officials said that Congress needs more time to work out a 10-year plan worth more than $1 trillion in deficit reduction. Obama is not placing a time span or a dollar amount on the short-term plan. Officials said he will leave that to Congress.



Let's hope they come up with something that prevents sequestration furloughs....

[Bquat]

Got word from a friend in my last organization that they are going to try 4 eight hours days a week instead of ten hour days to keep from furloughs. I retired from DOD.

[craigerv]

We at the Navy (civilian) have received guidance that the current deal on the table would reduce our work week by one day for 22 weeks. Personally, I think I'd rather have 22 days in a row so I could do something with that time, but Fridays will do. Obviously this could all change if congress passes a budget.

[James48843]

... Obviously this could all change if congress passes a budget.

This one isn't the budget- it's the debt ceiling. We have budget authority to last for a while. It's the debt ceiling that won't permit the government to borrow any more money to pay the bills it's already approved to be spent.

The President signed the debt ceiling extension bill this morning. We now have until May 18th before the authority to pay the bills expires.

http://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/2013/02/obama-signs-debt-ceiling-suspension-no-budget-no-pay-law/61098/?oref=top-story

After that- all bets are off.

[FAB1]

I dont care about the facts. Point me to the wild rumor and mindless gossip threads please. :D

Actually, I will be lucky not to get a full lay-off sometime this year. Maybe I can post here more!

[Fran1775]

I work full time for the army And we also will be going to 4- 8 hour days for 22 weeks.

I also like the possibility of doing 20 something days off in a row. It seems pointless to take 1 day a week away from us to try to pay for things. I don't believe that it will run the government for more than a day but regardless I am along for the ride with 4 years left until retirement.

Keep up the good work and I'll keep reading!:cool:

[RealMoneyIssues]

Looking forward to the extra work one day a week !! Civ:Mil 3:1 or more here...

I may just put the phones on 'out of office' and lock the SCIF doors (doorbell, what doorbell?)...

[burrocrat]

omg! i think i just figured out what spending cuts, the debt ceiling, and sequestration have in common! all three never happen!


http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=Ect-kgxBb4M&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DEct-kgxBb4M

as compared to additional revenue which we all know is real. silly muppets.

[Buster]

I think it would be better served to go back and worry about 12-21-12 again..it at least was based on facts....http://www.hummer4x4offroad.com/forum/images/smilies/icon%20hypnotize.gif

[James48843]

We (in FAA) got this yesterday from Dept of Transportation:



Dear Colleagues,

As you are likely aware, the American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012 delayed until March 1, 2013, the across-the-board spending cuts (also known as “sequestration”) that face all Federal agencies. The Administration remains focused on working with Congress to reach agreement on a balanced deficit reduction plan that avoids these cuts. Should these cuts occur, they would be harmful not only to the Department of Transportation, but to critical domestic and defense priorities across the government and across the country.

However, given that less than one month remains until these cuts would take effect and given that the delay enacted by Congress would give us less time in which to make the required cuts, Secretary LaHood and I, along with the rest of our senior leadership team, are engaged in extensive planning efforts to determine how we would deal with sequestration. I know many of you have questions, so I wanted to take this opportunity to provide some additional details.
In planning how to implement a possible sequestration, our guiding principle is to protect our ability to perform our mission on behalf of the American people. As public servants, this is our first and foremost responsibility.

To this end, we are carefully considering how to use the various tools at our disposal to reduce costs in order to mitigate as much as possible the disruption to our operations, our programs, and all of you. We will use any and all flexibilities we have to protect our core operations and mission. However, our ability to do so will be limited by the rigid nature of the cuts imposed by Congress. As a result, we are closely examining contracts, grants, and other forms of expenditures across the Department to determine where we can reduce costs. In many cases, this could mean making cuts to vital programs or curtailing spending on contracts. We also will take steps, wherever possible, to cut operational or administrative costs in areas such as travel, training, facilities, and supplies.


We may also have to consider placing employees on temporary furlough, or taking other personnel actions, should sequestration occur. With respect to furloughs, should we have to pursue this unfortunate course of action, let me assure you that all affected employees would be provided at least 30 days notice prior to executing a furlough, or as required by collective bargaining agreements. We also will continue to engage in discussions with employee unions as appropriate, to ensure that any furloughs are applied in a fair and appropriate manner. If you have questions on this issue, I would encourage you to go to the Office of Personnel Management website, which has helpful information and answers to frequently asked questions regarding furloughs (found at www.opm.gov/furlough (http://www.opm.gov/furlough), under the “administrative furlough” section).
Your modal Administrator or OST Director will be following up in the near term with additional information regarding our initial plans for implementation of sequestration, and how these plans will affect the day-to-day operations of the Department.

Thank you for your patience as we navigate these difficult issues, and for all that you do for DOT and the American people.

John Porcari

Deputy Secretary

[FishSqueezer]

We (in FAA) got this yesterday from Dept of Transportation:

Humph...other than the intro and sig lines, DOI got the same memo today. Nice that they're using a form letter to express their concern for us lowly pee-ons!

[Boghie]

Howdy Folks...

So, assuming we are furloughed 20% of the time (once a week). Doin' the math, eh. Can you make it. Simply multiply 0.80 x Net Salary and figure it out...

Not so fast.

We all have fixed costs that are not ratios of our salary - by definition. Your Health Insurance, CFC, FSA, TSP Loans, and Life Insurance (I think) are fixed. Your TSP contributions, Federal tax, State tax, Social Security, Medicare, and FERS pension contribution are ratio based. Thus, the math should start with 80% of Gross Salary, subtract the full amounts for the fixed costs and then subtract 80% of the ratioed costs.

That makes the math a bit harder and much more negative for us. I will be living off of:

68% of current Net with Fixed TSP, minimizing allotments
72% of current Net if I keep my current allotments and ratio TSP
76% of current Net if I minimize allotments and keep fixed TSP
or 96% of current Net if I minimize my allotments and zero out my TSP contributions


But, if I zero out my TSP contributions than I will have to fight other dogs for the Alpo in my golden years. If I allow it to ratio down I might get my own bowl. However, if I keep it fixed I will feel the pain.

[James48843]

.....
But, if I zero out my TSP contributions than I will have to fight other dogs for the Alpo in my golden years. If I allow it to ratio down I might get my own bowl. However, if I keep it fixed I will feel the pain.

Make sure the dog you own is tender. Beagles are good. Korean roast beagle is tender. Can be a bit fatty, however. BBQ beagle is better than beagle soup.

[Boghie]

James,

This hit might actually make it smart for me to use the Roth TSP account. Might also go 10 dependents and pay up later. This is going to be a misery. All this for a 2% cut in spending. Smells like politics to me. We shall see...

[James48843]

Just remember- you are taking the pay cut for the good of the nation, so those multi-millionaires don't have to part with any more of theirs. It's so darn patriotic of you.

[Boghie]

Just remember- you are taking the pay cut for the good of the nation, so those multi-millionaires don't have to part with any more of theirs. It's so darn patriotic of you.

The multi-millionaires have already gotten their tax increase in the last fiasco. We are down to the multi-thousandaires (yuk, yuk - the poor sods making less than $350K/$400K per year).

Why cannot all expenses be trimmed 2% or 3%? Me thinks that politics are in play when the DoD and the rest drop the hammer on us taxpaying and voting gubmint serfs. I don't think it will play well with the voting public though. Another group may want to do this to cull the herd. Some will quit because they cannot live on an abrupt 28% pay cut. Some will quit because the pay is no longer competitive to the private sector. I might be in the latter category. It is a pathetic joke that the aging lawyers we vote into office couldn't cut expenditures over time. Anyone looking at 2008 knew that the tax base would be hammered for quite some time.

As a note, the Federal tax revenue in FY2012 was only $100 Billion less than the maximum revenue ever generated - that is FY2007. Spending, ahem, has grown by a miserly 30% in that time frame. We wouldn't have to suffer at all if we kept spending in line, eh...

[burrocrat]

i really wouldn't mind to see the furloughs if it helps spur a national debate on the realities of overspending. who knows? maybe some good will come of it and folks really miss the level of service public employees provide. on the other hand, they may just discover they don't need so many of us after all. win-win in my book.

personally, it would be tight. my safety cushion is pretty thin, i affectionately call it my seat-of-the-pants strategery. for reasons entirely within my control, it is only recently in life that i discovered how to live comfortably hand to mouth instead of a little short all the time. i could float a few paychecks reducing back to bare frugality, but after that the bills would start piling up and i'd either have to go hungry, end up down at the docks blowing sailors for bread, or start selling my guns. and i swore that would never happen again.

i really like what i do and feel good about the mission i serve so i'll give it a few weeks for the leaders to pull their heads out, but after that i'm bailing to the private sector before the brain drain begins en masse and all the good jobs get taken.

ozymandius, look on my works ye mighty and despair. this could be it.

[sniper]

furloughs would just mean i get 3 day weekends and temporarily have $500 less to throw into investments per month. bring em on

hope the surf is good if it happens

[burrocrat]

furloughs would just mean i get 3 day weekends and temporarily have $500 less to throw into investments per month. bring em on

hope the surf is good if it happens

not so fast there hoali, sorry, but not everyone can have fridays or mondays off. there is a sixty percent chance your allotted reflection time will fall on a tue, wed, or thur. greater than 60% if you belong to a union and are not an old fish. sharks gotta eat too you know.

[Boghie]

furloughs would just mean i get 3 day weekends and temporarily have $500 less to throw into investments per month. bring em on

hope the surf is good if it happens

Sniper,

Furloughs are Forever. Not quite the same as "Diamonds are Forever". Not as many Bond Girls chasing us, eh;)

They will probably last till there is a 10% cut in the civilian work force. There ain't no money out there to pay us. There ain't no money out there to pay for the 700,000 gazillion children and the 70,000 dumber dumbies either. The gravy train cracked a wheel and the folks ponying up the casholla are probably tired of the act.

You would literally need to double the Federal revenue from income taxes to balance the gravy train on three wheels. Folks want a faster wagon with better moves and stuff. They are bored of watching our wagon being dragged around by a team of pigs squealing for a balanced approach. And, many of the dumber ones (see the 70,000 miss-educated goobers on the chopping block above) who are now the dreaded low information voters will conflate the tax increase on trillionaires with their silly little 2% Social Security increase. Hey man, I didn't vote for a tax increase on little dumb bunnies like me - I wanted to hammer Romney:embarrest:. But, man, what just hit me. Is it a hangover. Maybe I shouldn't trust those old white guys anymore. Dude...:toung:

[Kaufmanrider]

furloughs would just mean i get 3 day weekends and temporarily have $500 less to throw into investments per month. bring em on

hope the surf is good if it happens

I can't wait to retire and be done with this garbage. Take my federal entitlement :D, and my TSP, with me.

Jan 2014 looks better and better.

[Khotso]

furloughs would just mean i get 3 day weekends and temporarily have $500 less to throw into investments per month. bring em on

hope the surf is good if it happens
I like the way you think Sniper. As I see it, no matter how much I like my job, I always like my days off better. Plus the surf is always good ... even when it's not. You just gotta get in the water. Never had a bad day in the water.

[ILoveTDs]

furloughs would just mean i get 3 day weekends and temporarily have $500 less to throw into investments per month. bring em on

hope the surf is good if it happens

My agency is floting an un-official poll of wheather we want every Friday, or if we would perfer alternating Friday/Monday (e.g. 4 day weekend, 2 day weekend, 4 day week end, etc.)

[James48843]

Now THERE is an idea. I'd like 4-day weekends! If we're going to be poor, at least give us some consolidated time to get that second job starting a business going.

[CrabClaw]

Nothing in regards to this from my agency. If it comes to pass I would try to flex the hours, work 2 - 11's and 1 - 10 per week and have 4 day weekends EVERY weekend.

[WorkFE]

My Boss and I spoke about furloughs. Which day off is irrelevant to me as long as it is always the same day. That way I know what days I'm available for my second job. errr. third job;)

[James48843]

Furloughs expected to be "in the hundreds of thousands".

White House: Sequestration Would Mean Hundreds of Thousands of Furloughs - Pay & Benefits - GovExec.com (http://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/2013/02/white-house-emphasizes-sequester-would-mean-hundreds-thousands-furloughs/61203/?oref=top-story)

[OBGibby]

My Boss and I spoke about furloughs. Which day off is irrelevant to me as long as it is always the same day. That way I know what days I'm available for my second job. errr. third job;)

I only want sunny and warm days. If I'm going to be off I might as well go to the club and play 18.

[James48843]

From FAA Administrator Michael Huerta tonight:



Sequestration Update from Michael Huerta
Michael Huerta

Monday, February 11, 2013 17:10

On March 1, the Budget Control Act of 2011 requires across the board, indiscriminate spending reductions, commonly referred to as “sequestration,” for Federal agencies. Without an agreement to avoid these budget cuts, the FAA will be forced to confront a budget reduction of approximately $627 million for this fiscal year.

Given the magnitude of this reduction, we cannot address this funding reduction by only reducing or eliminating non-operations critical functions. All cost reduction options are on the table, and we will take all reasonable measures to avoid proposing furloughs. However, given the magnitude of the shortfall we face, it is likely that significant federal employee furloughs and drastic reductions in services performed by contract personnel would be necessary.

If sequestration occurs on March 1, a majority of FAA's nearly 47,000 employees would need to be furloughed for approximately one day per pay period until the end of the fiscal year in September, with a maximum of two days per pay period. This number could be lower for any individual employee depending on specific staffing needs, operational requirements, and negotiated collective bargaining agreements. Any furloughs would occur only after appropriate employee notification and in accordance with applicable collective bargaining agreements.

Under current law, programs and projects funded under the Airport Improvement Program are exempt from sequestration and would continue to operate at current funding levels.

The furlough of a large number of air traffic controllers, technicians, and aviation safety employees would require a reduction in FAA services to levels that can be safely managed by remaining staff. Accordingly, we might see travel delays and disruptions during the critical summer travel season.

The furloughs would also impact airlines, aviation manufacturers and individual pilots who need FAA safety approvals and certifications. While the agency will continue to address identified safety risks, a slowed certification and approval process due to furloughs could negatively affect all segments of the aviation industry as well as those who travel by air. Long-term investments in advanced technologies and new tools may be postponed and the delivery of some critical NextGen systems could be delayed for years to come.

If the sequester happens, I know you share my commitment to ensure the safety of our national aviation system while minimizing the negative impact to those who rely on our services. Thank you again for all you do, every day on behalf of the American public. You are our most valuable asset. I can confidently offer that everyone who is a beneficiary of the services we provide hopes for a compromise that keeps us on the job – and keeps our aviation system moving forward.

Sincerely,

Michael

[burrocrat]

i still don't understand why furloughs are even being considered at this point. way back in august of 2011 there was an attempt to compromise on revenue and spending, but things didn't work out so everybody agreed to come up with a better plan later. and just in case they couldn't, they agreed to just raise and cut across the board. several attempts and only one increase in revenue later, still the best and brightest leaders can't reach an agreement on how to reduce how much more we borrow than we make.

that's just crazy. but not really surprising. of course high level department and agency heads have also had plenty of time to proactively minimize potential disruption to missions by prudently reducing expenses to spread the shortfall over a greater period of time, but here we all are standing around with our pants down.

basically, the elected folks didn't do their job. so now everybody gets to not do their job. fair is fair. only thing left to do is to argue about whose fault it is.

[Buster]

From FAA Administrator Michael Huerta tonight:
Properties on the ChartIf the sequester happens, I know you share my commitment to ensure the safety of our national aviation system while minimizing the negative impact to those who rely on our services. Thank you again for all you do, every day on behalf of the American public. You are our most valuable asset. I can confidently offer that everyone who is a beneficiary of the services we provide hopes for a compromise that keeps us on the job – and keeps our aviation system moving forward.

Sincerely,

Michael

What is he high on?..Is he smoking Crack??..:mad:


If you want the flying public to go on it's merry way, then it shouldn't be on the backs of the FAA'ers working part time..the real effort better come from the idiots in DC who will let this happen...Damn them SOBs!!!!!!

But like a couple of years ago, when these morons we call elected officials (BTW, who re-elected these A-holes anyway Jim?) They let the Airport taxes lapse for F&E funding and all airline revenue went to the wayside that the Government normally collected via ticket taxes..They laid off thousands and then 3 weeks later when they got there feces together, called everyone back to work and gave them back pay...and the laid off folks got 3 weeks of free vacation...

So if it comes to any furloughs (which I doubt will happen), you all will get back pay for your time off anyway, I've seen it happen several times in the past....so have fun..

[alevin]

The backpay was true for my agency the last go-round, but another agency (different department) land manager with somewhat similar mission and responsibilities-those folks didn't get the backpay. both agencies with offices in same small towns. left some tension and bad feelings between employees of the two agencies, normally friends and arms-length colleagues over that one. backpay or no depends on the agency and department, did last time at any rate.

[clester]

I thought most folks (tea partiers)on this site wanted to cut spending. Well, this will do it.

I went through several furlough threats and 1 under Reagan went down to the wire like this one but it didn't happen in the end. Hopefully this one won't either. Sorry for you guys being threatened with this. Got my fingers crossed.

[Weather]

The SOTU address tonight will set the tone for the March 1 sequester. I hope the an olive branch is extended to resolve the cuts. I fear it will be a finger pointing exercise.

[CrabClaw]

From USDA, looks like the same "Dear John" everyone else is getting:

USDA Employees,

As you are likely aware, the American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012 delayed until March 1, 2013 the across-the-board spending cuts (also known as “sequestration”) that face all Federal agencies. The Administration remains focused on working with Congress to reach agreement on a balanced deficit reduction plan that avoids these cuts. Should these cuts occur, they would be harmful not only to our agency, but to critical domestic and defense priorities across the government and across the country.

However, given that less than one month remains until these cuts would take effect and given that the delay enacted by Congress would give us less time in which to make the required cuts, our senior leadership team is engaged in extensive planning efforts to determine how we would deal with sequestration. I know many of you have questions, so I wanted to take this opportunity to provide some additional details.

In planning how to implement a possible sequestration, our guiding principle is to protect our ability to perform our mission on behalf of the American people. As public servants, this is our first and foremost responsibility.

To this end, we are carefully considering how to use the various tools at our disposal to reduce costs in order to mitigate as much as possible the disruption to our operations, our programs, and all of you.

In anticipation of a leaner budget environment, USDA has taken great strides in achieving savings and efficiencies through the Administrative Solutions Project, under the Blueprint for Stronger Service, the savings of which helps avoid the need for furloughs and reductions-in-force. The Department is pursuing cost reduction efforts in several areas such as implementing a “Shared First” acquisition policy to consolidate IT related acquisitions, consolidating cell phone contracts and land-lines, sourcing uniforms from the AbilityOne Strategic Alliance, and standardizing of bulk mail processes at the National Finance Center.

Related to these efforts, the Department has taken measures to reduce spending in travel, printing, supplies, and other expenditures. These actions and others have generated millions of dollars in efficiencies. By becoming more efficient, we have to date diminished the need for more severe actions that interfere with your life and the ability for USDA to deliver important services. We will continue to use any and all flexibilities we have to protect our core operations and mission.

However, our ability to do so will be limited by the rigid nature of the cuts imposed by Congress. As a result, we are closely examining contracts, grants, and other forms of expenditures across the Department to determine where we can reduce costs. In many cases, this could mean making cuts to vital programs or curtailing spending on contracts. We will also take steps, wherever possible, to cut operational or administrative costs in areas such as travel, training, facilities, and supplies.

We may also have to consider placing employees on temporary furlough, or taking other personnel actions, should sequestration occur. With respect to furloughs, should we have to pursue this unfortunate course of action, let me assure you that all affected employees will be provided at least 30 days’ notice prior to executing a furlough. USDA will ensure that employees who are contractually entitled to more than 30 days notice will receive the appropriate amount of notice as outlined within their respective contracts.

We will also continue to engage in discussions with employee unions as appropriate, to ensure that any furloughs are applied in a fair and appropriate manner. If you have questions on this issue, I would encourage you to go to the Office of Personnel Management website, which has helpful information and answers to frequently asked questions regarding furloughs (found at www.opm.gov/furlough (http://www.opm.gov/furlough), under the “administrative furlough” section).

You will receive follow-up information in the near term regarding our initial plans for implementation of sequestration, and how these plans will affect the day-to-day operations of our agency.

Thank you for your patience as we navigate these difficult issues, and for all that you do for our agency and the American people.

Sincerely,
Tom Vilsack

[Sensei]

DODEA: Teachers could face furloughs if defense cuts take effect - News - Stripes (http://www.stripes.com/news/dodea-teachers-could-face-furloughs-if-defense-cuts-take-effect-1.206872)

(DODEA Director Marilee) Fitzgerald stated. “We will plan to furlough school-level personnel without risking a full-year of academic credit for our students.”...

...Federal Education Association President Michael Priser said DODEA officials were considering doubling up classrooms, among other possibilities.

So it sounds like my unit is planning to do something weird like furlough half the employees one day a week, and the other half another day. The half that are on the job cram two classes of students into one room - of course it won't be two of the same subject, and some teachers would end up "teaching" a subject they aren't qualified to teach. But the kiddies will get their credits.

IMO keeping the schools open defeats some of the cost cutting intended by the furlough. You might cut back on teacher salaries, but still have to pay for electricity, transportation, school lunch, and a slew of other services. If they do a furlough, it should be everyone off and all school operations shut down completely on that furlough day. That's the only way to get the intended value of the furlough.

I think I'm moving through the phases of furlough grief. I've gone through anger, denial, bargaining, acceptance, and now rest in a state of cynical apathy. Ugh.

[James48843]

You know, I've been thinking.....


If we all get furlough days, what are we going to do with them?

How about we all go down to the Congressman's office, and camp on their doorstep?

We could toss out some sleeping bags, set up camp, and tell them we have no where better to go than to sit on their doorstep and ask them when they expected to send us back to work.

Kind of an "Occupy the Local Congressman's office".

22350

Could be fun, no?

[Frixxxx]

**********Reminder***************
If you are furloughed and are getting the non-pay status shaft, this will affect your TSP amount if you are using % of income rather than an exact amount.....Just a reminder. Go back to your cushy non-productive civil service job not-already-in-progress.

:sick:

And yes, that means the matching % will be less too!

[James48843]

Got some more "scootch" information today. At my agency, letters will be sent to employees beginning March 7th. Actual furloughs will begin on or after April 7th (30 day notice requirement). We are being told we're to take 11 furlough days between April at the end of the fiscal year in Sept. One day per pay period. There are no exceptions for "emergecy employees" or by grade- everyone gets hit. The only question will be the actual days off.

Here is a "Question and Answer" document published:
http://aircraftcert.org/MOA/RMQASaveMoneyFurlough.pdf


Can you read this document? Or is it behind a firewall?

[CrabClaw]

This just came through from the Chief's office today:

All Forest Service employees received a message from the Secretary of Agriculture on the spending cuts known as “sequestration”, and I know there are concerns about the prospects for potential furloughs. While we at the Forest Service will receive the same cuts as other agencies across government, because of the way we manage our budget we have flexibility and should be able to avoid furlough if sequestration occurs. We will use a combination of efforts including cutting back on contracts and purchasing, delaying filling vacancies, and reducing our seasonal employment in order to manage the budget reduction. As the Secretary said in his note, “In planning how to implement a possible sequestration, our guiding principle is to protect our ability to perform our mission on behalf of the American people. As public servants, this is our first and foremost responsibility.” It is our plan to do that to the best of our ability without resorting to furloughing employees.

Thank you for all you do and be safe out there.

Chief

[NiteFlyer]

They just told us the days off will be staggered throughout the week so we have some coverage. We can't all be off Mondays or Fridays. We have to be able to support our missions.

[James48843]

Here.

[James48843]

Federal News Radio webpage now has an entire section devoted to Sequestration news and furlough facts and notices.

Section - FederalNewsRadio.com (http://www.federalnewsradio.com/sequestration)

Enjoy.

[PessOptimist]

DOE employees got the same canned letter that CrabClaw posted.

FWIW to mods and Tom, I posted this before about the time of the server upgrade. It showed up in the thread and when I came back later it wasn't there. I didn't feel it worth posting under report problems area.

PO

[FishSqueezer]

The latest iteration. I'd be curious to see if this is another gov't-wide form letter. Sorry for the length, they're getting wordy, and header and footer deleted to protect the "______".


Subject: Update on Preparations for Potential Sequestration

I want to provide you an update on the work that is underway in order to prepare for potential sequestration. We are less than three weeks away from the March 1, 2013 sequestration deadline. The President remains focused on working with Congress to reach agreement on a balanced deficit reduction plan that avoids these cuts. However, as March 1 approaches, we continue our efforts to prepare for potential sequestration. In the coming weeks, you will receive additional information on our sequestration planning efforts.

As we formulate our sequestration plans, thoughts about the potential impacts to our employees are at the forefront. I am inspired every day by your passion and commitment to our mission. You are our most valuable asset and your ability to do your job and remain effective is critical to our mission. I recognize that the uncertainty in which we find ourselves makes this a stressful time and I remind you of the resources available to you and your family through the Employee Assistance Program.

The plans that we are developing outline how a sequestration of approximately five percent would be implemented. Each bureau and office is assessing the potential to implement reductions in a manner that will ensure protection of life, health, and safety, as wells as ongoing operation of mission critical activities. In developing our plans, we are evaluating options to accommodate sequestration reductions by reducing non-essential activities and deferring spending on discretionary costs in order to preserve funding and mitigate possible impacts to employees, our lands and resources, and essential activities that address the critical needs of the American people. We are assessing our ability to defer activities related to training, travel, contracts, and purchases and we will utilize appropriate flexibility where possible.

We may also have to consider placing employees on temporary furlough or take other personnel actions should sequestration occur. With respect to furloughs, should we have to pursue this unfortunate course of action, let me assure you that all affected employees would be provided at least 30 days notice prior to executing a furlough or in accordance with the designated representative collective bargaining agreement as appropriate.We will also continue to engage in discussions with employee unions as appropriate, to ensure that any furloughs are applied in an appropriate manner meeting agency mission requirements. If you have questions on this issue, I would encourage you to go to the Office of Personnel Management website, which has helpful information and answers to frequently asked questions regarding furloughs (found at www.opm.gov/furlough (http://www.opm.gov/furlough), under the “administrative furlough” section).

As part of our planning efforts, we have started to share the specific impacts of sequestration at the Department with the Office of Management and Budget. The timing of the sequestration and abbreviated seven-month timeframe for implementation is particularly challenging for us. Should sequestration occur, reductions will need to be made during the season when many of our programs are conducting field work, employing seasonal employees, and hosting visitors. Specific impacts for the Department include:
· Reduced hours and services at our 398 national parks, 561 refuges, and over 258 public land units;
· Reduced numbers of seasonal employees employed for firefighting, law enforcement, and visitor services during our busiest season;
· Delays in development of oil, gas, and coal on our lands and waters; and
· Large reductions in services to tribes including education services to Native American school children.

This is not an all-inclusive list of the impacts and we continue to work with bureaus and offices to improve our understanding of potential sequestration effects. I encourage you to share information about the impacts on your ability to perform important mission activities with your manager so we have a full picture.

In the coming weeks we will finalize our sequestration plans, issue guidance on implementation, and continue working with bureaus and offices to ensure communications and logistics are ready in the event we have to implement the sequester. You will receive additional information on our plans and your role in implementation as it becomes available. Although we are preparing for sequestration, we remain optimistic that an agreement will be reached that will avert the need to implement these plans.

[Buster]

Alls well and good..But since Congress only has worked 19 days since the 1st of the year, the rest of the time in recess..it's no wonder nothing gets done..but we lose our time on the job though not by choice, because of them..

I hope all of you that voted to keep these social leeches in office are happy with your vote now..

[Boghie]

Don't Fear the Sequester (http://www.ftportfolios.com/blogs/EconBlog/2013/2/19/dont-fear-the-sequester)

I think this nails it. Right or wrong, I don't think there will be the public outcry for solving the sequester by not sequestering. I am betting that game (The Washington Monument Game) is old.

Also, I think we are being gamed. The DoD is targeting civilian employees for a 20% cut when the cut should be around 8%. Also, note that the article identifies that the actual cuts will total $43 Billion across all sequestered entities. There are $43 Billion in actual cuts, the remaining $42 Billion is future spending not yet authorized this year. You know you are gamed when a cut is not a cut and these blokes use spending that isn't spending. Yowser...

[nnuut]

Of course everyone knows that the cuts they are talking about are cuts to the projected increases of the budget, no real cuts around here.22484

[Scout333]

Has anyone seen any reports regarding effect of furloughs on retirement pay for those planning to retire this year i.e. Effect on High Three Pay that retirement pay is based on? Seems that a 20% reduction in the last year or two before retirement would cut your check a good bit. For example, If high three avg. $ 100,000 per year (assuming the current pay freeze) x 60% CSRS check should be approximately $ 60 K. With furlough of 20% High Three Pay avg. would be approx. $ 93,333 x 60% or $ 56 K . Ouch!:sick:

[ILoveTDs]

My understanding is it would effect your high three, but remember it is your high three not last three, so this year probably wouldn't be used in your high three calculation.

[WorkFE]

+ since we have not had a pay raise in 3 years, even if they did not do the furlough this year is no higher than the last 2.

[Frixxxx]

link
(http://www.opm.gov/FAQs/QA.aspx?fid=f57dd13d-b580-43cf-befb-e963c4f050ef&pid=9142df6c-6e12-4483-949d-60cb3c92f549&result=1)
High three question answered (shortly) from OPM.gov

[Scout333]

link
(http://www.opm.gov/FAQs/QA.aspx?fid=f57dd13d-b580-43cf-befb-e963c4f050ef&pid=9142df6c-6e12-4483-949d-60cb3c92f549&result=1)
High three question answered (shortly) from OPM.gov

Thanks Frixxxx!

[James48843]

Got a message this week that NO TDY travel after March 27th is permitted. If you have your work scheduled for a TDY trip (I usually do about 10 days a month TDY) you can enter the data in GOVTRIP, but you cannot sign your authorization yet, and you will not be permitted to until Congress settles the budget deal. Until then, park the G-Car, cancel the airplane reservations, and sit tight. No government travel permitted after March 27th in my line of business.

Thanks Congress.

[Warrenlm]

Jim Cramer noted this morning that the military is furloughing individuals instead of closing golf courses.

[James48843]

Jim Cramer noted this morning that the military is furloughing individuals instead of closing golf courses.

If they closed all the golf courses, where would we all go on the days we are furloughed?

[Khotso]

link
(http://www.opm.gov/FAQs/QA.aspx?fid=f57dd13d-b580-43cf-befb-e963c4f050ef&pid=9142df6c-6e12-4483-949d-60cb3c92f549&result=1)
High three question answered (shortly) from OPM.gov

That sounds like a non-answer to me. I'm thinking ILoveTDs may have got it right ... if you are furloughed and the last 3 years have been frozen, then your high 3 may not be your last 3, or ... your last 12 months may be the lowest 12 of the high 3. ... So the question really should be, how is your high 3 computed -- is it based on your annual salary or actual regular pay received?

[Frixxxx]

Jim Cramer noted this morning that the military is furloughing individuals instead of closing golf courses.

Only appropriated funded agencies are furloughed according to my source.

[Warrenlm]

He also just quietly said that " 'they' always cut things (that are for dramatics)". My thinking was why wouldn't the capitalist who was a communist in college go on to say the ADMINISTRATION is selecting the cuts and using the issue to reeducate the public through the media soundbite repeaters, now that he brought it up.

[Stoplight]

That sounds like a non-answer to me. I'm thinking ILoveTDs may have got it right ... if you are furloughed and the last 3 years have been frozen, then your high 3 may not be your last 3, or ... your last 12 months may be the lowest 12 of the high 3. ... So the question really should be, how is your high 3 computed -- is it based on your annual salary or actual regular pay received?

From the OPM web site :

"Your “high-3” average pay is the highest average basic pay you earned during any 3 consecutive years of service. These three years are usually your final three years of service, but can be an earlier period, if your basic pay was higher during that period. Your basic pay is the basic salary you earn for your position. It includes increases to your salary for which retirement deductions are withheld, such as shift rates. It does not include payments for overtime, bonuses, etc. (If your total service was less than 3 years, your average salary was figured by averaging your basic pay during all of your periods of creditable Federal service)."

It does include your locality pay, though !


Stoplight...

[Frixxxx]

From the OPM web site :

...
(If your total service was less than 3 years, your average salary was figured by averaging your basic pay during all of your periods of creditable Federal service)."

It does include your locality pay, though !


Stoplight...

I'm told that the furloughed time is considered creditable service. If an employee is furloughed continuously for 6 months, then it would start to affect the calculation. But this 1/day a week is credited at the salary level for retirement calculation.

[Cactus]

For what it's worth, here is the latest regarding DOD civilians.

• Leave: Furlough time off is treated like regular leave without pay for leave accrual and benefit purposes. When employees are in a non-pay status (like a furlough) their retirement deductions are adjusted in proportion to their basic pay.



• Thrift Savings Plan: Regarding the Thrift Savings Plan, employees who have selected their TSP contribution to be a percentage of their pay will see smaller contributions during the furlough period due to their reduced pay. Employees who have selected a fixed amount for their TSP contribution will see the same amount deducted during the furlough period.

[Pill]

As a firefighter, we used to be told furlough would not affect us, but we just got word today it will and in a big way. We work 144 hours in a pp, and only 38 hours is considered over time. During furlough we will be losing 16 hours (that’s the numbers we are hearing), that is OT pay. So it comes to about losing $1,000 a month. Some people aren't going to be able to survive very well on this kind of cut.

Incredible that we are in this position.

But still very happy to have a job.

[clester]

As a firefighter, we used to be told furlough would not affect us, but we just got word today it will and in a big way. We work 144 hours in a pp, and only 38 hours is considered over time. During furlough we will be losing 16 hours (that’s the numbers we are hearing), that is OT pay. So it comes to about losing $1,000 a month. Some people aren't going to be able to survive very well on this kind of cut.

Incredible that we are in this position.

But still very happy to have a job.
All the talk from the right wing lately seems to be saying "go ahead and let the sequester happen", it's not a big deal.

[RealMoneyIssues]

All the talk from the right wing lately seems to be saying "go ahead and let the sequester happen", it's not a big deal.

And all the talk from the left wing lately is that this will kill the economy and lose 100s of 1000s of jobs... we must stop sequestration...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqD2h7e_MLg

[Fran1775]

I'm with you real money let's stop the sequestration!

[Warrenlm]

What You Need to Know During a Furlough - Retirement Planning - Pay & Benefits - GovExec.com (http://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/retirement-planning/2013/02/what-you-need-know-during-furlough/61448/)

[James48843]

And all the talk from the left wing lately is that this will kill the economy and lose 100s of 1000s of jobs... we must stop sequestration...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqD2h7e_MLg

What the President was talking about there- in his veto threat, was the discussion by some republicans to "undo" the sequestration part of the Budget Control Act of 2011 and exempt ONLY defense cuts from the budget axe. The President said at the time the act initally passed, that the job of Congress was to decide which items to cut and which taxes to raise- he made suggestions, but that it was the Congress's constitutional duty to make those budget decisions, and that he would not support exempting defense when the rest of the budget still had to be better balanced.

If you recall the vote on the Budget Control Act of 2011, not a single Democrat in the House voted for it and the sequestration that it contained. http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2011/roll677.xml

This one is ALL on the (r's) . 100% on the (r's). If sequestration hits and the economy tanks it is soley because (r's) manufactured an unneeded crisis and refused to increase taxes and decide which programs to cut to bring spending and income into line.

Note- you've now taking this thread and made it political. Let's give it a (*) and move it, shall we?

[RealMoneyIssues]

Note- you've now taking this thread and made it political. Let's give it a (*) and move it, shall we?

LOOK JAMES... for one, Clester started the political part and for two, you are still taking things out of context... so yes, PLEASE move this to the political thread where they can refute your claims...

[nnuut]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPtjWXoL-es

[WorkFE]

He said she said. Who gives a crap, fix it to give us some measuring stick to guage our next move in our personal professional lives.

[Boghie]

All this Furlough stuff gives me time to Cert Up :p

Got my SQL Server Cert books, a little CBTNugget action, and and MSDN account to play with;)

Bought em before I went broke. Glad I paid down dem credit cards...

[burrocrat]

non-partisan review of the issue:

. can we raise the debt ceiling? yes.
. can we raise revenue? yes.
. can we voluntarily cut spending? no.
. can we involuntarily cut spending across the board except for the safety net? maybe.
. will sequester negatively affect the economy? yes.
. will not adressing entitlement spending negatively affect the economy? yes.
. do folks get scared and angry and weep and wail when somebody tries to steal their pay/benefit/retirement/health honey pot checks? yes.
. will the sun still come up march 2nd? yes.
. will the public discover the world ain't so bad and it still turns with 10% less feds in it? probably.
. will we be able to keep spending beyond our means and still enjoy the same quality of life ad infinitum? probably not.
. will we wise up and make the difficult choices before it all crashes and burns and we have no good choices left? probably not, that would be a first.
. will we learn to like togas and public baths? probably.

when in rome...

[WorkFE]

Thanks Burro, I feel better.:D

[Viva_La_Migra]

when in rome...

Play the fiddle while the city burns!:sick:

[Boghie]

Play the fiddle while the city burns!:sick:

Viva, fellow San Diegan, I think the problem will resolve itself. Regretfully, we will be resolved as well...

There is no money, and there really is no belief that the gubmint needs revenue for the bloat. I don't think many out there are praising Stimulus spending. I don't think they want the stimulus spending structuralized. My money is that the general public will watch passively as we are slashed by 3%. Cut and burn baby, cut and burn.

The problem for us will be when the politics are done. When the furlough game and the Washington Monument tactics are done with. The general public will realized the slash and burn cuts didn't mean anything to them. Then we will have a rinse and repeat cycle. If that time is not now, it will be soon.

[burrocrat]

Play the fiddle while the city burns!:sick:

life ain't nothin' but a funny funny riddle.

YouTube (http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=kzldLJcorbo&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DkzldLJcorbo)

i think maybe the folks that grow food and pay the bills 'bout done had enough. buckle up buttercups, this she its about to get heavy.

thank dog i'm a country boy.

[James48843]

this afternoon- message sent to all employees from FAA Administrator Michael Huerta:





Sequestration Update

Michael Huerta

to:

02/22/2013 11:43 AM

Please respond to 9-AWA-AOA1-Broadcast-Replies

(http://www.faa.gov/news/updates/media/2013_02_22_10_00_10.pdf)
Colleagues,


Today, Secretary LaHood and I sent a letter to aviation stakeholders (http://www.faa.gov/news/updates/media/2013_02_22_10_00_10.pdf) outlining the impact of sequestration on the aviation industry and air travelers.


As the letter notes and as I shared with you last week, if the automatic cuts scheduled for March 1 go into effect a majority of the FAA's 47,000 employees would need to be furloughed for approximately one day per pay period until the end of the fiscal year in September, with a maximum of two days per pay period. These furloughs and other actions mentioned in the letter would begin in April, and will be finalized as to scope and details through collaborative discussions with our users and our unions.

We know you have many questions about how these changes will affect you personally. Additional information about how sequestration will directly impact employees will be available in the coming days.

The Secretary and I deeply value your commitment to maintaining the safest aviation system in the world. Thank you for your service and continued professionalism, in spite of the challenges and uncertainties we face today.

-Michael



Letter to stakeholders:
http://www.faa.gov/news/updates/media/2013_02_22_10_00_10.pdf

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[Warrenlm]

Analysis: Obama, GOP see no need to stop the cuts - Yahoo! Finance (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/analysis-obama-gop-see-no-stop-cuts-205933116.html)

Piece's "analysis" says both the President and the Congress seem to be willing to allow the sequestration (and furloughs) to go forward. I wonder what alternatives for implementing the forced reductions were considered in the Executive Branch before the Obama Administration decided to make the impact so hard on people and so widespread as they picked the methods to meet the financial requirements. Perhaps I'm wrong but I doubt the legislation decreed the final details. In the past, whenever absorbing cuts of even greater magnitude was necessary, much effort was always made to do the opposite of what is being done now. Sure looks like President Obama wants to make the pain felt by people.

[burrocrat]

about a year and a half ago my agency started aggressively cutting costs to preempt the need to use furloughs. reducing staff ceilings by not backfilling, let all temporary employees go, closed some offices, consolidated others under shared management, cut most travel and training, quit bulk mailings, cut supply budgets to the bone, print everything double-sided and liberating pens from bank and restaurant counters, etc.

we were sitting pretty smug watching other gov entities fret recently about temp/contractor/travel budgets knowing we had already saved/stashed enough in the budget to avoid furloughs. this was the reward for enduring unforced austerity, we can avoid furloughs at least until next fiscal year, or so we were told.

then a few weeks ago the tune changed. no matter who you are or what you've already sacrificed/extra workload you've picked up, everybody is going to feel this pain equally, all the same, gov wide. strong consistent message from the top down. no choice in the matter. hands are tied. sorry.

the beatings will continue until revenue improves.

[Boghie]

We are being gamed, the numbers prove it...

The weak and the poor will be culled from the herd. I think the Administration is bluffing using the Washington Monument tactic. However, I think the bluff will be called. Anyone remember NTC San Diego. Nice Navy training command right next to the Pacific Fleet. The Navy kept putting it on the BRAC List. Every time they hollered that if you going to cut us you are going to cut deep - to the bone man, to the bone!!!

Then, one year, it was cut and the Navy trains its sailors on a lake in Michigan.

That is where I think we are. You going to cut me man, here goes your ability to fly. Cut the DoD 6% and everybody gets a 20% pay cut, carriers get scuttled right offshore the new uppity houses on the old NTC San Diego neighborhood, and our missiles will accidentally launch against Dallas Texas. The Department of Education gets slammed by 5% and all the nations teachers can only set foot in a school one day a week. Our National Forests will burn because their are no firemen, trucks, or planes.

None of that will happen, but the cuts will

It's belt tightening time for us, but first will be a steady diet of slim shakes.

[alevin]

We are being gamed, the numbers prove it...

The weak and the poor will be culled from the herd. I think the Administration is bluffing using the Washington Monument tactic. However, I think the bluff will be called. Anyone remember NTC San Diego. Nice Navy training command right next to the Pacific Fleet. The Navy kept putting it on the BRAC List. Every time they hollered that if you going to cut us you are going to cut deep - to the bone man, to the bone!!!

Then, one year, it was cut and the Navy trains its sailors on a lake in Michigan.

That is where I think we are. You going to cut me man, here goes your ability to fly. Cut the DoD 6% and everybody gets a 20% pay cut, carriers get scuttled right offshore the new uppity houses on the old NTC San Diego neighborhood, and our missiles will accidentally launch against Dallas Texas. The Department of Education gets slammed by 5% and all the nations teachers can only set foot in a school one day a week. Our National Forests will burn because their are no firemen, trucks, or planes.

None of that will happen, but the cuts will

close, Boghie buddy, close. SecAg and the Chief of USFS swear USFS can squeak by this year without furloughs, by cutting back contracts, seasonal hiring, unnecessary travel...of course seasonal hiring means no seasonal firefighters, and maybe some cuts back on all the logistics and supply contracts and contractors that support the firefighting efforts, including some of the actual firefighting itself. We shall see, we shall see.....

It helps a bit that they swiped more than they really needed away from all the local unit everyday budgets late last summer, to make sure they had enough to pay for last years ginormous nationwide firefighting costs last year. We're supposed to get the unused funds back in next few weeks, mediated by higher ups as to which unit gets how much of the refund swag-no guarantees the local unit will get all back of what was swiped from last years local budget.

[WorkFE]

Off the stool Burro, talk of RIF's have been going on since 2009. Every agency has been doing something to reduce cost. Our Garrison has gone from 600 to 400, same work load, and we are still 40 over where they want us to be and will still do the furlough thing when called upon.
As a soldier many years ago I remember 2 man tank crews. And that was in Europe during the cold war. You had to have a driver so that meant the Tank Commander was also the loader and Gunner. As a civilian now I know what my PD says but in the grand sceme of providing quality service to our Soldiers and their Families I've added driver, loader and gunner to my duties:)

[burrocrat]

you make a good point workfe, that was a pretty lame pity party i was throwing for myself anyways. we're all in the same leaky boat, but at least i'm in fine company. see you in the salt mines.

[Boghie]

I guess the weirdest thing about this thing is:

Were has all the money gone...
I know that sounds like a teaser for "American Greed'. I know that we are watching through the adds to see how some scoundrel scammed some sap by over-promising some near future benefit for some small investment payable now.

But seriously, where has the 20% growth over elevated spending in FY2008 gone. Do any of us feel it. In the words of WorkFE, have we hired a marching band to go with the driver, gunner, loader, and commander. Or, have we plated every other drive wheel with gold and silver.

God, I hope so. If we have some fat we can cut and not hurt the customer. However, if the scammer got the cash and bought seminars in Hawaii, meetings in Brussels, a bunch of failed automation projects, built out some big bureaucratic processes, or paid people not to work for half a decade then we have nothing to cut. We will be on TV yammering about how we got a few checks from the perp, invested our life in him, and then couldn't get a hold of him. He is on the lamb, faking his death, and was recently spotted in Monaco. And the viewers of this episode of "American Greed" will be yelling at us to pick ourselves by our bootstraps and stop living off of a ponzi schemes temporary dole.

My guess is that the scammer is still at the phone. Promising stuff in this handset and trying to sucker others on that one. But we suckers (all of us taxpayers) are too poor to be suckered. We ain't got the cash, we ain't got the confidence in the future, and we don't believe anything the scammer is saying. And, we have lots of scammers calling.

We have got to cut spending by around $500 Billion and allow the economy to bring in an increasing revenue stream. Stop scaring people through demands for more of their stuff. Let them make their own financial moves - the scammer will get his cut. But, only if the sucker isn't scared.

[RealMoneyIssues]

But seriously, where has the 20% growth over elevated spending in FY2008 gone.

Quick anecdotal comment:

To answer your question, some of it went to government contract companies...

I was privy (I am waaaaay down the food chain) to a contract award last year that went to a subcontractor (won't mention the name) under Lockheed Martin. The value of the contract was $2.5 million, for 5 contractors, for one year...

You do the math :nuts:

[Boghie]

Quick anecdotal comment:

To answer your question, some of it went to government contract companies...

I was privy (I am waaaaay down the food chain) to a contract award last year that went to a subcontractor (won't mention the name) under Lockheed Martin. The value of the contract was $2.5 million, for 5 contractors, for one year...

You do the math :nuts:

NMCI - Non Mission Capable Internet

Nuff said...

But, to say more:nuts:...
The USMC ended up with a reasonable network infrastructure, but the data systems and automation advances soon advanced into the 1950s and stayed there. The dumbies that built and signed that dumb bunny contract thought that contracting out the wiring and switches - and losing control of their ability to modernize their automated systems - would result in great productivity gains. Why have a 'state of the art' network without data. And, I am kinda loose on the meaning of 'state of the art'. We are far behind our capabilities of a decade ago. Now, the people in charge have only lived the NMCI dream. They do not even know what a force multiplier data could be. They think e-signed Adobe pdfs are the shiznit and don't even have the skillset to get that right. Yowser...

[RealMoneyIssues]

The contract wasn't NMCI related, but NMCI was definitely a waste of money...

[burrocrat]

i think this is called an oxymoron, or how to tell if the numbers don't add up.

as it relates to air travel: sequestration will negatively impact travelers because there will be less personnel to process passengers, man towers, and direct flights. but because of the reduced personal incomes and the inconvenience of longer waits and the uncertain economy there will also be less travelers available to experience the waits in line.

on one hand we have two victims, the unemployed controllers and potential passengers. on the other hand it washes out and wait times to get frisked to see if you have too much shampoo stashed in your underwear before boarding a carbon fiber bullet with faulty batteries will be about the same because less potential terrorists will be able to afford to populate the security line.

something doesn't pencil out here. there's a yin for every yang. which fear you gonna buy?

[Boghie]

Spot on from Matthew Yglesias: 'Forget Sequestration' (http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2013/02/the_coming_government_shutdown_the_march_1_sequest ration_deadline_is_fake.html)

The scary thing for all of us is that everybody is looking past sequestration. That will hurt us for a while. But, again we are being gamed. Sequestration 'hits' in early March, we have to have 30 days notification, so we will get hit in early April.

The Continuing Resolution ends late March. The struggle for an actual budgeted spending process will begin earlier. I think we will actually get some sort of number, and thus some real authorization for spending. At that point (whether late March or sometime in April) our agencies will have a number to spend to that is legit and is real. Then, the dumb bunny answer of sequestration (the only spending restraint our goobers could think of) will be obsolete. Thus, sequestration will be resolved either before it starts or soon thereafter if our elected goobers have any management skillset whatsoever...

Hopefully, the result will be at least the cut of the sequester; but provide the agencies the flexibility to manage the cut. Hopefully, the agencies will not simply 'cut' by not hiring positions that have never been filled. Hopefully, everyone will treat this in an adult manner. We have customers and there is a cost of doing business.

[burrocrat]

i was bored and couldn't sleep so i was doing some reading on the cbo.gov where i came across some truly eye opening statistics. 2013 spending on the supplemental nutrition assistance program (snap) is projected at about $82 billion. that struck me as odd because the goal of the furloughs is to save the gov about $85 this fiscal year.

another way to look at it is that every extra day off and every less dollar you bring in goes directly into feeding those less fortunate. so that should ease the pain of sequestration a little and give you something to feel good about in your new found spare time.

it's not exactly a straight one for one trade because of newtons 3rd law of equal and opposite reactions. for instance, a 10-20% reduction in gross income means gov will collect correspondingly less income taxes (most feds are probably in the 15-25% tax bracket, or about $20 billion less savings). also, many feds in the gs 03-07 pay scale (due to length of service or chosen vocation) will now be likely to both qualify for and utilize snap benefits, thereby increasing snap expenditures. presumably, after 10 years like that the bellies should all be full and the budget deficit problem solved. i'm not sure how $850 billion in savings equates to $1.2 trillion sequester, but it probably has something to do with less carried interest and wars we don't fight.

there's probably some other unintended consequences in there that are beyond my capacity to figure out but you get the picture. basically, we all get to work less so our government can afford to feed those who don't work more. ahh, the great leveling. we are all in this together. from each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

see you in the soup line.

[Boghie]

Burro,

The Sequester cuts scheduled for this year are compressed to occur in full from early April through September 30th. If the Sequester cuts continue than there will be about $120 Billion per year in cuts that are spread through 12 months rather than 6. Also, some of the cuts could be offset by either the poor or the pissed leaving Government Service.

[Kaufmanrider]

Burro,

The Sequester cuts scheduled for this year are compressed to occur in full from early April through September 30th. If the Sequester cuts continue than there will be about $120 Billion per year in cuts that are spread through 12 months rather than 6. Also, some of the cuts could be offset by either the poor or the pissed leaving Government Service.

Got my letter. April 21 is the start date for Furlough. Damn, can't wait to retire, getting tired of this. Eligible June 5. If I hadn't taken a paid move/promotion in December I'd be going. Stuck staying until December or I have to pay the move back. I'll stay to Jan to get my 100% of Sick Leave. ;)

[k0nkuzh0n]

Got my letter. April 21 is the start date for Furlough. Damn, can't wait to retire, getting tired of this. Eligible June 5. If I hadn't taken a paid move/promotion in December I'd be going. Stuck staying until December or I have to pay the move back. I'll stay to Jan to get my 100% of Sick Leave. ;)

If I was going to retire within a year, I think I would love the hours cut. I mean its not like they are cutting your rate.

[Boghie]

Does a sequester falling in the woods make a sound... (http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/the-big-sequester-gamble-how-badly-will-the-cuts-hurt/2013/02/23/be0c44e2-7c4e-11e2-82e8-61a46c2cde3d_story.html)

[Sensei]

Whether furloughs happen or not, just the specter alone has scared me into cancelling my family's vacation plans. We're going to visit my folks and just stay quietly at home with them for a couple weeks this summer. No Disney, no Hawaii, no hotels, very little eating out. Even if the furloughs don't happen, general belt-tightening is here to stay in our household. I think that could be one of the unforeseen negative effects of this on our economy, especially if the other 800,000 DOD employees are of a similar mindset. Furloughs or not, I'll bet we'll see consumer spending take a dive when quarterly reports come out.

[James48843]

Merit System Protection Board fears employees may appeal furloughs...


MSPB Chairman Susan Tsui Grundmann sent a letter (http://cdn.govexec.com/media/gbc/docs/pdfs_edit/022213kl1.pdf) on Thursday to Sen. Tom Carper, D-Del., the new chairman of the Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee, requesting a meeting to discuss the issue.


“It has been reported that sequestration could result in the furlough of ‘hundreds of thousands’ of federal employees,” the letter stated. “If this report is accurate and even a fraction of federal employees who are furloughed as a result of sequestration exercise their right to file an appeal, it would not only dramatically increase MSPB’s caseload but create a ‘domino effect’ that could seriously affect the operations of federal agencies, as they divert resources from fulfilling mission-critical work to litigating furloughed employees appeals. Moreover, MSPB itself could be required to furlough its workforce as a result of sequestration, leaving the agency with less staff and fewer resources to process and decide furlough appeals.”

What do you think? Will you appeal? And clog up the system?

More:
MSPB Braces for Possible Flood of Furlough Appeals - Pay & Benefits - GovExec.com (http://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/2013/02/mspb-braces-flood-furlough-appeals/61463/?oref=top-story)

[dhstdog]

Whether furloughs happen or not, just the specter alone has scared me into cancelling my family's vacation plans. We're going to visit my folks and just stay quietly at home with them for a couple weeks this summer. No Disney, no Hawaii, no hotels, very little eating out. Even if the furloughs don't happen, general belt-tightening is here to stay in our household. I think that could be one of the unforeseen negative effects of this on our economy, especially if the other 800,000 DOD employees are of a similar mindset. Furloughs or not, I'll bet we'll see consumer spending take a dive when quarterly reports come out.

Payroll taxes and freezing the G workers pay for three years is already making its impact known.

[hotwings]

I wish they would jsut settle this.

[Scout333]

Just a heads up, May not want to do this from work! Could get ugly! JMHO

[sniper]

i bought cans of alpo to weather the storm ;)

[WorkFE]

FTR- Ol'Roy dry dog food, 34 cents a pound.

[sniper]

FTR- Ol'Roy dry dog food, 34 cents a pound.

nice, what's the protein content like? i wonder if i could get all jacked on dog food and lifting weights

[Asylum]

Spot on from Matthew Yglesias: 'Forget Sequestration' (http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2013/02/the_coming_government_shutdown_the_march_1_sequest ration_deadline_is_fake.html)

The scary thing for all of us is that everybody is looking past sequestration. That will hurt us for a while. But, again we are being gamed. Sequestration 'hits' in early March, we have to have 30 days notification, so we will get hit in early April.

The Continuing Resolution ends late March. The struggle for an actual budgeted spending process will begin earlier. I think we will actually get some sort of number, and thus some real authorization for spending. At that point (whether late March or sometime in April) our agencies will have a number to spend to that is legit and is real. Then, the dumb bunny answer of sequestration (the only spending restraint our goobers could think of) will be obsolete. Thus, sequestration will be resolved either before it starts or soon thereafter if our elected goobers have any management skillset whatsoever...

Hopefully, the result will be at least the cut of the sequester; but provide the agencies the flexibility to manage the cut. Hopefully, the agencies will not simply 'cut' by not hiring positions that have never been filled. Hopefully, everyone will treat this in an adult manner. We have customers and there is a cost of doing business.



Yes, the March 27 Continuing Resolution expiration date is the real danger... yet no one is talking about it.

[nnuut]

The Furloughs will be a TAX on a small portion of the country to allow more spending on give-a-ways, fairness is not a consideration.

[James48843]

This out of the White House last night- A state-by-state evaluation of the impact of sequestration on jobs and the economy:






THE WHITE HOUSEFebruary 24, 2013



White House Releases New State-by-State Reports on the Impacts of the Sequester
WASHINGTON, DC – Today, the White House is releasing new state-by-state reports on the devastating impact the sequester will have on jobs and middle class families across the country if Congressional Republicans fail to compromise to avert the sequester by March 1st.



The link to each state report can be found below:
1. Alabama (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Alabama.pdf)
2. Alaska (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Alaska.pdf)
3. Arizona (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Arizona.pdf)
4. Arkansas (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Arkansas.pdf)
5. California (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/California.pdf)
6. Colorado (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Colorado.pdf)
7. Connecticut (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Connecticut.pdf)
8. Delaware (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Delaware.pdf)
9. District of Columbia (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/district-of-columbia.pdf)
10. Florida (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Florida.pdf)
11. Georgia (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Georgia.pdf)
12. Hawaii (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Hawaii.pdf)
13. Idaho (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Idaho.pdf)
14. Illinois (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Illinois.pdf)
15. Indiana (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/indiana.pdf)
16. Iowa (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Iowa.pdf)
17. Kansas (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Kansas.pdf)
18. Kentucky (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Kentucky.pdf)
19. Louisiana (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Louisiana.pdf)
20. Maine (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Maine.pdf)
21. Maryland (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Maryland.pdf)
22. Massachusetts (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Massachusetts.pdf)
23. Michigan (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Michigan.pdf)
24. Minnesota (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Minnesota.pdf)
25. Mississippi (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Mississippi.pdf)
26. Missouri (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Missouri.pdf)
27. Montana (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Montana.pdf)
28. Nebraska (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Nebraska.pdf)
29. Nevada (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Nevada.pdf)
30. New Hampshire (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/New-Hampshire.pdf)
31. New Jersey (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/New-Jersey.pdf)
32. New Mexico (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/New-Mexico.pdf)
33. New York (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/New-York.pdf)
34. North Carolina (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/North-Carolina.pdf)
35. North Dakota (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/North-Dakota.pdf)
36. Ohio (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Ohio.pdf)
37. Oklahoma (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Oklahoma.pdf)
38. Oregon (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Oregon.pdf)
39. Pennsylvania (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Pennsylvania.pdf)
40. Rhode Island (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Rhode-Island.pdf)
41. South Carolina (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/South-Carolina.pdf)
42. South Dakota (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/South-Dakota.pdf)
43. Tennessee (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/tennessee.pdf)
44. Texas (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Texas.pdf)
45. Utah (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Utah.pdf)
46. Vermont (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Vermont.pdf)
47. Virginia (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Virginia.pdf)
48. Washington (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Washington.pdf)
49. West Virginia (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/West-Virginia.pdf)
50. Wisconsin (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Wisconsin.pdf)
51. Wyoming (http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/docs/sequester-factsheets/Wyoming.pdf)

###

[Birchtree]

Boys, it's time to tighten those ...well you know what. Bring on some pain for those most deserving.

[k0nkuzh0n]

This out of the White House last night- A state-by-state evaluation of the impact of sequestration on jobs and the economy:


Good info, except the top of those pdfs make my roll my eyes and question the intent

[Birchtree]

Most common sense people relize the white house is very low on integrity and truth telling. The place is being run by a bunch of liberal thugs.

[PLANO]

It's the White House that needs to compromise by proposing a plan (i.e. lead...somebody look that definition up for the President please) on real spending cuts to balance the budget. Congress just compromised in January by raising taxes on the wealthy, now the President says they aren't compromising because they don't want to raise taxes...again.

Sequestration originated from the White House. Now Barry's freaking out. Cry me a river.

[WorkFE]

Latest rumor where I work is no 4 day week. Our bosses say to continue services he will work us 4 six's and 1 eight. So much for trying to keep this as painless as possible for the employees.

[James48843]

From Transportation Secretary Ray Lahood this morning:




Colleagues,

I know that all of you have been following with interest and concern the news about the across-the-board Federal spending cuts (also known as “sequestration”) set to occur this Friday, March 1.

If a sequestration order is issued, the U.S. Department of Transportation will be cut by about $1 billion for its core programs, and
another $600 million in funding provided for Hurricane Sandy relief. Not only will this affect DOT employees, contractors, and dozens of our programs, it will seriously impact transportation services that are critical to the traveling public.

Safety will always be our top priority, but if sequestration occurs, some of our modes will need to make cuts to restrict staffing and prioritize safety activities. Most acutely, the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) cannot avoid the reductions that will create transportation delays for the traveling public.

Some of our transportation programs, such as our airport grant program, trust-funded highway programs, motor carrier safety programs, and vehicle safety programs, are exempt from sequestration and will not be affected. Additionally, some of our modes will not have their administrative budgets impacted by sequestration; others will be able to sustain sequestration funding reductions by instituting hiring freezes, cutting contracts, and taking other administrative reductions. But even after implementing such measures, we expect that furloughs will be necessary in the FAA and may be required in the Federal Transit Administration and the Surface Transportation Board.

I want to assure you that we are doing all we can to minimize the disruption sequestration would have on our transportation programs while still protecting our core operations and mission. We are using all the tools at our disposal including closely examining contracts, grants, and other forms of expenditures across the Department. We are reducing operational and administrative areas wherever possible, including cuts to travel, training, facilities, and supplies. These actions help, but in some cases, cannot close the gap due to the rigid nature of the cuts imposed by Congress.

Again, at FAA, where furloughs are unavoidable, based on the latest information, sequestration will require approximately $600 million in cuts. This means that we expect that a vast majority of FAA’s nearly 47,000 employees will be furloughed for approximately 1 day per pay period, beginning in April and continuing until the end of the fiscal year in September. The furlough would not exceed 2 days per pay period.

The furlough of a large number of air traffic controllers and technicians also will require a reduction in the amount of air traffic, so planes can be safely managed by the remaining staff. This means a less efficient and less convenient air travel service for the American traveling public, as well as negative effects on our economy.

Right now, our focus is identifying ways to mitigate the funding shortfall for the remainder of this fiscal year. But these consequences will stretch far beyond the next few months. Should sequestration occur, we also will need to make difficult choices about which services to continue, which services to drastically reduce, and which services to completely eliminate over the coming years.

We realize that this is a difficult time for everyone. Please be assured that we are doing everything we can to limit the negative impact on DOT employees. Should furloughs be required, all affected employees would be provided with at least 30 days’ notice, or notice as required by collective bargaining agreements. We will also continue to engage in discussions with employee unions as appropriate, to ensure that any furloughs are applied in a fair and appropriate manner.

If you have questions, I encourage you to go to the Office of Personnel Management website (http://www.opm.gov/furlough) which has helpful information and answers to frequently asked questions under the “administrative furlough” section.

Your modal administrator or OST director also will be following up with more information about how sequestration may affect the day-to-day operations of your mode or office.

Thank you for your patience as we work through these challenging issues, and for your continued service to the Department and the Nation.

-Ray LaHood

[CrabClaw]

brutal..

[Bquat]

From Transportation Secretary Ray Lahood this morning:




Another plea to the public, what is $600 million to $61 Billion of the aid package. Museum may not get the roof it needs.

[James48843]

22606



22607



22608

[RealMoneyIssues]

22608

That's correct, because as we all know, the Democrats have no responsibility for any of this...

Not

[James48843]

That's correct, because as we all know, the Democrats have no responsibility for any of this...



RealMoneyIssues: Just for you, then:

I don't draw them. I just post them.

22609

22610

22611

[RealMoneyIssues]

RealMoneyIssues: Just for you, then:

I don't draw them. I just post them.

As usual, you missed my point... You are just posting pro-democrat cartoons... wow :nuts: Always gotta go political, swinging ONLY one way.

http://danieljmitchell.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/sequester-cartoon-varvel.jpg

http://danieljmitchell.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/sequester-cartoon-benson.jpg?w=500

http://polination.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/sequestration-cartoon.jpg?w=500

http://media.cagle.com/46/2013/02/20/127544_600.jpg



And just to be funny... NOT (this is actually pretty scary)

http://newsblogs.chicagotribune.com/.a/6a00d8341c60fd53ef017d4134a2a4970c-800wi

[Frixxxx]

"We the people" will feel "we the people's representation" effects of the jointly signed Act that will cause sequestration to occur. This act was initally signed because the one side wanted more money, and one side wanted cuts in return. One side got theirs, now the other side is asking "where's theirs?"

[nnuut]

"We the people" will feel "we the people's representation" effects of the jointly signed Act that will cause sequestration to occur. This act was initally signed because the one side wanted more money, and one side wanted cuts in return. One side got theirs, now the other side is asking "where's theirs?"
It's simple as that a deal is a deal, but one side seems to make it a habit to forget all about that when pay up day comes.

[burrocrat]

only a couple more days for the spendingcutaphobics to finish working up their gianormous tizzy fit into a media climax, then after taking a healthy dose of fiscal medicine i suspect the patient will be feeling much better by the middle of next week.

unfortunately, even the smallest display of fiscal discipline will probably make the usd$ appear less weak which could be a drag on the markets. on the other hand, any effort to restore sanity to the budget may go a long way to convincing the public that our capitalistic system may yet survive in the utopian everything is free for the disadvantaged near-term future.

one thing nobody is talking about is if the furloughs result in a credit downgrade again. the s&p downgraded us the last time we played chicken and couldn't reach a solution like adults. but after telling the truth about the u.s. financial picture the u.s. sued them for not telling the truth about the housing collapse earlier so they probably don't want to downgrade us again anytime soon. moodys or fitch might do it, one of them just poked a stick at the u.k. bear, but the last time they didn't tell the truth about our economy they didn't get sued by our economy so there may be a reverse incentive there.

oh well, it's out of my hands, over the cliff we go. i'm starting to get used to this lurching from crisis to crisis game our leaders play. after all, it's the only game in town.

wheeeeee!

[James48843]

My Agency issued another new set of "Frequently Asked Questions" about the furlough. There are too many for me to cut and paste here, so here is a link to a PDF version. I copied my Agency's document, and then uploaded it to my Union's website:

http://aircraftcert.org/2013_sequestration_faqs.pdf

Enjoy. More reading.

[PLANO]

I heard today my agency will be pushing the furlough days to not begin until late April or early May, slashing as many non-personnel areas as possible first. I think they're hoping things will get resolved prior to anyone actually taking a day off...but who knows. Last time this happened in the '90s and people got days off and then got back pay when they came back to work...kind of defeats the purpose but nothing surprises me anymore.

[Khotso]

I heard today my agency will be pushing the furlough days to not begin until late April or early May, slashing as many non-personnel areas as possible first. I think they're hoping things will get resolved prior to anyone actually taking a day off...but who knows. Last time this happened in the '90s and people got days off and then got back pay when they came back to work...kind of defeats the purpose but nothing surprises me anymore.

90s was an entirely different situation. Gov't got shut down -- no budget, no CR. Everyone except a few "essential" personnel were furloughed indefinitely immediately. That could happen March 27th though if our "leaders" -- now there's an oxymoron if there ever was one -- don't extend the CR or pass a budget. But don't expect getting paid retroactively for furlough days this time. Whole other ball game today PLANO.

[James48843]

On "federalnewsradio" today:

"Living Expenses at risk...."


The union (NTEU) released a survey (http://www.federalnewsradio.com/pdfs/Sequestration_Survey_Fact_Sheet.pdf) of federal employees detailing what the respondents say would be the impact of cuts from sequestration.

The survey found 82 percent of federal employees who responded said sequestration-induced furloughs of one-day-a-week would cause them difficulty in paying for their living expenses, such as mortgages, rent and food.

Additionally, the survey found 63 percent of the respondents said furloughs from sequestration would force them to take money out of savings or retirement accounts.

NTEU received responses from 2,258 federal employees on the impact of budget reductions from sequestration and the ongoing financial challenges agencies face are having across the government. It conducted the survey online and through its electronic newsletter over a three-day period in February.

The survey covered both the potential personal impact of sequestration as well as the longer-term budget pressures agencies have been under. For instance, 79 percent of the respondents said their agency is not replacing workers who leave, while 68 percent say they lack the resources to complete their job properly.


Complete story here:
Before furloughs, agencies must negotiate terms with unions - FederalNewsRadio.com (http://www.federalnewsradio.com/1104/3235054/Before-furloughs-agencies-must-negotiate-terms-with-unions)-

[FAB1]

The teleprompter-dependent One cannot be blamed for anything.

~ Driive By Media

[burrocrat]

well it appears we may actually get some real spending cuts. of course when it's time to spend we need to target that free money to specific groups like, well, you know. but when it's time to cut there is no discretion and we all will kneel.

problem seems to be nobody much cares. eat it gov employees. too bad benefit recipients. the cubbard is bare. ha ha!

YouTube (http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=rX7wtNOkuHo&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DrX7wtNOkuHo)

[sniper]

i'm thinking this furlough will happen but a deal will get resolved before losing all 22 days. nothing gets done in the government without a lot of drama first. it is what it is

i for one wished that the government will target the programs that people are abusing to hell first (like welfare and those parents who have 10+ kids to get free money), but that will probably never happen. it's been an issue as long as i can remember

[burrocrat]

aaahhhhh, breath deep my friends, and remember well the smell. today is the last day the stench of fiscal over spending rot and decay shall ever these nostrils assault. for tomorrow is a brand new clean world, a world of virtuous frugality and sensible budgets where no one need fear the furlough. a world where frivolous foriegn junkets and transfer payments to appease special interests are sacrificed in favor of paying the bills at home, a world of freedom from our financial overlords.

meanwhile, back at the ranch...

US: $60 million in new aid to Syria opposition - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/us-60-million-aid-syria-opposition-115344333--politics.html?.tsrc=attmp)

[Frixxxx]

Ok, can I ask all of you the significance of the sequestration?

You do know that the same cuts will need to last NINE MORE YEARS to meet the proposed cuts to 2022, Right?

Now, based on current scenarios and the agencies requirements, can you all live with next NINE years with 20% pay cuts?

Just asking.

[WorkFE]

While we talk about furlough's for Federal employees there is new spending for Food and medical supplies to the Syrian opposition, some of which are Islamist.
Remember the movie "The Patriot" when the Generals supply ship is exploding in the harbor during the ball and the woman next to him is clapping saying "Oh goody, fire works".
Thats what I thought of when I read that article, Thanks Burro. :)

[RealMoneyIssues]

Ok, can I ask all of you the significance of the sequestration?

You do know that the same cuts will need to last NINE MORE YEARS to meet the proposed cuts to 2022, Right?

Now, based on current scenarios and the agencies requirements, can you all live with next NINE years with 20% pay cuts?

Just asking.

Um, I don't think that is accurate. What are you basing that on?

[Frixxxx]

Um, I don't think that is accurate. What are you basing that on?
Sequester madness: What it is, why it matters - U.S. News (http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/21/17042974-sequester-madness-what-it-is-why-it-matters?lite)

[RealMoneyIssues]

Sequester madness: What it is, why it matters - U.S. News (http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/21/17042974-sequester-madness-what-it-is-why-it-matters?lite)

Ok, still missing it, but that's ok, I'm dense. I will leave this alone because it will become a political discussion.

[Frixxxx]

Ok, still missing it, but that's ok, I'm dense. I will leave this alone because it will become a political discussion.

The initial spending cuts were to equal $1.2Trillion over ten years. This sequestration effort in 2013 is the first year. So 10-1 equals 9 years left to keep reducing spending.

[burrocrat]

You do know that the same cuts will need to last NINE MORE YEARS to meet the proposed cuts to 2022, Right?

Now, based on current scenarios and the agencies requirements, can you all live with next NINE years with 20% pay cuts?


i don't think we get a choice in the matter. either somebody quits spending or some other bodies quit working. that's what the news said.

[Warrenlm]

How Furloughs Will Affect Pay and Benefits - Pay & Benefits Watch - Pay & Benefits - GovExec.com (http://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/pay-benefits-watch/2013/02/how-furloughs-will-affect-pay-and-benefits/61563/)

afterthought: I wish SHE would take a permanent furlough. "Sen. Barbara Mikulski, D-Md., said she thinks lawmakers need to sacrifice their own pay if federal employees are forced to take unpaid leave as a result of sequestration. “If the federal employees are going to take a 20 percent cut and be furloughed, we should take a 20 percent cut,” Mikulski said Tuesday on the Senate floor. “If they take a hit, we should take a hit, and I look forward to moving on that legislation,” said the new chairman of the Appropriations Committee. Many federal employees live and work in Maryland, so Mikulski’s staunch defense of feds and opposition to sequestration comes as no surprise."

[James48843]

The initial spending cuts were to equal $1.2Trillion over ten years. This sequestration effort in 2013 is the first year. So 10-1 equals 9 years left to keep reducing spending.

That is correct- 2013 is just the first year of ten years of cuts. However, that isn't to say that we'll all have furlough days in future years. The agencies will have to stop hiring people to cut costs, and eventually enough people will leave to prevent everyone from having to take furlough days. And next year we'll have the whole year to spread the cuts across, not just six months. So there should be fewer furlough days in FY-2014.


The beatings will continue until morale improves.

[RealMoneyIssues]

Now, based on current scenarios and the agencies requirements, can you all live with next NINE years with 20% pay cuts?


The initial spending cuts were to equal $1.2Trillion over ten years. This sequestration effort in 2013 is the first year. So 10-1 equals 9 years left to keep reducing spending.

So your assumption is that your pay will be cut 20% for the next 9 years? Ok, don't see it, but like I said earlier, I am dense.

22 days out of 260 working days is a 8.5% cut and I assume that furloughs are being used as a political tool. I am sorry that all of you are the recipients of this political BS (that is NOT Birchtree Sentiment).

Like Jim said, the reason this year is such a big deal is because the sequester cuts are going to be implemented fully in a partial year (7 months, vice 12 months) due to can kicking. This shortened time to implement Sequester along with the inability for Congress (both Senate and House for those who do not know) to pass a budget has made this a bigger deal than it otherwise would have been.

I knew I shouldn't have gotten into this thread (the reason why I don't participate in the political forums), because I am not smart enough to understand all of this.

Sorry, I will stand aside for those smarter than me to discuss furloughs.

[Frixxxx]

So your assumption is that your pay will be cut 20% for the next 9 years? Ok, don't see it, but like I said earlier, I am dense.

22 days out of 260 working days is a 8.5% cut and I assume that furloughs are being used as a political tool. I am sorry that all of you are the recipients of this political BS (that is NOT Birchtree Sentiment).

Like Jim said, the reason this year is such a big deal is because the sequester cuts are going to be implemented fully in a partial year (7 months, vice 12 months) due to can kicking. This shortened time to implement Sequester along with the inability for Congress (both Senate and House for those who do not know) to pass a budget has made this a bigger deal than it otherwise would have been.

I knew I shouldn't have gotten into this thread (the reason why I don't participate in the political forums), because I am not smart enough to understand all of this.

Sorry, I will stand aside for those smarter than me to discuss furloughs.

My assumption is that every year would be like this year, 4-5 months of no action then BAM 7 months of trying to hit the cuts.....meaning I am not trust the government to PLAN for 12 months. Sorry for the confusion RMI!:embarrest:

[WorkFE]

FTR, for the time being, nobody is taking a 20% pay reduction (NOBODY)
You may, depending on your job, take a 20% reduction in hours worked. Now I know we are talking apples and oranges here but there is a significant difference.

[Frixxxx]

FTR, for the time being, nobody is taking a 20% pay reduction (NOBODY)
You may, depending on your job, take a 20% reduction in hours worked. Now I know we are talking apples and oranges here but there is a significant difference.
Yea, I guess your right, I wonder how they will work 8.5% of work hours into the current pay system for the next 9 years. YEAH less pay, same work and more if they don't replace those that just say SCREW IT!

[Khotso]

How Furloughs Will Affect Pay and Benefits - Pay & Benefits Watch - Pay & Benefits - GovExec.com (http://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/pay-benefits-watch/2013/02/how-furloughs-will-affect-pay-and-benefits/61563/)

afterthought: I wish SHE would take a permanent furlough. "Sen. Barbara Mikulski, D-Md., said she thinks lawmakers need to sacrifice their own pay if federal employees are forced to take unpaid leave as a result of sequestration. “If the federal employees are going to take a 20 percent cut and be furloughed, we should take a 20 percent cut,” Mikulski said Tuesday on the Senate floor. “If they take a hit, we should take a hit, and I look forward to moving on that legislation,” said the new chairman of the Appropriations Committee. Many federal employees live and work in Maryland, so Mikulski’s staunch defense of feds and opposition to sequestration comes as no surprise."

So let me get this straight Warren, you wish Mikulski would take a permanent furlough because she thinks and says that Congress should take the same furlough/pay cut that fed employees are forced to take?:confused:

[WorkFE]

My apologies to the temp, term and contractors who potentially could lose much more than 20%.

Frixxx,
I have been tracking man hours per my SSP's for the past 5 years. I am able to tell them what I can do in a 40 hour week and what I can not do. Now I will admit it is easy for me because I am a 1 person MDEP but when they cut hours I can show them what stops or what percentage of each service I can provide. It's their job to determine what level they want me to operate at and to except the risk at reduced levels or not.

[Frixxxx]

My apologies to the temp, term and contractors who potentially could lose much more than 20%.

Frixxx,
I have been tracking man hours per my SSP's for the past 5 years. I am able to tell them what I can do in a 40 hour week and what I can not do. Now I will admit it is easy for me because I am a 1 person MDEP but when they cut hours I can show them what stops or what percentage of each service I can provide. It's their job to determine what level they want me to operate at and to except the risk at reduced levels or not.

All good, I'm project based and I have mapped out two years of planning based on requirements and I'm down three resources. They take a day away from me, milestones missed and scheduling conflicts ensue. If I have contractors in a holding pattern during my furlough days, the stoppage gets compounded. Then make me do less next year.....and well, it gets exacorbated and I exaspirated.
And at no time did furloughs enter into my risk matrix.

[sniper]

aaahhhhh, breath deep my friends, and remember well the smell. today is the last day the stench of fiscal over spending rot and decay shall ever these nostrils assault. for tomorrow is a brand new clean world, a world of virtuous frugality and sensible budgets where no one need fear the furlough. a world where frivolous foriegn junkets and transfer payments to appease special interests are sacrificed in favor of paying the bills at home, a world of freedom from our financial overlords.

meanwhile, back at the ranch...

US: $60 million in new aid to Syria opposition - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/us-60-million-aid-syria-opposition-115344333--politics.html?.tsrc=attmp)

Because cutting hours for federal workforce will save a big percentage of government spending, right?

[Bquat]

What worries me about this kind of furlough is that it's not like a spending cap furlough. This one is non-refundable for you guys.:mad:

[sniper]

What worries me about this kind of furlough is that it's not like a spending cap furlough. This one is non-refundable for you guys.:mad:

i just wish for once, congress/white house would target big-spending issues rather than always targeting federal employees first. when it comes to the slice of the pie we cost to the government budget, we are microscopic.

sequestration won't handle anything when it comes to tackling the budget issue. if anything we're just getting penalized for the government's inability to get anything worked out

[RealMoneyIssues]

Because cutting hours for federal workforce will save a big percentage of government spending, right?

Uh, no...

[WorkFE]

if anything we're just getting penalized for the government's inability to get anything worked out

There are alot of us federal employees but the truth is we are a smaller voting block than some other places they could cut money.

[sniper]

Uh, no...

i was being sarcastic

[James48843]

What? We need to save $85 BILLION dollars, or else everyone loses their federal job?


Heck- that's an EASY one.

I know EXACLTY where we can save $85 BILLION dollars!

U.S. to Take Over AIG in $85 Billion Bailout; Central Banks Inject Cash as Credit Dries Up - WSJ.com (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122156561931242905.html)

[WorkFE]

That takes care of this year James, 9 more to go.

[nnuut]

What? We need to save $85 BILLION dollars, or else everyone loses their federal job?


Heck- that's an EASY one.

I know EXACLTY where we can save $85 BILLION dollars!

U.S. to Take Over AIG in $85 Billion Bailout; Central Banks Inject Cash as Credit Dries Up - WSJ.com (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122156561931242905.html)

Make that $44 Billion for 2013:


Widely quoted as $85 billion for spending in fiscal year 2013 (which ends on September 30), the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) underscores that just $44 billion of spending reduction (http://reason.com/blog/2013/02/19/what-will-sequestration-really-look-like) are slated for 2013, with the rest coming in later years. So what we're talking about is trimming $44 billion from total federal spending expected to be $3.6 trillion this year. If you use the $85 billion number, that's about 2.4 percent of the budget. If you use the $44 billion, you're looking at 1.2 percent.
If You Think the Sequester Cuts Will Tank the Economy, I've Got a Bridge In Brooklyn You Might Want to Buy - Hit & Run : Reason.com (http://reason.com/blog/2013/02/25/if-you-think-the-sequester-cuts-will-tan)

[RealMoneyIssues]

What? We need to save $85 BILLION dollars, or else everyone loses their federal job?


Heck- that's an EASY one.

I know EXACLTY where we can save $85 BILLION dollars!

U.S. to Take Over AIG in $85 Billion Bailout; Central Banks Inject Cash as Credit Dries Up - WSJ.com (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122156561931242905.html)

Nope, they already paid US back...
Benmosche: AIG Paid America Back, But We Still Have To Consider Suing - Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/sites/steveschaefer/2013/01/08/benmosche-aig-paid-back-taxpayers-but-we-still-have-to-consider-suing-them/)

Unfortunately, it was already spent...

[James48843]

Whitehouse Office of Management and Budget issues new memo-

Directs Agencies to immediate go to "increased scrutany". including what amounts to a hiring freeze, stop all federal employee awards, and stop any new conferences or travel not already scheduled.

" Discretionary bonuses is one of three areas OMB Controller Danny Werfel highlighted where agencies should place "increased scrutiny." The other two areas are the hiring of new employees and new training, conferences or travel.
"In light of the reduced budgetary resources available due to sequestration, expending funds on these activities at this time would in many circumstances not be the most effective way to protect agency mission to the extent practicable," Werfel wrote to agency and department heads. "Therefore, agency leadership should review processes and controls around these activities and ensure that these activities are conducted only to the extent they are the most cost-effective way to maintain critical agency mission operations under sequestration."


New OMB Memo here:


http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/memoranda/2013/m-13-05.pdf

Here we go.

The story is here:
http://www.federalnewsradio.com/1106/3236111/OMB-directs-agencies-to-stop-bonuses-hiring-under-sequestration

[nnuut]

Don't be afraid, they are all JAW and NO TEETH!

[PLANO]

I've been grinding my teeth all week as we've hosted a regional conference in my office. People flying in from all over, hotels, per diem...but we're going to furlough soon...it's crazy.

Here's an idea: cut foreign aid sufficient to meet the goal. Done, and it's not even 5pm yet. Next problem. But our President would rather the country go through this turmoil so he can win the argument. Ridiculous.

[James48843]

Here's an idea: cut foreign aid sufficient to meet the goal. Done, and it's not even 5pm yet. Next problem. But our President would rather the country go through this turmoil so he can win the argument. Ridiculous.


Ok- great. That's an idea. We're trying to find the $85 billion that has to be cut as a result of the sequester. So....you want to cut foreign aid. Fine. Foreign aid, INCLUDING the budget for the entire State Department, including every Embassy, totals about $53 billion this year. ForeignAssistance.gov (http://foreignassistance.gov/CountryIntro.aspx) You would stop our money that is going to rebuild Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan. You would stop the money to Egypt and Israel that was part of the peace process deal signed two decades ago. Got it. You would eliminate the money we're spending to put Russian nukes into safe bunkers where nobody can walk off with them. Sure.

So..you would close the State Department and every Embassy around the world, and make us a country with no presence anywhere. Fine. Now where do you want to cut the remaining 40 billion or so?

[nnuut]

Ok- great. That's an idea. We're trying to find the $85 billion that has to be cut as a result of the sequester. So....you want to cut foreign aid. Fine. Foreign aid, INCLUDING the budget for the entire State Department, including every Embassy, totals about $53 billion this year. ForeignAssistance.gov (http://foreignassistance.gov/CountryIntro.aspx) You would stop our money that is going to rebuild Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan. You would stop the money to Egypt and Israel that was part of the peace process deal signed two decades ago. Got it. You would eliminate the money we're spending to put Russian nukes into safe bunkers where nobody can walk off with them. Sure.

So..you would close the State Department and every Embassy around the world, and make us a country with no presence anywhere. Fine. Now where do you want to cut the remaining 40 billion or so?
And you wouldn't have anything to do!

[Buster]

Most of the Congress went home early today for a long weekend..Man I hope these jerk-offs get elected again...:notrust:

[Warrenlm]

Most of the Congress went home early today for a long weekend..Man I hope these jerk-offs get elected again...:notrust:

The electorate generally does that. Congress is bad but my guy is doing the best he can to help me. Just like the Big O.

[James48843]

IRS Furloughs to Begin After Tax Season

Source: Wall Street Journal

The Internal Revenue Service plans to require five to seven days of unpaid leave for many of it employees through September, but it won’t begin the furloughs until the summer in an effort to avoid disruptions in the April tax filing deadline.

“The IRS is projecting between five and seven furlough days beginning sometime this summer,” National Treasury Employees Union President Colleen Kelley said. “We have had informal discussions with the agency about this matter and we will engage in bargaining when the formal notice of furlough is provided.”

The IRS is a division of the Treasury Department, and Treasury officials have said the furloughs would be necessary to adjust for the budget cuts, known as the sequester, which begin Friday and run through Sept. 30.

It’s possible that some of the IRS’s spending adjustments could begin before the summer, even if the agency delays the furloughs, but no schedule has been released.


How nice of them to wait.
Read more: IRS Furloughs to Begin After Tax Season - Washington Wire - WSJ (http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2013/02/28/irs-furloughs-to-begin-after-tax-season/tab/comments/)

[burrocrat]

What? We need to save $85 BILLION dollars, or else everyone loses their federal job?


Heck- that's an EASY one.

I know EXACLTY where we can save $85 BILLION dollars!

U.S. to Take Over AIG in $85 Billion Bailout; Central Banks Inject Cash as Credit Dries Up - WSJ.com (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122156561931242905.html)

maybe we can save $85 billion by scaling back the f-35 fighter jet program. 2,443 planes is scheduled to cost $396 billion (not including future cost overuns). maybe we cut the order by 20% and only buy 1,950 jets for about $316 billion? the boys still get their toys, the skies have less planes which should help lower the faa folk's stress levels (they can get pretty stressed out you know), and the rest of us rats can go back to our usual hours in the cage.

[PLANO]

Ok- great. That's an idea. We're trying to find the $85 billion that has to be cut as a result of the sequester. So....you want to cut foreign aid. Fine. Foreign aid, INCLUDING the budget for the entire State Department, including every Embassy, totals about $53 billion this year. ForeignAssistance.gov (http://foreignassistance.gov/CountryIntro.aspx) You would stop our money that is going to rebuild Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan. You would stop the money to Egypt and Israel that was part of the peace process deal signed two decades ago. Got it. You would eliminate the money we're spending to put Russian nukes into safe bunkers where nobody can walk off with them. Sure.

So..you would close the State Department and every Embassy around the world, and make us a country with no presence anywhere. Fine. Now where do you want to cut the remaining 40 billion or so?

It's "only" 42 billion, not 85, according to the CBO $85 Billion Versus $42 Billion: The New Sequester Argument : It's All Politics : NPR (http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2013/02/28/173163730/-85-billion-versus-42-billion-the-new-sequester-argument)

And while I would not look at closing embassies, I would look long and hard at sending millions and billions of dollars in foreign aid to many/most of the countries we send money to every year. Including Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, where I think we should come home and stop wasting lives and money. If we don't have enough money to pay our own bills, we certainly shouldn't be printing money to give to other countries, many of which hate us and will continue killing us.

[alevin]

Even smarter would be going with the Boeing competitor. Way cheaper on maintenance costs for the long haul. The Canadians are leaning towards Boeing model for that reason, based on topnotch Canadian former fighter-pilot performance testing of the same.

[FAB1]

How nice of them to wait.
Read more: IRS Furloughs to Begin After Tax Season - Washington Wire - WSJ (http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2013/02/28/irs-furloughs-to-begin-after-tax-season/tab/comments/)

But but I read the that the sequester was going to delay our tax refunds!

Where oh where do I turn for the truth?

[burrocrat]

But but I read the that the sequester was going to delay our tax refunds!

Where oh where do I turn for the truth?

hold on a minute there, you mean to tell me you get a refund? dam loopholers or something, grumble grumble, it just ain't right, eat the rich.

[sniper]

But but I read the that the sequester was going to delay our tax refunds!

Where oh where do I turn for the truth?

already got mine, pays to do it early i guess? lol

[James48843]

.., grumble grumble, it just ain't right, eat the rich.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_M8fOwHnwg0

[FAB1]

already got mine, pays to do it early i guess? lol

Ha I know Im NOT getting any refund, the State takes that.

The point is, it was hogwash about the IRS the WH has been trying to feed us.

So its done now anyway - furlough on, and I stand to be discomfited more than most on this board.

I can take it but the truth is the sequester was designed to inflict the most "pain" to federal employees
because Uncle really doesn't want to stop spending, period. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure
out where the most money is being flushed down the toilet and that the recipients are voters and
those votes cannot be jeopardized.

well this isnt the politics thread I better shush.

[WorkFE]

To be fair the sequester does not tell agencies how to cut money just that it must be cut. In my case the DoD is directing these cuts to be of a pay variety. But even if they chose to eliminate a project or purchase in some way or another it would still affect someones employment.
My only problem is we already gave at the office. Pay freeze, hiring freeze, new hire FERS contribution increase, reduction through attrition etc. Here we are in another year and they come right back to the well without addressing the bigger issue.
See how I kept that non-partisan:laugh:

[James48843]

First "Official" furlough notice delievered this afternoon to an employee - a Deputy U.S. Attorney over at Department of Justice:

http://democrats.oversight.house.gov/images/stories/US_Attorney_Furlough_Notice.pdf

This is what your "pink slip" looks like, folks.

[Birchtree]

Honestly, it's enough pain inflicted on the middle class to make me want to turn in my excess food stamps and return my fully paid for Obama phone...

[PLANO]

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/65945_268022706664248_586801433_n.jpg

[Asylum]

Hey, at least we know how much value we have - heh:

Senator: Obama's Golf Weekend With Tiger Cost As Much As 341 Federal Workers Furloughed | The Weekly Standard (http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/senator-obamas-golf-weekend-tiger-cost-much-341-federal-workers-furloughed_704915.html)

[FAB1]

Honestly, it's enough pain inflicted on the middle class to make me want to turn in my excess food stamps and return my fully paid for Obama phone...

Youre talkin my language.

Here we are in another year and they come right back to the well without addressing the bigger issue.

A 2.3 trillion dollar elephant in the room, eh.

[FAB1]

I gave you a like but that pic made me almost lose my dinner.

Start out with a potential HURL alert in future please

[James48843]

Breaking: Obama Signs Sequestration Order to Begin $85 Billion in Spending Cuts Fri Mar 1, 2013, 09:05 PM USA/ET -

Source: CBS News

President Obama has now signed the sequestration order putting in place $85 bil in automatic spending cuts.
by Steve Holland via twitter 8:41 PM

Obama signs order to begin spending cuts
March 01, 2013

WASHINGTON President Barack Obama has signed an order authorizing the government to begin cutting $85 billion from federal accounts, officially enacting across-the-board reductions that he opposed but failed to avert.

Obama acted Friday, the deadline for the president and Congress to avoid the steep, one-year cuts.

Obama has insisted on replacing the cuts, known as a "sequester" in government budget language, with tax increases and cuts spread out over time. Republicans have rejected any plan that included tax revenue.

The government says the reductions will soon result in furlough notices to government employees and will trim government spending on defense


Read more: Obama signs order to begin spending cuts - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57572184/obama-signs-order-to-begin-spending-cuts)

[burrocrat]

Obama signs order to begin spending cuts

well, that's a good start. i have to admit, i didn't think he could actually do it, but obama just cut spending. what's next? flying pigs? a cold day in hell? it's a brave new world.

[James48843]

from USAA- for those of us who are USAA members:



Solutions From USAA

USAA has a number of solutions to help members who receive a government paycheck and find themselves in financial distress because of sequestration.

These temporary solutions are available for affected members' existing products and include:


Special payment arrangements, which could include payment deferral, on some bank products1.
Refunds of certain fees for credit cards and other USAA Bank products.
Early withdrawal of funds from certificates of deposit without penalties.
Billing arrangements for insurance products.

For those who are adversely impacted by sequestration, we encourage them to contact us so that we can identify solutions that help meet their particular need. Members should contact us for free financial advice at 800-531-USAA (8722).

Potential Payroll Advance Loan
Separately, USAA is monitoring broader federal budget issues for potential impacts on USAA members, including the possibility of a government shutdown in late March. In such an event, USAA is prepared to offer a zero-interest payroll advance loan to members of the military, including the National Guard and Reserves2. The loan would be equivalent to the net amount that is normally deposited for accounts with pre-existing direct-deposit arrangements with USAA. This payroll advance would be offered to eligible members in the event of a government shutdown.

more:



USAA: What to Expect From the Federal Fiscal Fallout

https://www.usaa.com/inet/ent_blogs/Blogs?action=blogpost&blogkey=newsroom&postkey=debt_ceiling_2013&idg=cc_advc_fedbudget2013p2,lbn,PubHome&event=LoadWebOffers&rtwUnicaParms=9129.b3c.2a5a05ba.ffffffffee3d69a2,W ebLargeBannerZone1,0.0,100.0&blogkey=newsroom&postkey=debt_ceiling_2013

[PLANO]

I've loved USAA for over 20 years, I'll never leave them.

[OBGibby]

I've loved USAA for over 20 years, I'll never leave them.

USAA can't be beat. NEVER had a problem in 20+ years. Customer service is top notch and the rates on all facets of their business are great.

[Boghie]

Found a fairly nice furlough calculator, but cannot upload .xlsx files... It is the 'First Army Furlough Calculator'. Googlin' it points to the spreadsheet...

Anyway...

It seems pretty close, but you can screw Uncle Sam and your State by more than they present. Gotta know what you are doing, but I can lop off another $35 or $40 from the Feds and probably $10 from the State in addition to that presented by the calculator. We live in a Progressive Tax World and you are now Poorer:).

If I reduce my TSP to 5%, reduce my car allotment to the minimum, cut my savings allotment, and dump the taxes as noted above I will get my take home cut by about $140.

Maybe the Navy can take out another aircraft carrier!!!

Folks, we are pawns and we are getting gamed...

[Boghie]

Sorry Tom for the kinda cuss word in line 3. I'll take my probation, but can I get some advice from BirchTree first:p?

Overspending for half a decade now Sequesters my family into the 15% bracket. That opens a lot of doors to me - especially since I have largely paid down my debt.
I think I can pretty much f'em. They will get close to NOTHING from me. Not now, and not in the future.
And, I think I can pretty much zero out the Sequester as far as my take home.
And, I will be a VERY rich retiree. Gotta love it.
With assets at ZERO tax

Enjoy:)

[Stoplight]

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/65945_268022706664248_586801433_n.jpg


HURL ALERT !!! :)

Here's another one that struck me yesterday, while watching the President speak...he kept going back and talking about jobs that will be lost on road and infrastructure construction contracts due to sequestration. BUT, the Highway Trust Fund is EXEMPT from sequestration !!! Yeah, there probably will be impacts, but more from the fact that the States are having trouble coming up with the "match" required to use the funds (without raising gas taxes !)

Update: Sequestration and Chicken Little: The Sky is Falling? - Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/sites/brighammccown/2013/02/28/sequestration-chicken-little-the-sky-is-falling/?ss=business:energy)

I was also annoyed how he kept saying the GOP was unreasonable, and we, the American People, elected him to pursue his course. Well, "we, the American People" ALSO elected those same unreasonable GOP members !!!

I'm sure getting tired of all the "spin", and fear-mongering going on...and the fact that the "Great Unwashed Public" just doesn't seem to care... I wish the politicians would just put on their "Big Boy" pants and do what needs to be done !!! Yeah, we'll ALL scream and holler, but we'll survive, I suspect...


Stoplight...

[James48843]

So.....it looks like I'll be making just about $842 less a month for the next six months.

That should cure things.

That's on top of my third year of pay freezes, no awards given, and upping the amount I have to pay into FERS retirement, despite the fact that FERS retirement account is fully funded and not facing any shortfall.

Thanks, members of Congress.

So....are you done screwing your employees yet?

22692

[konakathy]

FYI - an article I came across "How A Furlough May Affect Your TSP."

I sure hope for those who are getting the shaft with the stupid, careless and inept decisions of our government, that this furlough will be short lived.

Good Luck and God Bless.

How A Furlough May Affect Your TSP (http://www.myfederalretirement.com/public/1138.cfm)

[Kaufmanrider]

Here is a little something a rancher in East Texas has on his property. How appropriate.

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/45283_3917865386952_1682465047_n.jpg

[law87]

not to be negative but sometime I think dictatorship work better than the people at Washington...at least we know who to blame if things doesnt work out.

[OBGibby]

not to be negative but sometime I think dictatorship work better than the people at Washington...at least we know who to blame if things doesnt work out.

DING! DING! DING! We have a winner - worst post of the day!

[Sensei]

Being that I live on an overseas post and earn post allowance (civilian form of COLA), I could have another kid to offset the money I'll lose in furloughs.:rolleyes:

Seriously though, I'm thinking of reducing my TSP contribution to 5%, all into Roth while maintaining the max match. I might also stop DCAing into my Sharebuilder account and my kids' college savings. That's what happens when you lose 20% of your income I guess.

[James48843]

22703

[burrocrat]

i used to think boghie was a little loopy, always going on about 'structural' spending, but now i think i understand what he's been saying all along. the temporary 'stimulus' spending to the tune of an extra $1 trillion a year is now the new normal, it's built into the system. folks are used to us spending it, they count on it, feel entitled to it, you simply can't unplug a patient after you've provided life support for so long. unless you're broke.

so i think we are in for some bad news my fellow furlough friends. some of us complain 'this is not what i bargained for' i won't be buying a new car, i won't be able to build my future cash cushion so thick, i'll have to dip into savings but i can get through until october 1st. inconvenienced, but not destitute. we all know none of us will starve in the next 7 months. or visit the foodbank except maybe to volunteer on our day off. and the world will still turn, maybe not the way we want it to, but it will still turn.

the fallacy i think is expecting the spending to return to 'normal'. the cuts are now structural, just like that. maybe if we get a timely budget before the new fiscal year starts agencies could make a reasonable plan to do what they can with what they got and minimize some of the pain through prudent scaling back. but i wouldn't bet on it.

don't expect any sympathy from the inconvenienced public though, they pay our way, and they're worse off than we are. so this is what austerity looks like? not even, the pot is just starting to get hot. we just achieved, through revenue increases in january and now spending cuts in march, the 10 year budget savings everyone was so clamoring for. and not a single politican was responsible for it. it's all the other guy's fault. slick. david copperfield has nuthin' on these guys. we all just got baited and switched.

and still it is not enough. we've only managed to keep treading water, not make any headway. the elephant in the room that nobody talks about is the unsustainability of social security, medicare, and the whole raft of entitlements. either we double revenue or we halve benefits. there is no other long-term solution.

the thing i'm most worried about right now is if they cut my hours per week to less than 32 then they can apply for a waiver and eliminate my health care subsidy like mcdonalds did. wouldn't that be ironic if the gov can't even afford to buy its own healthcare plan.

[WorkFE]

not to be negative but sometime I think dictatorship work better than the people at Washington...at least we know who to blame if things doesnt work out.

L87,
In a Dictatorship the military and LE are all pro supporters of the Dictator. Blaming is illegal and dealt with severely.

[burrocrat]

22703

nothing personal jim, but if we end up in a life raft together someday you are shark bait. it's hard enough rowing towards shore without someone perched on the edge of the pontoon complaining all the time how poorly the rest of us work the oars. you remind me of why i got divorced.

[nnuut]

Continued inaction on the part of the POTUS will cause the Sequester to be worse than necessary.:cool:
The Sequester RevelationObama has the legal power to avoid spending-cut damage.Review & Outlook: The Sequester Revelation - WSJ.com (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323884304578328211144987052.html?m od=WSJ_Opinion_AboveLEFTTop)

[Khotso]

Continued inaction on the part of the POTUS will cause the Sequester to be worse than necessary.:cool:
The Sequester Revelation

Obama has the legal power to avoid spending-cut damage.

Review & Outlook: The Sequester Revelation - WSJ.com (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323884304578328211144987052.html?m od=WSJ_Opinion_AboveLEFTTop)

And continued hostage taking by the Tea/Republican Party House. Actually, I don't know what the POTUS can do in this circumstance -- oh, I guess he could surrender, capitulate, acquiesce to the fiscal terrorists -- or whatever you want to call it.

[WorkFE]

oh, I guess he could surrender, capitulate, acquiesce to the fiscal terrorists -- or whatever you want to call it.

Or the republicans could surrender, capitulate, acquiesce to the socialist agenda -- or whatever you want to call it. See how it works. You throw a stone they throw a stone they all retreat behind their agenda. Nothing gets done.

[clester]

Austerity in US begins.

It will be interesting to see the publics reaction. Especially those government workers that will be effected. This is different that previous threats of furloughs. I think this will stick. Agencies will eventually adjust down, cut services etc.

Will we have riots like in Greece? Doesn't seem like enough folks are feeling the pain yet for that.

How about some anecdotal evidence from folks out there. What are your collegues feeling?

[Boghie]

Taxes have already been raised on both the Top 1% and the rest of us.

Now, I want to see real spending cuts. Nothing has been cut yet. And, the cuts are being backroom dealed to cause the most outcry. You cannot tell me that a 4% cut to DoD spending in FY2013 maps to carriers being scuttled, every contractor heading off on the A-Train, and all us civilian slugs taking a 20% pay cut. Gross mismanagement could be the cause. Maybe the DoD big spenders elected to spend lots of mullah early in the year - and then play the Washington Monument game if they actually had to take spending cuts. A big enough outcry and the DoD DeadEnders could blissfully play their part in the annual $1T+ deficit!!!

Then again, we are spending almost half a Trillion on debt servicing...

Look at that Social Security disbursement...

This is called a cash flow crunch...

[Khotso]

Or the republicans could surrender, capitulate, acquiesce to the socialist agenda -- or whatever you want to call it. See how it works. You throw a stone they throw a stone they all retreat behind their agenda. Nothing gets done.

The point is:
(1) personal taxes are at an all time low as a result of 30+years of Republican sponsored trickle-down fiscal policy.
(2) Unemployment is at record highs outside the Great Depression.
(3) Working class wages have stagnated for 30+ years despite rising costs for virtually every necessity over that same time frame.
(4) At the same time, profits on Wall Street has exploded -- just look at the long term charts.
(5) America's overall wealth continues to get concentrated in the hands of fewer and fewer. In 2010, the top 1% held 42% of the nation's wealth, the top 5% held 72%, and the top 20% held 95%, the remaining 80% enjoy just 5% of the nation's overall wealth, and worse, the lowest 40% held only 0.3% -- and the upward concentration of wealth continues.
(6) Deficits are declining -- aside from year one, the annual federal deficit has declined significantly during the Obama administration -- and the TARP made up most of the deficit in the first year.
(7) Austerity hasn't worked to grow economies and create more, higher paying jobs in Japan and it isn't working in Europe. I'm not sure that it has worked anywhere ever -- but I haven't researched it.
(8) Defense spending is at the highest levels ever.
(9) Obama has offered to make changes in Medicare and Social Security much to the chagrin of his base.

Those are the facts.

So WHO is holding WHO hostage WorkFE ... and for what purpose? In my view, the far right ... and basically to disable the federal government. If you want chaos, do that. Let's see how well States get along when fiscal policy is made at the State level.

The current wealth distribution in America is not sustainable. Social unrest is one of the reasons we have an unprecedented number of "preppers" today. Too bad many of those folks have drunk the Reagan Kool-Aid and see the federal government as the problem as opposed to a vital player in obtaining a sustainable future at the national level.

In the end, things will work out. People are waking up. Ergo, the Rs grow increasingly desperate, taking increasingly desperate measures. But in a democracy, people are the government ... so the Rs will eventually change tack and chart a course that is more sustainable. It won't be capitulation or surrender on their part though, it will be survival -- just a matter of practicality really.

[Boghie]

Austerity in US begins.

It will be interesting to see the publics reaction. Especially those government workers that will be effected. This is different that previous threats of furloughs. I think this will stick. Agencies will eventually adjust down, cut services etc.

Will we have riots like in Greece? Doesn't seem like enough folks are feeling the pain yet for that.

How about some anecdotal evidence from folks out there. What are your collegues feeling?

Clester,

No riots will ensue. Our spending increased 30%+ in 2009. Do you feel the benefit of that spending as a taxpayer? I cannot even tell as a gubmint worker. Sure, we hired some fat bodies and a couple of good people, but really... Were any of us taxed 30% higher to cover the spending? Did the spending grow the tax base economy by 30%? Is it likely to? Why are we spending that Trillion annually? Just asking...

This time I think the general public will watch the frowny faces of the children as they are not allowed into the Washington Monument. Those children walked all the way from San Diego and Seattle to take the elevator ride to the top. And, the 2% cut in spending sends them back with nuthin'. Absolutely nuthin. Let me take another bite out of the Alpo can - get out of the way Burrocrat, I'll fight for this man. Kill:nuts:. But, the TV watcher will ask what pot holes have we filled? Why is our children so dum? Why can't I spell ether? No riots because they will let this thing shake out.

Too bad we didn't make the hard choices five years ago. As anyone with any fiscal and/or investment knowledge knows financial problems are much harder to solve without the benefit of time. Anyone watching the interest rates on our G Fund lately. Times running out...

[burrocrat]

Austerity in US begins.

It will be interesting to see the publics reaction. Especially those government workers that will be effected. This is different that previous threats of furloughs. I think this will stick. Agencies will eventually adjust down, cut services etc.

Will we have riots like in Greece? Doesn't seem like enough folks are feeling the pain yet for that.

How about some anecdotal evidence from folks out there. What are your collegues feeling?

for the most part my colleagues are taking it in stride, planning what to do on their days off, which three day weekends would be best to take a furlough before or after, how to trim the entertainment budget and bring leftovers, etc.

hardworking folks will just tighten up a bit and find a way to keep on going because that's what hardworking folks do. i don't think we'll start to see the riots until the people who aren't working get their takehome cut.

[nnuut]

And continued hostage taking by the Tea/Republican Party House. Actually, I don't know what the POTUS can do in this circumstance -- oh, I guess he could surrender, capitulate, acquiesce to the fiscal terrorists -- or whatever you want to call it.
He could have changed where the cuts came from, cut waste, cut useless duplicated programs, consolidate government, but NO he just wanted to make the Republicans bad. I think now he will save the day and do exactly what the other side wanted, YES we will fix this calamity generated by the right. CROOKS, LIERS!

[Boghie]

Khotso...

Personal Income tax revenues for FY2012 were $1.132 Trillion
The FY2012 deficit was $1.089 Trillion

We have to increase everyone's income taxes by 100% to balance the budget.

But, we are spending $800 Billion more than FY2007. That is $500 Billion more inflation adjusted.
And, we our revenue is still $120 Billion less, but growing.

Why are we spending a half Trillion more than we did five years ago (inflation adjusted)? Why can't we have productivity gains to compensate for 2% inflation? Do you feel that we are getting anything for annual spending 18% higher after inflation? What do you think the general public thinks about a 20% pure spending increase? Do you think they will believe that every spending increase is sacred?

[Boghie]

He could have changed where the cuts came from, cut waste, cut useless duplicated programs, consolidate government, but NO he just wanted to make the Republicans bad. I think now he will save the day and do exactly what the other side wanted, YES we will fix this calamity generated by the right. CROOKS, LIERS!

NNuut,

That game might be over. Look at the fact that we are now spending $440 Billion on interest payments. Too late to promise cutting waste and stuff. Look at Frixxxx's thread on the 'G Fund' interest rates. Goin' up, baby, goin up!!! When even Social Security demands higher interest rates than we only have a little time before everyone does. And, then the Fed will be swamped. The fun is just starting...

[burrocrat]

let's not forget who signed the order to begin sequestration on march 1st. if it goes bad of course we all know who's fault it is. but in a few months when things worked out ok i bet i know who will be first in line to take credit for it.

let's not be so hard on the politicians. they couldn't stop it and really had no choice. he who has the gold makes the rules, and we are in debt to our eyeballs so they're just along for the ride like the rest of us.

[WorkFE]

My reply did its intended job. Identified another individual who loves compromise as long as you agree with them. Thanks

[OBGibby]

22703

Complete and utter BS. Just more typical class warfare nonsense by Barry and his ilk and the union mouthpieces of the Democratic Party.

The Democrats have had ample opportunity to come to the table and work in an honest fashion toward compromise with the GOP. Yet, time and again the Democrats have pushed for tax increases, increased spending now, and the promise of spending cuts down the road. And each time the Democrats never upheld their end of the bargain to reduce spending.

If they can't do it, the Republicans will.

[Boghie]

Back to Furlough - and not political - talk...

Remember folks... You might be dropped a tax bracket. the end result is that you overpaid for eight pay periods and you cannot be easily ratio'd (via a simple calculator) to pay 80% of your current Federal and State tax since you are in a lower tax bracket. If the furlough lasts the remainder of the year my family income never touches the 25% bracket - especially if I keep my 401(k) contributions up. That seems to wipe out another $40/pay-period off the 80% ratio of Federal taxes. I can expect another $10 in savings from State as well. And, any of you giving the Gubmint an interest free loan (those of you getting large tax refunds) can math that out and take it out of your Federal and State taxes.

What you pay in taxes can be managed to some extent. Right now the easily categorized taxes consume more of my income than any other expense I have - by far. That makes them something to look at. Not going to jail by doing the "American Greed" thang on taxes, but now am going to manage them.

Also, if you end up (after managing your taxes) in the 15% bracket - and you still have cash flow - look at funding a Roth (whether Roth TSP or Roth IRA). It is very likely that you were worth the money they paid you pre-Sequestration so this cut will be a blip. Maybe the politicians can manage the cuts better, maybe the agencies can manage the cuts better, maybe revenue will increase, whatever... Maybe you will quit the Gubmint and get a full pay job in the private sector, whatever... Regardless, think of this as an opportunity to invest in a Roth account at the 15% tax level. It could very well be the only time you can. The benefits of Roth investing rapidly decline at the 25% level onward...

[Khotso]

My reply did its intended job. Identified another individual who loves compromise as long as you agree with them. Thanks

As did mine. You guys got nothing, other than blame and name calling. :cool:

But as Boghie said, back to what this thread is supposed to be about -- furlough.

[RealMoneyIssues]

Honest question for those affected by the furlough and saying it will be a 20% pay cut.

Here is my math:

22 furlough days without pay out of 260 paid work days (52 x 5, assuming you get paid for holidays - salary right?)

(260-22)/260 * 100 = 91.5% or an 8.5% cut, not 20%

What am I missing?

Also, lower pay means lower taxes (maybe due to a bracket shift down too) which means the net cut may be less than 8.5%

Thanks for helping!!

[Boghie]

Honest question for those affected by the furlough and saying it will be a 20% pay cut.

Here is my math:

22 furlough days without pay out of 260 paid work days (52 x 5, assuming you get paid for holidays - salary right?)

(260-22)/260 * 100 = 91.5% or an 8.5% cut, not 20%

What am I missing?

Also, lower pay means lower taxes (maybe due to a bracket shift down too) which means the net cut may be less than 8.5%

Thanks for helping!!

RMI...

Things that will make the furlough less than a 20% cut:

Changes in your Tax Bracket (Federal and State)
Your Social Security contribution, actually a tax now
401(k) contributions - if you keep the same percentage
Your FERS pension contribution, the Alpo Meal Deal baseline
Your Life Insurance benefits - I think. I think they are a percentage



Things that will make your furlough greater than a 20% cut:

Your medical insurance
Your CFC charitable contribution
Your Flexible Savings Account contribution
Any TSP loans or loan allotments that cannot adjust
Your TSP contribution if you elected a specific amount contribution


This is going to be very hard to work out. And, if you blow the tax stuff you can be fined for underpayment and get stuck with a large expense on April 15th. On that topic, taxes for CY2013 are going to be extremely complicated and extremely variant. This is going to be a very stupid year.

[RealMoneyIssues]

RMI...

Things that will make the furlough less than a 20% cut:

Changes in your Tax Bracket (Federal and State)
Your Social Security contribution, actually a tax now
401(k) contributions - if you keep the same percentage
Your FERS pension contribution, the Alpo Meal Deal baseline
Your Life Insurance benefits - I think. I think they are a percentage



Things that will make your furlough greater than a 20% cut:

Your medical insurance
Your CFC charitable contribution
Your Flexible Savings Account contribution
Any TSP loans or loan allotments that cannot adjust
Your TSP contribution if you elected a specific amount contribution


This is going to be very hard to work out. And, if you blow the tax stuff you can be fined for underpayment and get stuck with a large expense on April 15th. On that topic, taxes for CY2013 are going to be extremely complicated and extremely variant. This is going to be a very stupid year.

I understand your lists, but assuming you make no other changes (trying to be apples to apples), then how is the furlough a 20% cut in pay?

[law87]

DING! DING! DING! We have a winner - worst post of the day!


Not that i care for your comments, but my reason for what I said is because things are not being done @ washington, there are too many peoples that are in it because they think their right, in the end nothing agree. Prime example spending cuts then people turn around and blame Obama for something he's not fully in control of.

[burrocrat]

all this planning and manuevering trying to avoid the taxman and stay ahead of our creditors is hard work and making my head hurt. my whole life i've never got ahead, whether i make 25 or 50, it's always not quite enough. i'm tired of these fiscal treadmill games. it's all just consume consume consume but never fulfilled.

i think i'm going to step off the ride for a bit. give away all my worldly possessions. devote my time to a life of pious frugality. spend my days inside a cloister of nuns or something. not all at once, that would be selfish. just one at a time for me please.

[Boghie]

I understand your lists, but assuming you make no other changes (trying to be apples to apples), then how is the furlough a 20% cut in pay?

RMI...

If the cut was budgeted for the full year it would be the 9% cut. But, because many of the agencies continued spending as if it wasn't going to happen over the first half of the year then the cuts are to be budgeted over six months rather than twelve.

There are some of us who will see no sequester. Why? Because their agencies budgeted the sequester from the initiation of their fiscal year onward. Also, I think you will find that those agencies are better run, have fewer people, and didn't hire as much fat during the 'Time of the Credit Card' as the rest.

My guess is that those of us facing a sequester are in agencies who have no real budget process, really haven't automated their processes, and had poor leadership who hired lots of fat during the Sizzlin' Times. Another major reason for the Sequester Hollering is that these agencies do not want to accept the budget cuts coming their way. Normal full throated gubmint hollering. Sing 'Every Penny is Sacred' to Monty Python's 'Every Sperm is Sacred' and you get the idea.

Finally, just watch Social Security and Medicare spending. They are no longer funding the sizzle. They want their chunk of fat now. And, our politicians have be spending their borrowed money on groceries and vacations. Our tax base is nearly triple that of 1980 - but, bro, we ain't got a dime. The return on those investments has been consumed by day to day spending; leaving nuthin for the bond holders (Social Security). Soon enough we will have an episode on "American Greed" all about it...

[OBGibby]

Not that i care for your comments, but my reason for what I said is because things are not being done @ washington, there are too many peoples that are in it because they think their right, in the end nothing agree. Prime example spending cuts then people turn around and blame Obama for something he's not fully in control of.

Words have meaning, and words in the past have led to awful consequences for our fellow man. To be charitable, I suspect your emotion and quickness on the keyboard created an unfortunate quote where you took comfort in the notion of dictatorship - a concept completely at odds with the country you have sworn to defend.

A repudiation of your comment would have been warranted by you, but alas, you seem to completely miss the offensiveness of your original comment.

[Boghie]

Words have meaning, and words in the past have led to awful consequences for our fellow man. To be charitable, I suspect your emotion and quickness on the keyboard created an unfortunate quote where you took comfort in the notion of dictatorship - a concept completely at odds with the country you have sworn to defend.

A repudiation of your comment would have been warranted by you, but alas, you seem to completely miss the offensiveness of your original comment.

By the way, every dictatorship I can think of has gone through this kind of fiscal mess when the music stops. It obviously is not limited to pure dictatorships - but it does appear to be related to statist entities that have too much control over their peons.

[RealMoneyIssues]

RMI...

If the cut was budgeted for the full year it would be the 9% cut. But, because many of the agencies continued spending as if it wasn't going to happen over the first half of the year then the cuts are to be budgeted over six months rather than twelve.

There are some of us who will see no sequester. Why? Because their agencies budgeted the sequester from the initiation of their fiscal year onward. Also, I think you will find that those agencies are better run, have fewer people, and didn't hire as much fat during the 'Time of the Credit Card' as the rest.

My guess is that those of us facing a sequester are in agencies who have no real budget process, really haven't automated their processes, and had poor leadership who hired lots of fat during the Sizzlin' Times. Another major reason for the Sequester Hollering is that these agencies do not want to accept the budget cuts coming their way. Normal full throated gubmint hollering. Sing 'Every Penny is Sacred' to Monty Python's 'Every Sperm is Sacred' and you get the idea.

Finally, just watch Social Security and Medicare spending. They are no longer funding the sizzle. They want their chunk of fat now. And, our politicians have be spending their borrowed money on groceries and vacations. Our tax base is nearly triple that of 1980 - but, bro, we ain't got a dime. The return on those investments has been consumed by day to day spending; leaving nuthin for the bond holders (Social Security). Soon enough we will have an episode on "American Greed" all about it...

All good points, but how does that make a 22 day furlough go from a 8.5% pay cut to a 20% pay cut?

Next year, if they continue this idiocy, then it would be one day every pay period for the whole year. THAT would be a 20% pay cut.

[Kaufmanrider]

Here is how I see this stage playing out.

Rep's give in to some changes in tax laws/loopholes. Not really a tax increase? And the Pres and Dem's give in on how much we contribute to FER's and the chained CPI for Social Security.

Then come Oct 1, with the new budget, or lack there of, we do it all over again.

Damn, I can't wait for Jan 11, 2014.

[Boghie]

RMI:


Here is my math:

22 furlough days without pay out of 260 paid work days (52 x 5, assuming you get paid for holidays - salary right?)

(260-22)/260 * 100 = 91.5% or an 8.5% cut, not 20%

What am I missing?

Also, lower pay means lower taxes (maybe due to a bracket shift down too) which means the net cut may be less than 8.5%

Thanks for helping!!

Here is the skinny...

The Sequestration was intended to be a FY2013 and onward mandated spending cut. The Dolts in Congress and the Administration - and our Dolts in charge of our Agencies - couldn't stomach the 10% cut across the board that should have taken place for FY2013 spending. Then again, they seem too embarrassed to even sign off on a budget (for the last half decade or so) so out of whack that maybe they didn't want to publicize their fiasco. Regardless, we were supposed to take our draconian cuts starting October 1, 2012.

But, our ancient regime of failed lawyers who have never ran a business or budgeted anything got scared of a draconian cut of 10% so they dithered. They dithered in Fiscal Cliff I and Fiscal Cliff II. And, they dithered again in January. They kicked the can halfway down the field. Congress thought they might get some fiscal restraint and the President thought he could just badger Congress by sinking aircraft carriers and letting disease run rampant like 'The Stand'. So, after dealing with this Administration, Congress figures the only way to enforce a little restraint on the credit card purchases is to just allow the dumb bunny cuts. Best they can do. And, it sure doesn't feel like the American public is getting all lathered up about it either. Going to happen.

But, because our dithering CongressCritters and President could not decide on smarter cuts and because they couldn't initiate the dumb bunny cuts in a timely fashion, the cuts will take place in full in half the time. Thus, it is your math that is failing:

We are not talking about 52 weeks x 5 days = 260 days.
We are talking: 26 weeks x 5 days = 130 days
And actually: 22 weeks x 5 days = 110 days (because the unions forced the agencies to give 30 days notice)

So here goes...

(110-22)/110 * 100 = 80.0% or an 20% cut

There it is...

And, if the dumb @ssess in Congress or the Administration or the Agencies or the Unions further delay the cuts than our salaries will be cut harder when they come.

Winter is coming

[RealMoneyIssues]

Excellent post and thank you for clarifying the 20% cut in pay information I was seeing.

It is a 20% cut for the rest of the year, but in the end, it will be an 8.5% pay cut for the year.

I am not trying to minimize the pain civilians will feel for the rest of the year due to the absolute stupidity of Congress and the President. I am sorry that this is happening to yall.

I have suggested that there are plenty of military people on shore duty (very similar to civilian work) that could be furloughed too and save some money... that would also spread the pain.

I truly believe that the furlough is being used as a political tool since I know there are more efficient ways to save money in all departments, but I am just a krill in a sea of blue whales...

[burrocrat]

RMI:



Here is the skinny...

The Sequestration was intended to be a FY2013 and onward mandated spending cut. The Dolts in Congress and the Administration - and our Dolts in charge of our Agencies - couldn't stomach the 10% cut across the board that should have taken place for FY2013 spending. Then again, they seem too embarrassed to even sign off on a budget (for the last half decade or so) so out of whack that maybe they didn't want to publicize their fiasco. Regardless, we were supposed to take our draconian cuts starting October 1, 2012.

But, our ancient regime of failed lawyers who have never ran a business or budgeted anything got scared of a draconian cut of 10% so they dithered. They dithered in Fiscal Cliff I and Fiscal Cliff II. And, they dithered again in January. They kicked the can halfway down the field. Congress thought they might get some fiscal restraint and the President thought he could just badger Congress by sinking aircraft carriers and letting disease run rampant like 'The Stand'. So, after dealing with this Administration, Congress figures the only way to enforce a little restraint on the credit card purchases is to just allow the dumb bunny cuts. Best they can do. And, it sure doesn't feel like the American public is getting all lathered up about it either. Going to happen.

But, because our dithering CongressCritters and President could not decide on smarter cuts and because they couldn't initiate the dumb bunny cuts in a timely fashion, the cuts will take place in full in half the time. Thus, it is your math that is failing:

We are not talking about 52 weeks x 5 days = 260 days.
We are talking: 26 weeks x 5 days = 130 days
And actually: 22 weeks x 5 days = 110 days (because the unions forced the agencies to give 30 days notice)

So here goes...

(110-22)/110 * 100 = 80.0% or an 20% cut

There it is...

And, if the dumb @ssess in Congress or the Administration or the Agencies or the Unions further delay the cuts than our salaries will be cut harder when they come.

Winter is coming

+1 the stand, you're on it right there.

'that wasn't any act of god, that was an act of pure human fu*kery'.

[OBGibby]

"f the Senate had followed the law and produced normal-order budgets, we
wouldn't have the sequestration at all. The budget resolutions of both chambers
would have gone to conference committee, which would have hashed out the
differences. Obama would have signed the budgets, and we would have avoided
nearly four years of crisis funding for the federal government. Reid and Obama
haven't used normal order because they want to keep using continuing resolutions
as a means to keep the inflated FY2010 spending levels as the baseline going
forward, and especially because they want to keep House Republicans from having
a real voice on spending and budgeting." --[I]blogger Ed Morrissey

[OBGibby]

.....Winter is coming

"Sometimes the only thing that keeps me from being pessimistic is knowing that
the when the country collapses, the people most responsible will die out in the
first winter." --humorist Frank Fleming

[Boghie]

"f the Senate had followed the law and produced normal-order budgets, we
wouldn't have the sequestration at all. The budget resolutions of both chambers
would have gone to conference committee, which would have hashed out the
differences. Obama would have signed the budgets, and we would have avoided
nearly four years of crisis funding for the federal government. Reid and Obama
haven't used normal order because they want to keep using continuing resolutions
as a means to keep the inflated FY2010 spending levels as the baseline going
forward, and especially because they want to keep House Republicans from having
a real voice on spending and budgeting." --[I]blogger Ed Morrissey

Sometimes you have to laugh...

Anyway, you know what is funny about Morrissey's correct statement... It was a great plan - for a while. The big spenders could rack up the debt without the embarrassment of writing it down and voting on it. I mean, could you go to your banker with spending exceeding revenue by 40%. The banker would probably call your outstanding loans in. Could you see Senator Reid trying to justify year after year of deficits with the word 'Trillion' following them. I want to see the President's speech using the 'T' word. Basically, the spenders didn't want to discuss the 'T'urd in the living room.

But now - yuk, yuk...

All that bloat built into 'the system' wants more mullah and wants that mullah inflation and population adjusted. And, that don't happen with Continuing Resolutions. So, they spent to their last dime; built a lot of useless structure and bureaucracies and fed the middle class with free bread and big circuses. Now all this fat has a funding line and the bureaucrats are screaming for da'cash.

No money bro, no money...

I can't really see the GenXers digging deep to pay for this. Can you???

[WorkFE]

And, if the dumb @ssess in Congress or the Administration or the Agencies or the Unions further delay the cuts than our salaries will be cut harder when they come.

Nicely done.

[k0nkuzh0n]

It is a 20% cut for the rest of the year, but in the end, it will be an 8.5% pay cut for the year.



Correction; rest of the FISCAL year. No one is really talking about it, but if you believe that the furloughs will last all 22 weeks... why would you believe it will stop at the end of this fiscal year? We COULD be furloughed 22 days (or more? ) every year for the next 10 (or more?) years...

BIG CORRECTION (For several people): There is no such thing as 'tax bracket drop'. You don't really move from tax brackets to tax brackets. That terminology is for people that don't understand how income taxes are calculated. You only expand into/retract from tax brackets.

***** INCOME TAX IS CALCULATED MARGINALLY *****

If you don't know what that means, you likely won't understand from a single post but basically:
For 2013, the 25% bracket starts at 36,251
Person A that has a taxable income of $36,250, Person B a taxable income of $36,251...
They both pay the SAME amount of taxes.
10% on their first 8,925 (which is $893),
and 15% on the next $27,325 (15% bracket upper limit, $36,250 minus $8,925) which is 4099.
Then Person B pays 25% income tax on $1... which is 25 cents.

So they both pay $4992 in income tax. Big difference than taking Person A and doing 36250 * 15% = 5438 and Person B doing 36251 * 25% = 9062.75

[burrocrat]

you're right, both still pay $4992, and both still think it's too much for what they and everybody else gets in return.

so now what to do? raise taxes more or spend less? i think that should be left up to those actually paying taxes, not those deciding how much to spend. who begs to differ? and on what ground do you stand?

[Birchtree]

I'll vote for the chump that gives me the biggest earned income tax credit - I don't like to work but I do vote.

[RealMoneyIssues]

I'll vote for the chump that gives me the biggest earned income tax credit - I don't like to work but I do vote.

Wow, never would have thought you would have voted for him, but I guess since you like QE it makes sense... ;)

[k0nkuzh0n]

you're right, both still pay $4992, and both still think it's too much for what they and everybody else gets in return.

so now what to do? raise taxes more or spend less? i think that should be left up to those actually paying taxes, not those deciding how much to spend. who begs to differ? and on what ground do you stand?

I mentioned it as it relates to Furloughs because people were talking about possible 'dropping tax brackets'. And while you will pay less taxes, its not nearly as drastic as people were implying.

I mean its like trying to make the argument, which I've heard several times before, that a reason for not paying off a student loan is because the interest is tax deductible. Why pay thousands in interest and get hundreds back when you could pay $0 and get $0 back?? Not having the expense is always better than having a deductible expense (all else equal)

[Kaufmanrider]

Correction; rest of the FISCAL year. No one is really talking about it, but if you believe that the furloughs will last all 22 weeks... why would you believe it will stop at the end of this fiscal year? We COULD be furloughed 22 days (or more? ) every year for the next 10 (or more?) years...

How true. I happened to meet a few California state employees. They have been having furlough days for the past few years
Granted only three to five. I guess the good is they get COLA's.

[PLANO]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KsFalAqhen4

[rktect1]

This is a trainwreck of a thread that i hope to have time to read later today.

i hope everybody here voted.

we are all to blame for this crapola we are in and will be in for years to come.

[Weather]

I'm in the DoD, Air Force. Just received an email -- we'll be furloughed 1 day/wk starting 1 May.

[Scout333]

FYI,
Furlough information from OPM

Furlough Guidance (http://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/furlough-guidance/#url=Administrative-Furlough)

[James48843]

Furlough advice about what do regarding your TSP, from the TSP:






If you have been furloughed as a result of sequestration, you may be wondering how to deal with the financial impact. This fact sheet addresses some of the questions you may have about your TSP contributions. It also details alternatives for accessing your TSP funds should you face financial hardship as a result of being furloughed.

How will a furlough affect my TSP contributions?


As you know, your TSP employee contributions are deducted from your pay. If you are currently makingcontributions based on a percentage of your basic pay,here’s what happens: If you earn $1,000 of basic payevery two-week pay period and you contribute 10% of it to the TSP, you’d have a $100 TSP contribution everypay period. If you are furloughed for 2 days per pay period, then your basic pay would decrease to $800 and, as a result, your TSP contribution would decrease by an equal percentage so that your contribution would be $80 per pay period. Simply stated, your TSP contribution decreases in direct proportion to the reduction inyour basic pay. Therefore, you may find that lowering your contribution percentage is notnecessary. sary.

More-- in a newly released TSP Furlough fact sheet :
https://www.tsp.gov/PDF/formspubs/oc13-7.pdf

[Frixxxx]

I'm in the DoD, Air Force. Just received an email -- we'll be furloughed 1 day/wk starting 1 May.

Did they say which day? I'm hearing some have a choice. So just asking.

[Buster]

What the FAA might have to bear..

DOT spending for FY 2012 = $84.6B
DOT estimated sequest. cuts = $1.6B
percent cuts = 1.9%

FAA spending for FY 2012 = $16B
FAA estimated sequest. cuts = $.6B
Percent cuts = 4%

Questions comes to mind

Why does the FAA have to be cut by double the percentage of the Parent Agency?
Why does FAA, with only 19% of the total DOT budget have to absorb 37.5% of the total DOT cut?



Reference: DOT financial report http://www.dot.gov/sites/dot.dev/files/docs/fy-2012-agency-financial-report.pdf

[nnuut]

What the FAA might have to bear..

DOT spending for FY 2012 = $84.6B
DOT estimated sequest. cuts = $1.6B
percent cuts = 1.9%

FAA spending for FY 2012 = $16B
FAA estimated sequest. cuts = $.6B
Percent cuts = 4%

Questions comes to mind

Why does the FAA have to be cut by double the percentage of the Parent Agency?
Why does FAA, with only 19% of the total DOT budget have to absorb 37.5% of the total DOT cut?



Reference: DOT financial report http://www.dot.gov/sites/dot.dev/files/docs/fy-2012-agency-financial-report.pdf
Because it makes the Castration look worse, simple!:nuts:

[nnuut]

Sequester spin: Obama’s false claim of Capitol janitors receiving ‘a pay cut’Posted by Glenn Kessler (http://www.tsptalk.com/glenn-kessler/2011/03/02/ABzNymP_page.html)at 03:27 PM ET, 03/01/2013
Sequester spin: Obama’s incorrect claim of Capitol janitors receiving ‘a pay cut’ - The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/sequester-spin-obamas-incorrect-claim-of-capitol-janitors-receiving-a-pay-cut/2013/03/01/3407535c-82a9-11e2-b99e-6baf4ebe42df_blog.html)

[Weather]

Did they say which day? I'm hearing some have a choice. So just asking.

We work a compressed work schedule: 8 days @ 9 hours (72 hours) and 1 day at 8 hours (8 hours); per pay period (72+8=80).

They plan on reducing it to 8 days at 8 hours (64 hours).

[burrocrat]

I mentioned it as it relates to Furloughs because people were talking about possible 'dropping tax brackets'. And while you will pay less taxes, its not nearly as drastic as people were implying.

I mean its like trying to make the argument, which I've heard several times before, that a reason for not paying off a student loan is because the interest is tax deductible. Why pay thousands in interest and get hundreds back when you could pay $0 and get $0 back?? Not having the expense is always better than having a deductible expense (all else equal)

one possible scenario when it may be better to carry the expense as it relates to student loans:

let's say i have $40k in student loan debt financed at a fixed 2.5% (i do). my tax docs say i paid ~$875 in interest last year and the deduction results in ~$300 reduced tax liability (it does). if i had an extra $40k kicking around (i don't) would i be better off paying the loan and getting clear or carrying the debt?

1) it saves me $300 in taxes.
2) if i can take the $40k and earn more than 2.5% investing the principal (some years -5% and some years +16% average +8%) then i've beat the spread and pocket on average +5% every year.
3) if i am a gov employee (i am) i can sign up for the income based repayment plan. that means your loan payment is calculated as a function of gross salary and family size compared to poverty level until you earn enough to make the standard payment on a ten year amortization. and after ten years of timely repayment any remaining balance is 'forgiven'. this is meant to provide incentive for educated young folks to chose a career in government. in reality, only the first few years does your monthly payment shake out to ~$150-$200 per month. by year 4, if you have any kind of skills drive and desire , then you are paying the standard payment of ~$375 per month. but after 7 years of that you may end up paying $16k less due to reduced payments early in the cycle and the magic of compound interest. if the gov keeps its promise and 'forgives' you.

all else being equal, it is better for a young gov employee to not payoff that student loan debt? yes. is that a benefit? yes. is that an entitlement? maybe, but first you have put yourself on the hook for the payback and succesfully apply your talents at college, and then productively apply your skills at work, and then trust the gov to later make good on the promise, so maybe not.

me? i'm a gambler and always believe i can beat a 2.5% spread so it's a no brainer. but i didn't learn that in school.

[James48843]

From my Union-

[quote]

http://www.newsmgr.com/pass.jpg




FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Contact: Kori Blalock Keller (202) 293-7277
March 1, 2013
FEDERAL-POSTAL COALITION STATEMENT REGARDING SEQUESTRATION
WASHINGTON, DC - In response to the sequestration policy taking effect today, the Federal-Postal Coalition, released the following statement:
"America's federal and postal workers constitute the greatest workforce in the world. Together, they defend our country, protect the food we eat, the airplanes we board, the packages we send, and the national parks we enjoy. They possess the talent and dedication to achieve millions of feats for America each day -- unless our elected officials obstruct them.

"Sequestration and furloughs are only the beginning of a flood of uncertainty looming before our nation's federal workers. In less than four weeks, Congress and the President will face another deadline for funding the entire government. If our politicians fail to work together to arrive at sensible solutions, we risk a total government shutdown. It is personally and professionally a struggle for federal workers to do their best work when their jobs are more uncertain with each passing day.

"Our nation's federal workers want to serve every community in America, but first Congress and the White House must lead before it's too late."
#

The Federal-Postal Coalition is an alliance of 30 management, professional and union organizations representing five million federal and postal employees and retirees:

American Federation of Government Employees
American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees
American Foreign Service Association
American Postal Workers Union
FAA Managers Association
Federal Managers Association
Federally Employed Women
International Association of Fire Fighters
International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
International Federation of Professional & Technical Engineers
Laborers' International Union of North America
National Active and Retired Federal Employees Association
National Air Traffic Controllers Association
National Association of Assistant United States Attorneys
National Association of Federal Veterinarians
National Association of Government Employees
National Association of Letter Carriers
National Association of Postal Supervisors
National Association of Postmasters of the United States
National Council of Social Security Management Associations
National Federation of Federal Employees
National League of Postmasters
National Postal Mail Handlers Union
National Rural Letter Carriers' Association
National Treasury Employees Union
National Weather Service Employees Organization
Organization of Professional Employees at the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture
Patent Office Professional Association
Professional Aviation Safety Specialists
Professional Managers Association
Senior Executives Association

[Birchtree]

"Blame it on the Bossanova" I have no empathy for unions - they paid for their leadership in Washington.