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Thread: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

  1. #13

    Join Date
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    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    Quote Originally Posted by emily View Post
    I just retired the end of December, transferred a portion out of the TSP in mid February, and started monthly payments at the same time. When I went to look at my PIP it said "Your PIP could not be calculated because your monthly account balances for the entire year were unavailable." Any ideas why it would show this?
    It is probably the 1 time rollover in your situation would be an exception to what they normally deal with, which the system probably isn't programmed to deal with. Since you just took the withdrawal last month, I would be interested to know if they will fix that in future months or how long that will apply since I'm planning to do something similar.

    Based on RazorCat's comment, I'm not sure how they factor monthly withdrawals in calculating your PIP, whether withdrawals would be considered a loss or if it would lower your PIP similar to Mr.Snrub's situation (excluding loan repayments along with the associated earnings from the PIP) or if it really matters.

    You can always look at your activity summary in your online account and use the data to calculate it yourself.

    P.S. You may want to save Mr.Snrub's spreadsheet/calculations below or get them once finalized.

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  3. #14

    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    Thanks evilanne, I'll try to keep you updated if things change.

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  5. #15

    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    Quote Originally Posted by evilanne View Post
    Based on RazorCat's comment, I'm not sure how they factor monthly withdrawals in calculating your PIP, whether withdrawals would be considered a loss or if it would lower your PIP similar to Mr.Snrub's situation (excluding loan repayments along with the associated earnings from the PIP) or if it really matters.
    From what I have seen when I took out a TSP loan, the withdrawal did not have a negative impact on my reported PIP. The dollar amount taken out for the loan came from my employee traditional contributions. The confusion on how the PIP is actually calculated was the main reason why I track withdrawals and loan repayments made separately in my spreadsheet.

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  7. #16

    Join Date
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    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    I watched my PIP closely in June as to what might affect it. My PIP for May was 20.42%. I was in G for all but 2 days in June. Sold and went to G on an up day, bought back in at the end of June on a down day, so didn't lose any money on my trades.
    My PIP was 19.73% for June after being up (slightly) all month sitting in G. The only transactions I had was a $250.00 monthly withdrawal (and I suppose the administrative costs).
    So, if withdrawals aren't being calculated as a loss as part of the monthly PIP I don't know what made my percentage drop.
    Hey, no complaints. Been a good year so far.

  8.  
  9. #17

    Join Date
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    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    It depends on what your return in June in 2016 was. If you made 4% in june of 2016 and 3% in June of 2017, your PIP is gonna drop 1%. It's IMPOSSIBLE to keep one's PIP increasing every month.

    Quote Originally Posted by RazorCat View Post
    I watched my PIP closely in June as to what might affect it. My PIP for May was 20.42%. I was in G for all but 2 days in June. Sold and went to G on an up day, bought back in at the end of June on a down day, so didn't lose any money on my trades.
    My PIP was 19.73% for June after being up (slightly) all month sitting in G. The only transactions I had was a $250.00 monthly withdrawal (and I suppose the administrative costs).
    So, if withdrawals aren't being calculated as a loss as part of the monthly PIP I don't know what made my percentage drop.
    Hey, no complaints. Been a good year so far.

  10.  
  11. #18

    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Intrepid_Timer View Post
    It depends on what your return in June in 2016 was. If you made 4% in june of 2016 and 3% in June of 2017, your PIP is gonna drop 1%. It's IMPOSSIBLE to keep one's PIP increasing every month.
    Try tsp.gov for PIP info.

    PERSONAL INVESTMENT PERFORMANCE

    Q16. What is “Your YYYY Personal Investment Performance”?
    The Personal Investment Performance (PIP) number is a combined rate of return earned on all of the funds you held in your TSP account during the year covered by the annual statement. Your personal performance is based on the performance of your investments and on the timing and amount of your purchases (e.g., contributions) and redemptions (e.g., loans and withdrawals) as well as the effect of any interfund transfers. Therefore, your personal performance may differ substantially from the performance of the investments themselves.
    Q17. How does the TSP calculate Personal Investment Performance?
    The TSP uses the Modified Dietz method to calculate Personal Investment Performance. The Modified Dietz method weights individual cash flows by the amount of time that those cash flows are held in the portfolio. This method of calculation is widely used by financial analysts and investment managers to measure the time-weighted returns of investment portfolios.
    Q18. All of my money was in one fund during the year covered by the annual statement. Why is my Personal Investment Performance different from the rate of return of that fund?
    The Modified Dietz method of calculation is sensitive to large cash flows (e.g., loans, withdrawals, rollovers, or even contributions if the account balance is relatively small) and to volatility in the markets.
    If you were invested in one fund, and only one fund, during the statement year, cash flows into or out of that fund could cause the PIP rate of return on your statement to be slightly different from the fund’s rate of return.
    Q19. Why doesn’t my annual participant statement show a Personal Investment Performance number?
    If your TSP balance was $0 on the first or last business day of any month during the calendar year, an annual rate of return was not calculated, thus the Personal Investment Performance will not display on your statement. This particularly affects new and rehired participants.


    How's your math skills? Ha!


  12.  
  13. #19

    Join Date
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    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    I've read all that before. Doesn't change anything about my statement?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scout333 View Post
    Try tsp.gov for PIP info.

    PERSONAL INVESTMENT PERFORMANCE

    Q16. What is “Your YYYY Personal Investment Performance”?
    The Personal Investment Performance (PIP) number is a combined rate of return earned on all of the funds you held in your TSP account during the year covered by the annual statement. Your personal performance is based on the performance of your investments and on the timing and amount of your purchases (e.g., contributions) and redemptions (e.g., loans and withdrawals) as well as the effect of any interfund transfers. Therefore, your personal performance may differ substantially from the performance of the investments themselves.
    Q17. How does the TSP calculate Personal Investment Performance?
    The TSP uses the Modified Dietz method to calculate Personal Investment Performance. The Modified Dietz method weights individual cash flows by the amount of time that those cash flows are held in the portfolio. This method of calculation is widely used by financial analysts and investment managers to measure the time-weighted returns of investment portfolios.
    Q18. All of my money was in one fund during the year covered by the annual statement. Why is my Personal Investment Performance different from the rate of return of that fund?
    The Modified Dietz method of calculation is sensitive to large cash flows (e.g., loans, withdrawals, rollovers, or even contributions if the account balance is relatively small) and to volatility in the markets.
    If you were invested in one fund, and only one fund, during the statement year, cash flows into or out of that fund could cause the PIP rate of return on your statement to be slightly different from the fund’s rate of return.
    Q19. Why doesn’t my annual participant statement show a Personal Investment Performance number?
    If your TSP balance was $0 on the first or last business day of any month during the calendar year, an annual rate of return was not calculated, thus the Personal Investment Performance will not display on your statement. This particularly affects new and rehired participants.


    How's your math skills? Ha!

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  15. #20

    Default Re: What exactly is Personal Investment Performance (PIP) and how do I calculate it?

    IT this was for those who are not familiar with how PIP is computed. Not disputing your comment.

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