The Right to Vote-Women and the Men who Love Them

**alevin** · 10-23-2008, 01:25 PM

http://http://www.tsptalk.com/mb/sho...t=6221&page=51

Topic came up over on the PG thread. I've been waiting for appropriate moment to bring up some related history that I received in an email couple weeks ago. Seems like the right moment now that the subject has come up elsewhere, think it deserves its own thread. I totally agree voters need to be informed and use their vote accordingly. Everyone has a vested interest in our nation's government, Women did not obtain the right to vote until 1920. Many died for that right-at the hands of our government. Through the 50's women were encouraged to be stay at home mothers and not work, totally rely on their husbands, who often held property in their names only. We finally started recognizing the economic contributions of stay-at-home wives to the economic welfare of their households and the country only more recently. By property owning criteria, these women still wouldn't have the vote.

WHY WOMEN SHOULD VOTE: this is
not a joke!

My grandmother, one of four sisters to graduate from college in Columbus,
OH .. in a time when it was rare for women to go to college, could not vote until she was in her 40's. She was a practicing architect, along side my grandfather. Mom said that her mom was in total support of voting and
never missed a vote until she passed away. This is very real... not
something "in the past".

Carrie (professional federal geologist)

WHY WOMEN SHOULD VOTE:

This is the story of our Grandmothers and Great-grandmothers;
they lived only 90 years ago.

pic09216.jpg
Remember, it was not until 1920 that women were granted the right to go to the polls and vote.

The women were wives and mothers and unprepared for the fury
that would be unleashed on them. Initially they were jailed for picketing the White House, carrying signs asking for the vote.

By the end of the night, they were fighting for their lives.
Forty prison guards wielding clubs and with their warden's
blessing went on a rampage against the 33 women accused of
'obstructing sidewalk traffic.'

They beat Lucy Burns, chained her hands to the cell bars
above her head and left her hanging for the night, bleeding and
gasping for air.

They hurled Dora Lewis into a dark cell, smashed her
head against an iron bed and knocked her out cold. Her
cellmate, Alice Cosu, thought Lewis was dead and suffered a heart
attack. Additional affidavits describe the guards grabbing, dragging,
beating, choking, slamming, pinching, twisting and kicking
the women.

Thus unfolded the 'Night of Terror' on Nov. 15, 1917,
when the warden at the Occoquan Workhouse in Virginia ordered
his guards to 'teach a lesson' to the suffragists imprisoned
there because they dared to picket Woodrow Wilson's White House for the
right to vote.

For weeks, the women's only water came from an open pail.
Their food--all of it colorless slop--was infested with worms.

When one of the leaders, Alice Paul, embarked on a hunger
strike, they tied her to a chair, forced a tube down her
throat and poured liquid into her until she vomited. She was
tortured like this for weeks until word was smuggled out to the press.

http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/collections/suffrage/nwp/prisoner
s.pdf <
http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/collections/suffrage/nwp/prisoner
s.pdf>
Some women won't vote this year because-
-why, exactly? We have carpool duties? We have to get to
work? Our vote doesn't matter? It's raining? We don't like the candidates on offer?

HBO's movie 'Iron Jawed Angels.' is a graphic depiction of the battle
these women waged so that I could pull the curtain at the polling booth and have my voice heard. I am ashamed to say I needed the reminder.

The actual act of voting had become less personal for me, more
rote. Frankly, voting often felt more like an obligation than a
privilege. Sometimes it was inconvenient.

My friend Wendy, who is my age and studied women's history,
saw the HBO movie, too. When she stopped by my desk to talk
about it, she looked angry. She was--with herself. 'One
thought kept coming back to me as I watched that movie,' she said.
'What would those women think of the way I use, or don't use,
my right to vote? All of us take it for granted now, not just
younger women, but those of us who did seek to learn.' The
right to vote, she said, had become valuable to her 'all over again.'

HBO has released the movie on video and DVD . I wish all
history, social studies and government teachers would include the
movie in their curriculum. I want it shown on Bunco night, too, and
anywhere else women gather. I realize this isn't our usual idea of
socializing, but we are not voting in the numbers that we should be, and I
think a little shock therapy is in order.

It is jarring to watch Woodrow Wilson and his cronies try to
persuade a psychiatrist to declare Alice Paul insane so that
she could be permanently institutionalized. And it is
inspiring to watch the doctor refuse. Alice Paul was strong,
he said, and brave. That didn't make her crazy.

The doctor admonished the men: 'Courage in women is often
mistaken for insanity.'

We need to get out and vote and use this right that was
fought so
hard for by these very courageous women.

Whether you vote democratic, republican or independent party
- remember to vote.

History is being made.

**fabijo** · 10-23-2008, 01:35 PM

Forty prison guards wielding clubs and with their warden's
blessing went on a rampage against the 33 women accused of
'obstructing sidewalk traffic.'

They beat Lucy Burns, chained her hands to the cell bars
above her head and left her hanging for the night, bleeding and
gasping for air.

They hurled Dora Lewis into a dark cell, smashed her
head against an iron bed and knocked her out cold. Her
cellmate, Alice Cosu, thought Lewis was dead and suffered a heart
attack. Additional affidavits describe the guards grabbing, dragging,
beating, choking, slamming, pinching, twisting and kicking
the women.

Thus unfolded the 'Night of Terror' on Nov. 15, 1917,
when the warden at the Occoquan Workhouse in Virginia ordered
his guards to 'teach a lesson' to the suffragists imprisoned
there because they dared to picket Woodrow Wilson's White House for the
right to vote.

and people wonder why someone said, "God bless America? No, God damn America!"

**XL-entLady** · 10-23-2008, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by alevin

Women did not obtain the right to vote until 1920. Many died for that right-at the hands of our government.

Some died at the hands of their families, too. Whenever I think I might be too disgusted or too lazy to vote, I remember the story my grandmother told to impress upon me why I should never take my right to vote for granted. A friend of my grandmother's youth tried to exercise her right to vote and her family locked her in her room without food until she came to her senses. She never left the room alive.

This was less than a century ago. People "knew" that if women thought they had a right to a voice in politics then they must LITERALLY be out of their minds. And some people would rather send their daughters to heaven than to a voting booth.

That's the real reason I make sure that, no matter what, I vote each election. I am honoring the sacrifice of my grandmother's friend.

Lady

**Steadygain** · 10-23-2008, 02:21 PM

I'm with SugarandSpice.

I think we would need a "New Earth" for women to be recognized and valued for all they are worth; (which is the underlying theme of my story for Carrie).

**malyla** · 10-23-2008, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by XL-entLady

That's the real reason I make sure that, no matter what, I vote each election. I am honoring the sacrifice of my grandmother's friend.
Lady

I love and honor my mother and the line of maternal heritage that has made me who I am in this country in this time in history. I also love and acknowledge the positive traits from my father and the paternal heritage I have received. I have always voted in every election except the most local for one reason only. I was taught by both my parents that it was my duty as a citizen of this country to participate in the process since that is the only peaceful way I can influence change. I have always thought that my vote counts even if the system is stacked against the outcome (2000 electoral college results/supreme court decision). My participation in the process allows for the possible peaceful change (and improvement) of the system. This is why I vote. Its my non-violent expression of my duty as a citizen.

I do not advocate the extreme of Robert A. Heinlein's citizenship qualifications from his book Starship Troopers, but I do think that before voting age, everyone should have a citizenship test and automatic registration upon the postive completion of the test (like the DMV driving test at 16 years of age). Schools have been spotty at best in the US history and Civics courses which has left a large and growing number of 'citizens' mentally disenfranchised with the system. This grand experiment of human govenance will only succeed and continue due to the participation of the majority of the citizentry. More education needs to be done on the benefits of citizenship in the USA as opposed to other systems and on how peaceful change is initiated in this system.

So express your citizenship and vote for peaceful change or join the mob for violent change. I will be on the lookout with my shootgun and dog for those who pick the later.

(A Girl and Her Dog - lets see how that movie ends!

)

**Steadygain** · 10-23-2008, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by malyla

I love and honor my mother and the line of maternal heritage that has made me who I am in this country in this time in history. I also love and acknowledge the positive traits from my father and the paternal heritage I have received. I have always voted in every election except the most local for one reason only. I was taught by both my parents that it was my duty as a citizen of this country to participate in the process since that is the only peaceful way I can influence change. I have always thought that my vote counts even if the system is stacked against the outcome (2000 electoral college results/supreme court decision). My participation in the process allows for the possible peaceful change (and improvement) of the system. This is why I vote. Its my non-violent expression of my duty as a citizen.

I do not advocate the extreme of Robert A. Heinlein's citizenship qualifications from his book Starship Troopers, but I do think that before voting age, everyone should have a citizenship test and automatic registration upon the postive completion of the test (like the DMV driving test at 16 years of age). Schools have been spotty at best in the US history and Civics courses which has left a large and growing number of 'citizens' mentally disenfranchised with the system. This grand experiment of human govenance will only succeed and continue due to the participation of the majority of the citizentry. More education needs to be done on the benefits of citizenship in the USA as opposed to other systems and on how peaceful change is initiated in this system.

So express your citizenship and vote for peaceful change or join the mob for violent change. I will be on the lookout with my shootgun and dog for those who pick the later.

(A Girl and Her Dog - lets see how that movie ends!

)

There are many wonderful people on this MB and many express themselves with amazing beauty and style; and I don't mean to take from any of them.....

BUT... This is the most beautiful read I've had the privilege to come upon.

This really speaks wonderfully for you...Thank you.

**mamikin** · 10-23-2008, 03:51 PM

Thank you, Alevin, for posting this thread. I had previously received the "Why Women Should Vote" message and been really touched by it - forwarded on to several of my female friends, but didn't think to post it here! It's really powerful to realize that 80 years ago women in this country did not have the right to vote. Today, even third world countries have had women presidents, but we haven't.

**Steadygain** · 10-23-2008, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by mamikin

Today, even third world countries have had women presidents, but we haven't.

Hi Mamikin,
We are getting closer and closer. Women have largely been overlooked and neglected for ages. Even during my childhood their roles were markedly limited to "a man's world" - but during my life they have increasingly advanced and more than proven themselves. In general men are slower to catch on (but we're getting there) and we're coming to realize that relationships are more important than Power and Wealth. In that sense women have a huge advantage.

**JOVARN** · 10-23-2008, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by Steadygain

I'm with SugarandSpice.

I think we would need a "New Earth" for women to be recognized and valued for all they are worth; (which is the underlying theme of my story for Carrie).

From earlier post.
"We need to get out and vote and use this right that was
fought so hard for by these very courageous women.
Whether you vote democratic, republican or independent party
- remember to vote. "

In modern times, Nurses, Teachers and Secretary’s have always had the ability to swing any election they wanted. The problem is; they spend so much time beating each other up; they failed to organize themselves into a voting block.
Male dominated Government leaders have successfully kept the women’s movement in check by dividing women up. In recent times, the single big issue was (abortion) while you were all beating yourselves up over that one issue, life passed you by. (no pun intended)
During the industrial revolution when your services were needed for the war effort your skills were invaluable. Then what! I want to work no I want to stay home. BLA BLA BLA

When women in strictly female dominated fields were encouraged to join a labor movement, again you were split which lead to a failure to Organize.
Women never quite understood the principle of Unity and strength.

Many years ago I took a course called sexism and Humanities. The lecture material started with the fictional character of Adam and Eve, through hunters and gatherers and so on. That was one of the most enlightening courses I ever took in college. The women in the class sat there with the mouths open (eating Bon Bons) (only kidding) in amazement as they discovered how role development ( I wash the floor, while you watch football) in American society developed.

The mantra of play fair, be nice and don’t rock the boat lead women to where they are today. Some continue to say: “I don’t care who you vote for; just vote!” That will just continue to keep the women’s movement down. Just voting for any candidate will not serve to advance women; that is well documented.
I am convinced, Women make better leaders then men, I am convinced of that after working with them for the past 21 years. Men are driven mostly be their penis and their past experiences in high school and middle school. That’s the reason for so many wars. (Wanted dead or Alive) (I’M a Maverick you betcha Wink Wink, me too).Sound familiar!! Take away the guns and women can meet with any world leader. Hopefully that world leader will blow his brains out after 2 hours. But who cares a win is a win.

Starting planning for 2012 . Get some issues on the table that are common for all women (not ABORTION take that off the table) Think globally, remember McPalin want to open up world markets so they can contract out your jobs (side bar comment)

What destroyed the male dominated labor movement in this country was #1 Regan #2 Union workers carrying too much debt,#3 the republicans pitted white collar workers against blue collar workers now wht collar workers are being laid off (what goes around comes around) #4 Unions failure to adapt to a changing society.

Back to women

Its time that a resurgence of the women’s movement start again. Don’t re-invent the wheel. Organize, Organize, Organize,

**Steadygain** · 10-23-2008, 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by JOVARN

In modern times, Nurses, Teachers and Secretary’s have always had the ability to swing any election they wanted. The problem is; they spend so much time beating each other up; they failed to organize themselves into a voting block.
I'm not sure how to respond to this. A woman is a distinct individual with her own unique characteristics and beliefs.... just like men. They are just as divided on who should be the next president as the rest of us and what issue is most important to one differs from another.

Male dominated Government leaders have successfully kept the women’s movement in check by dividing women up. They have also been kept in check by working for lower pay and doing every bit the work of their counter part males. They have mostly been kept in check for having to assume the jobs of being a fulltime Mother (with all the parental responsibilites) and a fulltime homemaker. In recent times, the single big issue was (abortion) while you were all beating yourselves up over that one issue, life passed you by. (no pun intended)
Life passes them by MAINLY because they are hugely taken for granted; and very few acknowledge the priceless qualities they possess.
During the industrial revolution when your services were needed for the war effort your skills were invaluable. Then what! I want to work no I want to stay home. BLA BLA BLA A woman does a hundred times more than what a man does by being a fulltime mother and homemaker.

When women in strictly female dominated fields were encouraged to join a labor movement, again you were split which lead to a failure to Organize.
Women never quite understood the principle of Unity and strength.
In the Medical Field they are very strongly organized.

Many years ago I took a course called sexism and Humanities. The lecture material started with the fictional character of Adam and Eve, through hunters and gatherers and so on. That was one of the most enlightening courses I ever took in college. The women in the class sat there with the mouths open (eating Bon Bons) (only kidding) in amazement as they discovered how role development ( I wash the floor, while you watch football) in American society developed.

The mantra of play fair, be nice and don’t rock the boat lead women to where they are today. Throughout history women have largely been discounted and it is mainly this repeated mindset generation after generation that has prevented them from having any opportunity to reveal their true value. Some continue to say: “I don’t care who you vote for; just vote!” That will just continue to keep the women’s movement down. Just voting for any candidate will not serve to advance women; that is well documented. Hum was just about to say something BUT fortunately read the next part.

I am convinced, Women make better leaders then men, I am convinced of that after working with them for the past 21 years. Men are driven mostly be their penis and their past experiences in high school and middle school. Thanks you had me going for a while.
That’s the reason for so many wars. (Wanted dead or Alive) (I’M a Maverick you betcha Wink Wink, me too).Sound familiar!! Take away the guns and women can meet with any world leader. Hopefully that world leader will blow his brains out after 2 hours. But who cares a win is a win.

Starting planning for 2012 . Get some issues on the table that are common for all women (not ABORTION take that off the table) Think globally, remember McPalin want to open up world markets so they can contract out your jobs (side bar comment)

What destroyed the male dominated labor movement in this country was #1 Regan #2 Union workers carrying too much debt,#3 the republicans pitted white collar workers against blue collar workers now wht collar workers are being laid off (what goes around comes around) #4 Unions failure to adapt to a changing society.

Back to women

Its time that a resurgence of the women’s movement start again. Don’t re-invent the wheel. Organize, Organize, Organize,

Well - that was quite a bit to throw out - but hey that's cool

Don't be surprized if one or two women find your comments a little demeaning. Personally I have found over the past 21 years that women are the last ones you want to get in an argument with.

**malyla** · 10-23-2008, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by JOVARN

Starting planning for 2012 . Get some issues on the table that are common for all women (not ABORTION take that off the table) Think globally, remember McPalin want to open up world markets so they can contract out your jobs (side bar comment)

This radio broadcast that I happen to catch while driving around Atlanta in 2004 put the abortion issue to rest for me. It was logical and moral. I do not want to start an idealogical argument here. Just wanted to share the source of my closure on this issue - reproduction rights. For me this is no longer an issue and may explain why it hasn't been that big an issue this election. I really liked the perpective of why a man cares about reproductive rights enouph to want to control women to the extent that they can (paternaty uncertainty - catchy). It was a light bulb moment.

http://forum.wgbh.org/wgbh/forum.php?lecture_id=1430

More info on who is Alexander Sanger can be found here http://www.alexandersanger.com/bio.html

The link to the radio forum from his blog is here http://www.alexandersanger.com/blog_..._01_index.html

**JOVARN** · 10-23-2008, 07:30 PM

My intent was not to offend anyone. I apologize in advance if I did .
Steady Gain I sincerely agree with you comments.
To be honest I wasn't really thrilled with Hillary Clinton, but I just can’t quite put my finger on why. I think if she divorced Bill I may have had more respect for her. Should that matter?
If Palin wasn't so ill prepared for the Job I would have voted for her but she is way to far out there for me.
I think the real Palin is the one who did the Catie Curric interview. Plus she has failed to grow in her role over the past weeks which leads me to believe she is not a quick study.

I look forward to reading Malylas' references