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Thread: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

  1. #121

    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by burrocrat View Post
    good one. dang, i was hoping you would go for the deal.

    what you got to complain about then?

    you got a spot at this fire.

    seriously, i appreciate your service, thank you.

    haha i'm not complaining i'm just saying that i think you guys get paid alot already on top of that SOME people getting ridiculous bonus, so i dont know why you guys are worried about pay

    myself i am an E-5 getting pay about 3800 a paycheck before tax (its not hard to look it up so i dont mind sharing), living by myself in maryland is Just enough to survive i'm sure all those FBI, CIA and NSA employee are either making more if not double what i make plus getting the benefit that the company give them as far as retirement benefit, so whats all the problem? honestly i'm just trying to understand what's going on here, not trying to make anyone mad so please spare me

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  3. #122

    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
    While everything is frozen?..I find that hard to believe.. and if you think the Government employee is overpaid..please do not ever become one..this may help out the ones that appreciate their Civil service employment and maybe get a percent or two increase next year to help keep pace with cost of living and inflation..
    you dont have to believe me, even i wouldnt believe it if i dint hear it myself, sometimes i wish i dint re-enlist and just become a civilian, i dont have two boss to cater to :P and if bonus flying around like that, i be rich! lol

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  5. #123

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    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    I sincerely doubt ANYONE is making $100K bonuses.

    In my agency, each year about 15% of people got a bonus the last few years. I saw the data myself. The average bonus was about $600 a person if they were in HQ's in DC, about $500 if they worked in a regional office, and about $450 if they worked in the field. That's it. And only about 15% of people got one.

    No, no one makes $100 K bonuses. I'd like to see the agency who pays that- cause I don't believe it exists.

  6.  
  7. #124

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    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    And the point I was ticked off about is this- the FERS system is FULLY FUNDED- there is no shortage in the FERS retirement fund. The fund is paid for out of current workers contributions, and a small contribution by the Federal Government.

    And then here comes this idiot along with a meat clever, saying he wants to cut FERS pensions entirely.

    It's not only bad policy- it's just plain WRONG.

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  9. #125

    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by law87 View Post
    you dont have to believe me, even i wouldnt believe it if i dint hear it myself, sometimes i wish i dint re-enlist and just become a civilian, i dont have two boss to cater to :P and if bonus flying around like that, i be rich! lol
    It's not that I don't believe you..I find it hard to believe any kind of bonuses of that size is being handed out to GOV employees right now..

    When you say 'GOV employees are overpaid'..that is a pretty broad brush stroke you are painting...I will agree some are overpaid for the little they do and there is a lot of dead wood in the Goverment rank and files..But a vast majority of the GOV employees are not overpaid, in fact they are sub-par from the private sector..they earn and work hard for what they get..usually after many years of school and dedication to their jobs..so be careful when you pin the tail on all of the donkies.
    A wise man speaks when he has something to say...A FOOL speaks when he just has to say something

  10.  
  11. #126

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    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by law87 View Post
    haha i'm not complaining i'm just saying that i think you guys get paid alot already on top of that SOME people getting ridiculous bonus, so i dont know why you guys are worried about pay

    myself i am an E-5 getting pay about 3800 a paycheck before tax (its not hard to look it up so i dont mind sharing), living by myself in maryland is Just enough to survive i'm sure all those FBI, CIA and NSA employee are either making more if not double what i make plus getting the benefit that the company give them as far as retirement benefit, so whats all the problem? honestly i'm just trying to understand what's going on here, not trying to make anyone mad so please spare me
    Law,

    Just remember a lot of us were E5's when we got out and had to get at least 2 year of college befor entering at a good level. The hireing freeze of 85 and 94 stopped a lot of entry level employees. With a big switch over to civilian contractors about 1990 about 90% of entry level employees saw a lot of their jobs go to contract. IE: vehicle maintance, grounds keepers, lower secretarial work, electricians, elevator repair, building repair, plumbers and so on. What was left were mainly white colar workers, managers, electronic technicians, engineers and people with clearences. This caused civil service to have the mid to high range salaries with lower salary jobs being contracted out. This was mainly what I saw and in 85 GI's used the GI Bill until the job situation got better. Lucky you didn't get out right now and while your in or if you do get out later get some schooling in IT, electronics, mathmatics, physics, or engineering and keep you nose clean if you want to go the goverment route.

    Thanks for your service, because of you and those like you I can enjoy my freedom and my retirement. I was a two term soldier and server 8 years army.
    Don't bias your charts. Show support and resistance. My comments and charts are not trading recommendations.


  12.  
  13. #127

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    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by law87 View Post
    i think you guys get paid alot already
    Quote Originally Posted by law87 View Post
    myself i am an E-5 getting pay about 3800 a paycheck before tax
    The "paycheck" you say you receive is more than what a GS-12 step 7 receives based on 2011 pay scales and incorporating the Locality pay for DC-MD-VA-WV-PA (you said you were living in MD).
    While not quite an apples to apples comparison, you can think of “Steps” as “time in service” for the Military. (Actually it would be the same as time in pay grade if such a thing existed for military pay.)
    Just like Military pay and benefits, Federal Civilian pay and benefits are all online for everyone to see.

    If I was to figure in Military Medical, Dental, Commissary, Exchange, and MWR benefits and I believe you move up into the realm of GS-13 or 14. We all (Military and Federal Civilians) work in different places doing different jobs. But our pay is standardized for the most part. Where I presently work, most (not all) of the people at the GS-13/14 pay levels have Masters or PhD level educations. Where I work is not the same as everywhere else, but it exists all the same

    Here is another comparison that may help give insight to the Federal pay system. Look at the back of your ID card. Your Geneva Convention category is II (Non-commissioned Officer/Staff Non-commissioned Office). That is for E-5/E-6 or GS-5/GS-6. A GS-12 is a IV (Field Grade Officer). That is an O-4/W-4 for military comparison. On a Naval ship the GS-12 will normally eat in the Wardroom.

    I'm just a Ret. Navy Chief trying to help you understand that you cannot correctly generalize the Federal Civilian work force based on your limited experience of it so far. I would argue you couldn’t generalize it at all. But everyone does to suit his or her agenda. Your making conclusions based on limited analysis. Just like I did above, based on your pay check. Should some SES and GS’s be fired or are some individuals overpaid? Of course. The Navy doesn’t have exclusive rights to the dirtbags or malingerers of the world. Just as the Navy doesn’t have exclusive rights to hardworking, dedicated people. And just because someone has an education does not exclude them from either of the above categories.

    Another thing to ponder. Your benefits, whether used or not, are used to calculate your overall pay by the bean counters and anybody else who want’s to cut (or improve) your pay and benefits. I know it used to **** me off in my early Navy days when the Chief or Divo would spout off about how much I really made. ‘Cuz I sure wasn’t seeing it in my paycheck.

    I did not even touch on the retirement package. As someone who has recently retired from the Military, I can say from my perspective and research the Military retirement package is far better than the Federal civilian package (FERS). However, the majority of the Federal Civilian work force does not volunteer to go in harms way (but some do). Again, generalizations shouldn’t be applied as it can also be argued that not every retired service member was in harms way during their career.
    In the end, I think Congress pays the Military and Federal civilians the minimum amount that is needed to achieve the end state they are after. The problem is they can’t figure out what end state they are after!

    To close this long-winded diatribe I would say, be very careful when you read, watch, or hear some generalized statement or “fact”. Scuttlebutt fits in here too.
    Need an attainable goal? Try honesty.

  14.  
  15. #128

    Join Date
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    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    I'd like to add that a big win for our current contract negotiations was to bring back a sizeable portion of outsourced jobs to bargaining personnel, as many times it was proven to have been more expensive and/or so loosely tracked that it ended up costing as much or more than having employees do the work.
    This stirring up the public ire @ gov't workers is a smokescreen, but will the average Joe call out the congress on their own hypocrisy?


  16.  
  17. #129

    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Lostdawg View Post
    The "paycheck" you say you receive is more than what a GS-12 step 7 receives based on 2011 pay scales and incorporating the Locality pay for DC-MD-VA-WV-PA (you said you were living in MD).
    While not quite an apples to apples comparison, you can think of “Steps” as “time in service” for the Military. (Actually it would be the same as time in pay grade if such a thing existed for military pay.)
    Just like Military pay and benefits, Federal Civilian pay and benefits are all online for everyone to see.

    If I was to figure in Military Medical, Dental, Commissary, Exchange, and MWR benefits and I believe you move up into the realm of GS-13 or 14. We all (Military and Federal Civilians) work in different places doing different jobs. But our pay is standardized for the most part. Where I presently work, most (not all) of the people at the GS-13/14 pay levels have Masters or PhD level educations. Where I work is not the same as everywhere else, but it exists all the same

    Here is another comparison that may help give insight to the Federal pay system. Look at the back of your ID card. Your Geneva Convention category is II (Non-commissioned Officer/Staff Non-commissioned Office). That is for E-5/E-6 or GS-5/GS-6. A GS-12 is a IV (Field Grade Officer). That is an O-4/W-4 for military comparison. On a Naval ship the GS-12 will normally eat in the Wardroom.

    I'm just a Ret. Navy Chief trying to help you understand that you cannot correctly generalize the Federal Civilian work force based on your limited experience of it so far. I would argue you couldn’t generalize it at all. But everyone does to suit his or her agenda. Your making conclusions based on limited analysis. Just like I did above, based on your pay check. Should some SES and GS’s be fired or are some individuals overpaid? Of course. The Navy doesn’t have exclusive rights to the dirtbags or malingerers of the world. Just as the Navy doesn’t have exclusive rights to hardworking, dedicated people. And just because someone has an education does not exclude them from either of the above categories.

    Another thing to ponder. Your benefits, whether used or not, are used to calculate your overall pay by the bean counters and anybody else who want’s to cut (or improve) your pay and benefits. I know it used to **** me off in my early Navy days when the Chief or Divo would spout off about how much I really made. ‘Cuz I sure wasn’t seeing it in my paycheck.

    I did not even touch on the retirement package. As someone who has recently retired from the Military, I can say from my perspective and research the Military retirement package is far better than the Federal civilian package (FERS). However, the majority of the Federal Civilian work force does not volunteer to go in harms way (but some do). Again, generalizations shouldn’t be applied as it can also be argued that not every retired service member was in harms way during their career.
    In the end, I think Congress pays the Military and Federal civilians the minimum amount that is needed to achieve the end state they are after. The problem is they can’t figure out what end state they are after!

    To close this long-winded diatribe I would say, be very careful when you read, watch, or hear some generalized statement or “fact”. Scuttlebutt fits in here too.



    looks more like GS-9 at step 4 whatever that means.

    you got me on the medicare chief, lol i forgot about that.

    haha i hope no one get offend off at me for this, it just i'm a little pissed off that day when i heard a civilian goverment worker getting a large bonus for something that he really doesnt do, its the military that keep track of it and we just report to him, again thanks for the explanation.

  18.  
  19. #130

    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    [QUOTE=Show-me;306667]Makes no matter look at your history. When we got into budget trouble back in the day CSRS was axed as a budget money saver and replaced with half a pension, SSI and a employee contributions to TSP. Thus, the two tiered retirement system we have now.

    That hit the nail right on the head. That old snake charmer Ronald Reagan and his crew had to save social security way back in the dark ages of the 1980's and ruined a perfectly functional self sufficient retirement system to do it ( CSRS). They came up with FERS which dumped all those new federal employees into the SS pool. Now that the vultures he created (and I don't mean FERS participants) have come home to roost 30 years later they want to "stick-it-to-us" all over again and blame it on us all the while. Boy oh boy what a sleight of hand, Houdini would be proud. As for those $100K bonus's give me a break. I'm sure it happens occasionally but as a matter of routine, please.............. .
    The joke's over and I am outa there. Now someone else can save the world. Somebody please remind my rich uncle not to forget his end of the deal

  20.  
  21. #131

    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    [QUOTE=driz;306730]
    Quote Originally Posted by Show-me View Post
    Makes no matter look at your history. When we got into budget trouble back in the day CSRS was axed as a budget money saver and replaced with half a pension, SSI and a employee contributions to TSP. Thus, the two tiered retirement system we have now.

    That hit the nail right on the head. That old snake charmer Ronald Reagan and his crew had to save social security way back in the dark ages of the 1980's and ruined a perfectly functional self sufficient retirement system to do it ( CSRS). They came up with FERS which dumped all those new federal employees into the SS pool. Now that the vultures he created (and I don't mean FERS participants) have come home to roost 30 years later they want to "stick-it-to-us" all over again and blame it on us all the while. Boy oh boy what a sleight of hand, Houdini would be proud. As for those $100K bonus's give me a break. I'm sure it happens occasionally but as a matter of routine, please.............. .
    Well said....I remember back then, they sent around counselors (for a lack of better names) to try and get us CSRS folks to convert to FERS...unbelievably, several in my unit did..But I had reservations and stuck with CSRS..I'm so happy I did now...Then came core comp..and I dodged that bullet too.
    A wise man speaks when he has something to say...A FOOL speaks when he just has to say something

  22.  
  23. #132

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    Default Re: Republican plan to cut Federal Workers, Pay, Retirement

    That should be criminal to talk people out of CSRS. Of course selling a bill of goods to the ignorant masses has been the basis's of capitalism for decades. Look a ethanol. lol
    Socrates: "Democracy, which is a charming form of government, full of variety and disorder, and dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequaled alike."

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