Thread: PG&E Customer Revolt May Threaten Rollout of Obama’s Smart Grid

I was planning to have new heatpumps installed last fall, but when I read the fine print I discovered "smart" thermostats were part of the package-they would routinely make temp changes up AND down that I didn't ask them to make on my behalf-changes I didn't agree with and wouldn't want any part of. I pretty much walked away because the installation company wouldn't give me a straight answer about substituting a type of thermostat I would prefer. Decided I'd try again this next year with a different company, AFTER I get the new roof on.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123266431226307785.html

Under the plan, utilities are guaranteed enough revenue to make a profit, no matter how much electricity customers use. If demand comes up short, customers would pay a higher rate to cover the shortfall. In a conventional rate scheme, the utility takes a loss when demand falls short.
"The last thing in the world I would think we want to do is do all these great energy efficiency ideas and actually get people consuming less electricity and then not have their costs go down," said Rep. Joe Barton, R-Texas, who failed to kill a measure that would give extra grant money to states that seek to implement a decoupling program.


the people got the liberal godless leaders they voted for.
Liberalism is a mental disease. Savage

Having worked for a major utility for 7 years, it was always a known fact, that by law, they always produce a profit, because of the necessity of having electric power is so entwined in our economy.

Sometimes it's best to leave well enough alone or at least look at all sides of any major change, very carefully and don't have some knee jerk reaction to special interest groups or the sexy crisis of the day. ie Health Care.

Example - states continue to raise gas taxes as cars become more effecient and use less gas, but the states must replace the lost revenue and governments continue to increase in size.

Originally Posted by CountryBoy

Example - states continue to raise gas taxes as cars become more effecient and use less gas, but the states must replace the lost revenue and governments continue to increase in size.

another ex. is the states are putting the so called rain grooves in certain hwys for your safety. Actually they increase thread squirm which increases tire wear and reduces mpg. need to buy tires sooner, taxes collected, need to buy more gas, more taxes collected. and less safe duw to less tire tread to road surface contact, less traction in a braking situation.
the people in power care nothing about efficiency, there is no oil shortage, 14.7:1 air/fuel ratio, waste gallons of gas, a car is running this rich only so that cat will work for cleaner air. The epa is ruining this country and sending jobs overseas. the commies are in the epa.
"The Greening" is correct.

Originally Posted by Valkyrie

another ex. is the states are putting the so called rain grooves in certain hwys for your safety. Actually they increase thread squirm which increases tire wear and reduces mpg. need to buy tires sooner, taxes collected, need to buy more gas, more taxes collected. and less safe duw to less tire tread to road surface contact, less traction in a braking situation.
the people in power care nothing about efficiency, there is no oil shortage, 14.7:1 air/fuel ratio, waste gallons of gas, a car is running this rich only so that cat will work for cleaner air. The epa is ruining this country and sending jobs overseas. the commies are in the epa.
"The Greening" is correct.

Yeah, the epa is going to run the jobs out this country and then the greenies will whine.

Listen to this, here in Ohio a big northern utility, First Energy, passed out those curlie energy efficient light bulbs to there customers (not at the request of the customers) and then tried to pass on the cost of the bulbs and delivery to the customers and also went before the Public Service commision asking for an increase in rates based on the money they'd lose from folks using less energy.

Luckily the they got such bad press, that they crawfished on the whole deal, but they'll be back, I'm sure.

Originally Posted by CountryBoy

Example - states continue to raise gas taxes as cars become more effecient and use less gas, but the states must replace the lost revenue and governments continue to increase in size.

Thats why targeted taxes don't work. Sin Taxes or anything else they want to call it.
Figure out what you need and collect the taxes (Nontargeted). If you collect more than you need give it back. If you're squeazing me to hard I'll let you know. If you're abusing us we'll throw you out and elect someone else. Not sure what is so hard about it

Next year might be a better idea...only in the fact you may receive a tax break for changing your fuel output. Just an idea!

...reminds me of a place called Rogers, AR. The townsfolk worked hard and did their part in conserving water this past year - then the water co. had to ask for increase in rates cuz the townfolks were doing so well during the draught! So the lake was saved, but paid cash to do it.

There's Smart Grid, and there's Depend Blindly on Technology. This is Depend Blindly on Technology. This is not Smart Grid. Yes, it does cost money to provide electricity, whether from solar, wind, coal, oil, or garbage fumes (methane) and this should be accounted for. But effective metering is subject to good Calibration and Checking - if you just blindly depend on the meter, it's garbage in, garbage out. If the meter is on your air conditioner, and if you get a crazy answer on how much the power is costing you, you'd look at the air conditioner, and the meter. Same with a smart meter at the utility level, you'd find out what the problem is after seeing the data.

But just installing a meter and using that output without finding out if the meter's readings are for real, or if there is some problem with the electrical system at the customer's house, or if he's got an old computer that is eating up electricty while he sleeps, or a leaky window...this is garbage in garbage out. It does absolutely zero for efficiency. PG and E may be making this part of their new electricity package, but I've seen plenty of Smart Grid projects that don't include this misuse of meter technology - so the revolt doesn't mean the entire Grid is in danger. It's actually good if this kind of misuse gets press.

They really don't need a meter on everyone house in the USA to regulate the GRID! They already know how much energy is used down to the town, city, county and state, so why monitor each households energy use so meticulously? CAP and TAX at the customer level, use more, pay more and it's automatic!! Lovely, just Lovely!

You're right, they don't. The metering is supposed to be at the Utility level: to even out spikes and lulls in power - especially from intermittent power sources like wind and solar, and at the Consumer Level to see what price they would get from running their dishwasher at different hours and where their electricty eaters are located. Blindly using some metered data for billing without eyes on checking and meter calibration, and finding out how to improve energy efficiency (to bring down your bills and energy use) is not Smart, it's just Lazy. It appears this is just PG and E and not every house in the U.S., I don't think the US is really interested in tracking and billing all the electricity use at the house level - impossible anyway with the way our electricity system is set up - in the end it's all local.